Author Topic: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy  (Read 3083 times)

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Offline Machiavelli

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Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« on: August 11, 2018, 09:49:45 pm »
Jonah Goldberg
National Review
August 9, 2018

Quote
How a 1980s sci-fi flick became an inspiration for Marxist tracts

‘I have come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass. And I’m all out of bubblegum.”

It’s one of my favorite movie lines of all time, but there are other reasons I love John Carpenter’s sci-fi action movie They Live, which celebrates its 30th anniversary later this year. Starring the 1980s professional wrestler “Rowdy” Roddy Piper, it is one of the best B-movies of the era. Kurt Russell was supposed to play the lead role, but Carpenter felt that after directing so many Russell vehicles, he should go with someone else. When Carpenter, a wrestling fan, saw Piper’s bravura performance in Wrestlemania III, he had found his man.

I have watched They Live many times since it first came out. But it was only a few years ago that I learned it’s also a timeless piece of Marxist propaganda.

This is not the observation of a cranky right-winger seeing Commies under every bed. This is the considered opinion of numerous Marxist, neo-Marxist, and coffee-house-Marxist commentators.

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Offline skeeter

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #1 on: August 11, 2018, 09:53:28 pm »
Jonah Goldberg is easily entertained. I found that movie dumb.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #2 on: August 11, 2018, 10:01:56 pm »
I've never heard of it. 

Offline Machiavelli

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2018, 10:11:11 pm »
I saw the movie when it first came out. I liked it as silly fun. Shortly thereafter, I learned that it was an attack on Reaganomics.

Offline endicom

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2018, 10:34:48 pm »

Jonah was there to chew bubblegum and kick ass. And he was all out of ass.


Offline goatprairie

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2018, 03:41:46 am »
Jonah Goldberg is easily entertained. I found that movie dumb.
It was interesting starting out.  And then Piper put on the glasses and all the messages on the billboards were revealed.
My first thoughts were on the line of "oh, good grief, it's an anti-capitalism/consumerism flick."
And I was a Democrat at the time. But I was quite sick of liberals moaning about Reaganomics and the so-called "Me Decade" of the eighties.
As if Hollyweird libs like Carpenter weren't crawling over each other to accumulate as money and goodies as they possibly could.
 I wonder if Carpenter lives in a  hut/shack/tent or some other rude hovel to commiserate with the masses. I'm betting not.

Offline goatprairie

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2018, 03:48:59 am »
John Carpenter's lowly hovel in Hollywood. Look at those tiny houses....just nothing but lean-tos.

Offline Absalom

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2018, 04:11:28 am »
Never heard of either the movie or story but I have heard of Goldberg.
In my judgement, he is another of the neo-con (men) gang, which includes Kristol,
Podhoretz and many others at the Nat'l Review, Weekley Standard and Commentary.
These are the offspring of post WW1 Russian Jewish Marxists who lectured at NYC
Universities; all devotees of Leon Trotsky (real name Davidovish Bronstein).
This offspring evolved and morphed in time but never lost touch w/their radical
roots, which is apparent in their politics and the ideas they promote.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2018, 04:29:33 am »
Never heard of either the movie or story but I have heard of Goldberg.
In my judgement, he is another of the neo-con (men) gang, which includes Kristol,
Podhoretz and many others at the Nat'l Review, Weekley Standard and Commentary.
These are the offspring of post WW1 Russian Jewish Marxists who lectured at NYC
Universities; all devotees of Leon Trotsky (real name Davidovish Bronstein).
This offspring evolved and morphed in time but never lost touch w/their radical
roots, which is apparent in their politics and the ideas they promote.

Jonah Goldberg is the son of Lucianne Goldberg of "Lucianne".  He is a solid, thinking conservative and all around good guy.  I have no idea if his family was originally Russian, but he (and his mother) is an American.

Offline Absalom

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2018, 05:00:40 am »
Jonah Goldberg is the son of Lucianne Goldberg of "Lucianne".  He is a solid, thinking conservative and all around good guy.  I have no idea if his family was originally Russian, but he (and his mother) is an American.
---------------------------------
Goldberg is no more a principled conservative than Herbert Hoover
or George Bush was.
Suggest you lose the sentimental malarkey about these neo-cons
and get real about these frauds and hustlers.


Offline Sanguine

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2018, 01:47:55 pm »
---------------------------------
Goldberg is no more a principled conservative than Herbert Hoover
or George Bush was.
Suggest you lose the sentimental malarkey about these neo-cons
and get real about these frauds and hustlers.

Bullshit.  I suggest you loose the "neo-con" dog whistle real quick. 

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2018, 01:53:51 pm »
---------------------------------
Goldberg is no more a principled conservative than Herbert Hoover
or George Bush was.
Suggest you lose the sentimental malarkey about these neo-cons
and get real about these frauds and hustlers.

@Absalom

Can you give me a list of three writers/pundits such as Jonah Goldberg whom you see as principled conservatives? 
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline Machiavelli

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2018, 04:51:51 pm »
I suggest you loose the "neo-con" dog whistle real quick.

