Teen’s Escape Leads to Discovery of 13 Victims Held Captive in Perris Home, Including Kids Chained t

[NavyCanDo]

With all of that I don't understand the wedding pictures.   Other then the clothes and haircuts the children appear to be happy and normal.   Yes it looks kinda like a Chevy Chase vacation wedding but they don't look abused in those pictures.

Look again. Some look very very thin. Even seeing bone structure. Like Karen Carenter before she passed. 

[mystery-ak]

Also the children wore the same clothes several years in a row for the renewal vows....they didn't outgrow them.

[driftdiver]

Look again. Some look very very thin. Even seeing bone structure. Like Karen Carenter before she passed.

You're right, the one on the far right seems exceedingly thin and pale.  The one second from the left is also quite pale.

I doubt these children/young adults will ever live normal lives.    Mental and physical development must be severely stunted and the emotional scars will be difficult to deal with.

[musiclady]

Look again. Some look very very thin. Even seeing bone structure. Like Karen Carenter before she passed.

Yes.  Their faces are gaunt and not normal kid thin faces.

We have some pretty skinny kids in our greater family who are healthy and normal and they do not look like these kids do.

[musiclady]

Also the children wore the same clothes several years in a row for the renewal vows....they didn't outgrow them.

And no one noticed..........   

[Gefn]

I'm convinced there really is evil in this world.

[Sanguine]

I'm convinced there really is evil in this world.

Of course there is.  I find it interesting when we are surprised to see that it exists.

[Gefn]

Of course there is.  I find it interesting when we are surprised to see that it exists.

Maybe I'm strange - I still believe in Santa Claus. If I didn't I think I'd be crazy.

[musiclady]

I'm convinced there really is evil in this world.

There is no other word to better describe what these "parents" did to their children, @Freya .

And, IMO, there is no punishment adequate for this level of depravity.

[Jazzhead]

A quiverfull of crazy.

Sad.   

[Gefn]

There is no other word to better describe what these "parents" did to their children, @Freya .

And, IMO, there is no punishment adequate for this level of depravity.

It's also sad because there are some wonderful people here who would make great parents and can't.

[ConservativeGranny]

With all of that I don't understand the wedding pictures.   Other then the clothes and haircuts the children appear to be happy and normal.   Yes it looks kinda like a Chevy Chase vacation wedding but they don't look abused in those pictures.

You are not alone on that. I don't see it either although I absolutely believe the children's story. They look like normal kids to me. I have 6 grandchildren of various ages and I don't see much difference. I'm looking at the arms and faces however. Clothing could be covering up a lot. The Elvis wedding stuff is just so odd. To do it once is weird but 3 times????

Also one of the older boys was reportedly taking a class at a college. His mother dropped him off and waited for him to take him home. In that time couldn't he have asked a teacher for help? Gave the teacher a note or something? He obviously must have been on the ball enough to take a college class but why would the parents allow it in the first place?  This is the most curious case. Unfortunately books will most likely be written and movies made about this case never giving these children a chance of a normal life. The best thing for them may be new identities. It's going to be hard to protect them, especially the older ones.

[austingirl]

You are not alone on that. I don't see it either although I absolutely believe the children's story. They look like normal kids to me. I have 6 grandchildren of various ages and I don't see much difference. I'm looking at the arms and faces however. Clothing could be covering up a lot. The Elvis wedding stuff is just so odd. To do it once is weird but 3 times????

Also one of the older boys was reportedly taking a class at a college. His mother dropped him off and waited for him to take him home. In that time couldn't he have asked a teacher for help? Gave the teacher a note or something? He obviously must have been on the ball enough to take a college class but why would the parents allow it in the first place?  This is the most curious case. Unfortunately books will most likely be written and movies made about this case never giving these children a chance of a normal life. The best thing for them may be new identities. It's going to be hard to protect them, especially the older ones.

I think it would difficult for these children to recover from the horrific abuse at the hands of people who are supposed to protect them, with or without movies and books. The boy going to college classes did so because the parents wanted him to- for a reason that benefitted them, maybe so he could get a job to support them in their old age.. I think the kids suffered from Stockholm Syndrome- until one brave girl planned her escape.

[musiclady]

I think it would difficult for these children to recover from the horrific abuse at the hands of people who are supposed to protect them, with or without movies and books. The boy going to college classes did so because the parents wanted him to- for a reason that benefitted them, maybe so he could get a job to support them in their old age.. I think the kids suffered from Stockholm Syndrome- until one brave girl planned her escape.

The 17 year old may be the only one who even partly recovers from this.  The sister with her who turned back obviously suffers from Stockholm Syndrome, and most likely the other kids do.

[Neverdul]

I think it would difficult for these children to recover from the horrific abuse at the hands of people who are supposed to protect them, with or without movies and books. The boy going to college classes did so because the parents wanted him to- for a reason that benefitted them, maybe so he could get a job to support them in their old age.. I think the kids suffered from Stockholm Syndrome- until one brave girl planned her escape.

Evidently the mom took him to his class(es) and waited outside the classroom in the hallway the entire time and then drove him home. I wonder if anyone was aware of that or thought it strange. But "strange" or "eccentric" or “weird” often isn't enough for someone to call the authorities.

