Author Topic: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity  (Read 2716 times)

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Offline musiclady

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #75 on: February 22, 2018, 03:03:08 am »
"But I do understand that in order for you to win the debate here, given that I am giving truthful information about my family, that you have to imply that either they are not truthful, or that I am mistaken.  You have forced yourself into arguing this from a position of weakness and not strength."

Just more assumptions. I didn't imply your son wasn't truthful, you obviously took it that way and keep expanding on it. You assume you know everything about your son. You don't. Just because you don't know everything about him doesn't mean anyone was being dishonest or dishonorable. All I said was to ask him and find out. I didn't imply or even slightly suggest he would lie about it. Simply to ask and find out what you may not know. But you took it way beyond what I said - making it an emotional response that you are certain is implying this and that - which was never said. It isn't even possible in your mind that you don't know everything about your son. And that's putting it very kindly. And in addition you not knowing everything doesn't make you a liar nor did I ever suggest that. Your responses are filled with assumptions all the way to including your husband's character and me attacking it some how. You are simply looking at whatever is said on this subject in the worst possible light and lashing out.

Actually, I'm not doing any of those things, but as I said in my last post....

Peace.

Our whole culture is broken because we have thrown out everything that keeps it together.  There is absolutely nothing "toxic" about true masculinity, but as I have said repeatedly, on topic, btw, masculinity doesn't fit into a little box, and the greatest sign of strength in men can be gentleness.

One more time for good measure........... boys are unique creations of a Holy and Awesome God, and they do not all behave the same way...... nor SHOULD they.

I'm sorry that some can't, or just don't want to, accept that basic Biblical truth.

Culture is broken, but it is also a sign of brokenness that some are excusing violent behavior in boys (or excusing immoral behavior, as has been done before on this forum), and claiming that it's just the way boys are made.

2nd Corinthians 5:17  - Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, the new creation has come: the old has gone, the new is here!

We are not bound to behave badly because it is our "nature."  It doesn't matter that for some boys, violence is "natural."

There is a way out, and that way is Christ Jesus.

@DB
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #76 on: February 22, 2018, 03:48:00 am »
I largely agree with what you said.
But defense falls almost entirely upon the man.
It's fine to pontificate in hallowed halls and all, but it is true without a doubt that a woman will be safer hanging onto the arm of a man, and the bigger and badder the man, the more that applies... If for no other reason than the bare fact that his presence discourages the opportunist inclinations of criminals (almost always men themselves). The risk v reward ratio plummets.

So it is that men are encouraged to fight. So it is that women instinctively look for protective ability in a man. It's all instinctive.  And beyond all the feminist  rhetoric, instinct remains, even yet. And yes, the sexes are profoundly different.

Maybe it's the cowboy way that has so effected me. I was raised up not to hit girls, to help girls as the weaker sex, to treat men squarely,  and to rise to defend those that can't defend themselves (which invariably and primarily includes women).

And that big Bailey hat, big silver buckle, and shitkickers turns me into a walking billboard for women. It's been that way all my life.  Whenever a woman has need, she comes arunnin to find a big, strong, redneck boy. Whether to tote something heavy, or get directions, or get her car fixed, or stand directly in the way of whatever is scaring her, she knows that boy will do. Many's the time I have stood in the way of it for a woman... A woman I don't even know.

The conversation on this page and in this forum generally since the Moore debacle makes me regret that profoundly...

@roamer_1 I think I have some understanding of what you're saying.  Bottom line is boys that have never fought don't know how to fight if/when the need arises.  That is true for any skill that a person may need.

I am truly sorry that some women here have made you regret taking on the responsibility you have.  The role of protector is important and I appreciate you and all the other men that understand that importance.

I have an acquaintance that honestly believes that eating meat creates aggressive men.  There's some phrase she uses for it that makes my eyes glass over; I can't remember it, probably "meat aggression" or some other such nonsense.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #77 on: February 22, 2018, 03:54:11 am »
@RoosGirl

Some women HERE??  Who?