@Absalom

I agree with @Sanguine. Your posts on this thread are dangerously close to being anti-Semitic. Please drop the neocon stuff immediately.



Offline andy58-in-nh

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2018, 05:14:47 pm »
@Absalom

I agree with @Sanguine. Your posts on this thread are dangerously close to being anti-Semitic. Please drop the neocon stuff immediately.

I agree.

There has been a rather consistent use of that term over time by those who fancy themselves "Paleocons" or American nationalists, and always in conjunction with Jewish conservative intellectuals.

And frequently, one can find an accompanying implication of disloyalty to America, either in the form of suggested Jewish adherence to a foreign ideology, or by their implied superior loyalty to the state of Israel.

Both Paul Craig Roberts and Pat Buchanan, to name but two commentators, are frequent sources of this line of argument.

It is wrong, it is despicable, and it poorly serves the cause of constitutional conservatism.

Honorable and honest people can and do differ on a host of political issues, and this is no less true on the Right than it is on the Left.

For his part, Jonah Goldberg is a witty, thoughtful, knowledgeable and intelligent man who loves America dearly and obviously believes in its foundational principles, as even a cursory reading of his large body of work will attest.

He deserves better than to be slandered by narrow-minded nativists who are largely informed by willful ignorance, unfounded suspicion and racialist sympathies.     
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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2018, 05:31:49 pm »
It is wrong, it is despicable, and it poorly serves the cause of constitutional conservatism.

Thanks for opening my eyes!  I never gave much thought to the connection between using the term "Neocon" and Jew-bashing.  I'm not Jewish, but I detest antisemitism.
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #15 on: August 12, 2018, 06:32:13 pm »
@Absalom

Can you give me a list of three writers/pundits such as Jonah Goldberg whom you see as principled conservatives?
----------------------------------------
Victor Davis Hanson
Mark Levin
Thomas Sowell

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #16 on: August 12, 2018, 06:35:05 pm »
----------------------------------------
Victor Davis Hanson
Mark Levin
Thomas Sowell

Interesting, as VDH is a neoconservative.
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Offline goatprairie

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #17 on: August 12, 2018, 06:45:28 pm »
---------------------------------
Goldberg is no more a principled conservative than Herbert Hoover
or George Bush was.
Suggest you lose the sentimental malarkey about these neo-cons
and get real about these frauds and hustlers.
Have you ever read anything by Goldberg? If you haven't (and it sounds like you haven't), you could start with his book about the origins of American liberalism/progressivism called "Liberal Fascism." It's one of the best conservative books of the last half century.

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2018, 07:00:00 pm »
Interesting, as VDH is a neoconservative.

He calls himself one.  The problem arises when people call other "neoconservative.  Over the years, it's become a dogwhistle used by antisemitics.
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2018, 07:02:38 pm »
@Absalom

I agree with @Sanguine. Your posts on this thread are dangerously close to being anti-Semitic. Please drop the neocon stuff immediately.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
For the record, my wife is Jewish and neither of us are Anti-Semites.
Since this is a discussion forum, I was expressing an opinion, not
intended to slander Goldberg.
As requested, will drop the neo-con label since it offends.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2018, 07:12:01 pm by Mod1 »

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2018, 07:40:30 pm »
----------------------------------------
Victor Davis Hanson
Mark Levin
Thomas Sowell

 888high58888
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #21 on: August 12, 2018, 07:43:21 pm »
He calls himself one.  The problem arises when people call other "neoconservative.  Over the years, it's become a dogwhistle used by antisemitics.

Always thought 'neocon' meant, sort of like "new money'... up and coming generations...never Jewish.

WTF do I know?    (that's rhetorical)   :laugh:
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - David Burge (Iowahawk)

"It was only a sunny smile, and little it cost in the giving, but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living" F. Scott Fitzgerald

Offline Machiavelli

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #22 on: August 12, 2018, 07:43:40 pm »
@Cyber Liberty
@Absalom

I'm not saying that we should ban the use of the word neocon. It depends on how it's used. Context is everything.

Absalom, my late wife was a Jew too.  happy77

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #23 on: August 12, 2018, 07:50:39 pm »
Always thought 'neocon' meant, sort of like "new money'... up and coming generations...never Jewish.

WTF do I know?    (that's rhetorical)   :laugh:

That's what I thought too...never associated it with Jewish faith.
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Offline skeeter

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Re: Jonah Goldberg: Farce as Tragedy
« Reply #24 on: August 12, 2018, 07:52:57 pm »
He calls himself one.  The problem arises when people call other "neoconservative.  Over the years, it's become a dogwhistle used by antisemitics.

I always considered 'neoconservative' as referring to those classic democrats who, seeing the political handwriting on the wall, joined the 'conservative movement' in the wake of Reagan's obvious success.

They were especially impressed by his muscular foreign policy. The other distinguishing characteristic they share is they kept most of their socially liberal proclivities, unfortunately, and have always disliked 'paleocons'.

The fact that many who met this description were of jewish heritage was incidental.

I realize others have used the term as an antisemetic dog whistle, though, so I avoid use of the term.