No one is diminishing the male instinct to protect.  It is not at all the same thing as the instinct to solve problems with violence.

That's not what ANYTHING I've said is about.  If anyone..........ANYONE........... interprets what I've said as diminishing men's desire to protect women, they have misread badly.

btw, I don't think @roamer_1 needs your protection here. I have a great deal of respect for him.  We just disagree on this subject.  Almost nothing else.

I can disagree with folks and still be friends.  I hope @roamer_1 can too.

(And you too, @DB ).   

I don't want to make enemies because I believe I have more respect for men than some do for themselves.......
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #78 on: February 22, 2018, 03:56:24 am »
@RoosGirl

Some women HERE??  Who?

No one is diminishing the male instinct to protect.  It is not at all the same thing as the instinct to solve problems with violence.

That's not what ANYTHING I've said is about.  If anyone..........ANYONE........... interprets what I've said as diminishing men's desire to protect women, they have misread badly.

btw, I don't think @roamer_1 needs your protection here. I have a great deal of respect for him.  We just disagree on this subject.  Almost nothing else.

I can disagree with folks and still be friends.  I hope @roamer_1 can too.

(And you too, @DB ).   

I don't want to make enemies because I believe I have more respect for men than some do for themselves.......

I wasn't talking about you.  I know at least one person that I believe roamer was referring to and that's who I was talking about.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #79 on: February 22, 2018, 04:00:57 am »
I wasn't talking about you.  I know at least one person that I believe roamer was referring to and that's who I was talking about.

Whew........... OK.  Thanks!

I didn't think my communication skills were THAT bad!  ^-^
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Online roamer_1

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #80 on: February 22, 2018, 11:08:37 pm »
@roamer_1 I think I have some understanding of what you're saying.  Bottom line is boys that have never fought don't know how to fight if/when the need arises.  That is true for any skill that a person may need.

@RoosGirl

That's right. Boys tussle. It's what they do - As a father to two sons, and a grandfather to four more, it is an obvious statement, and no more wrong than male goat kids trying each other out, or the pecking order in a wolf pack. It is what it is.

Quote

I am truly sorry that some women here have made you regret taking on the responsibility you have.  The role of protector is important and I appreciate you and all the other men that understand that importance.



Aw, s'alright darlin'... You make up for it all by yourself  :beer:

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #81 on: February 25, 2018, 08:22:22 am »
What's Toxic is the lack of Adult Masculinity in the family.

Kids need Dads.

Our Welfare Society has made them disposable.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline musiclady

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #82 on: February 25, 2018, 03:25:43 pm »
What's Toxic is the lack of Adult Masculinity in the family.

Kids need Dads.

Our Welfare Society has made them disposable.

Yep.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

I wear a mask as an exercise in liberty and love for others.  To see it as an infringement of liberty is to entirely miss the point.  Be kind.

"Sometimes I think the Church would be better off if we would call a moratorium on activity for about six weeks and just wait on God to see what He is waiting to do for us. That's what they did before Pentecost."   - A. W. Tozer

Use the time God is giving us to seek His will and feel His presence.

Offline dfwgator

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #83 on: February 25, 2018, 04:08:07 pm »
What's Toxic is the lack of Adult Masculinity in the family.

Kids need Dads.

Our Welfare Society has made them disposable.

It is welfare that also makes Americans unwilling to do certain jobs, thus opening the door for illegals to enter the country and find employment.

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: Are boys 'broken'? Another mass shooting renews debate on toxic masculinity
« Reply #84 on: February 25, 2018, 07:30:22 pm »
Yep.

You can track the disintegration of the Black, Nuclear Family, on a time line right back to LBJ's Great Society.

In the 40s black illegitimacy rates, one parent households, were only a fraction of a percentage point or 2 higher than white families.

Today it's only 3 out of 10 black kids with a 2 parent home.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

http://wulfanson.blogspot.com

Offline Sanguine

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