But that kid, even if he thought of telling someone was probably too afraid to, given that mom was barely leaving him out of her sight.

I read in the Daily Mail that for a time when the family lived in Texas that the older children had befriended a neighbor’s child and played with her, this would have been before 2010 when the really bad abuse allegedly started. The parent’s shortly before they moved stopped allowing them to play with this girl and kept the kids confined to the back yard where no one could see them. So for a time some of the older children had contact with others, perhaps enough to know and understand that the abuse and isolation wasn’t normal.

[truth_seeker]

Stockholm Syndrome.

[verga]

Yep. Some will use this type of case to demonize home schooling. State laws vary on homeschooling rules. In WI there are no home visits. The nice thing about home schooling is that you get to choose who your children socialize with but you have to put forth some effort to make sure they get the proper social life and are not isolated. Like you said, there are always going to be whack jobs that tarnish the image.

@DCPatriot @Conservative Granny I have been a public school teacher for 22 years now in three different states. In New York and Virginia students have to take the standardized tests which the local schools administer. Home schooled students ON AVERAGE do no better of worse than public school students. It all depends on the curriculum, the student and the parents. Frequently the parents will focus on their areas of strength and other areas will fall by the wayside. Up in NYS for whatever reason most of the homeschoolers could not pass the Regents science exams to save their lives. They had a 75% FAILURE rate compared to the 90+% PASS rate at the one school I taught at. They did do comparable on the English and Math exams. In the area I Live now approximately 50% of the Homeschoolers begin sending their children to public schools in the ninth grade. The ones I have spoken to aid it was because of the language requirements.
I am not opposed to homeschooling, I am 100% in favor of whatever works best a particular child and family. What I am opposed to are the Holier than thou homeschooling advocates that want to scream and rant that every single public school teacher is a government shill liberal pervert. The fact is that in 22 years I have seen a lot more parents that should be locked up the way they treat their own children than teachers that should not be allowed to teach. I could tell you about the inner city mothers that churn out kids to increase their government benefits checks, or the step mother that stripped an extension cord and used it as a whip on her steps daughters back, or the father that broke his son's nose because he did not place in a swim meet.

[verga]

Can you explain how a public school teacher has the time to home school and work as a teacher? Isn't it an indictment on their own incompetence and failure to make such a move? It's like the Toyota dealer driving around town in a Buick.

@Frank Cannon Well the one that I know of, his wife is a stay at home mom and the reason they do it has nothing to do with the quality of the education it is due to certain allergies that the children have.

[verga]

They are a generally stupid lot.

@Frank Cannon I have  2 Bachelors degrees, 2 Masters and the equivalent of 2 more, one in Engineering, and one in Theology, How many do you have?

[musiclady]

@Frank Cannon I have  2 Bachelors degrees, 2 Masters and the equivalent of 2 more, one in Engineering, and one in Theology, How many do you have?

 

[goodwithagun]

@DCPatriot @Conservative Granny I have been a public school teacher for 22 years now in three different states. In New York and Virginia students have to take the standardized tests which the local schools administer. Home schooled students ON AVERAGE do no better of worse than public school students. It all depends on the curriculum, the student and the parents. Frequently the parents will focus on their areas of strength and other areas will fall by the wayside. Up in NYS for whatever reason most of the homeschoolers could not pass the Regents science exams to save their lives. They had a 75% FAILURE rate compared to the 90+% PASS rate at the one school I taught at. They did do comparable on the English and Math exams. In the area I Live now approximately 50% of the Homeschoolers begin sending their children to public schools in the ninth grade. The ones I have spoken to aid it was because of the language requirements.
I am not opposed to homeschooling, I am 100% in favor of whatever works best a particular child and family. What I am opposed to are the Holier than thou homeschooling advocates that want to scream and rant that every single public school teacher is a government shill liberal pervert. The fact is that in 22 years I have seen a lot more parents that should be locked up the way they treat their own children than teachers that should not be allowed to teach. I could tell you about the inner city mothers that churn out kids to increase their government benefits checks, or the step mother that stripped an extension cord and used it as a whip on her steps daughters back, or the father that broke his son's nose because he did not place in a swim meet.

 

I teach in an urban school system. The stories I could tell

[Frank Cannon]

@Frank Cannon I have  2 Bachelors degrees, 2 Masters and the equivalent of 2 more, one in Engineering, and one in Theology, How many do you have?

@verga
@musiclady

I have 23 collectors cars as well as a new Mercedes S class as a beater car, a 6 bedroom 4 bath house with a billiard room and bar,  swimming pool and massive garage to house my toys including a boat and camper on a lot of land. I also have a hot wife as well as massive real estate holdings and a successful business.

What are your degrees doing for you other than hiding mold stains on the wall?

[musiclady]

@verga
@musiclady

I have 23 collectors cars as well as a new Mercedes S class as a beater car, a 6 bedroom 4 bath house with a billiard room and bar,  swimming pool and massive garage to house my toys including a boat and camper on a lot of land. I also have a hot wife as well as massive real estate holdings and a successful business.

What are your degrees doing for you other than hiding mold stains on the wall?

Well, unlike @verga , I only have one bachelor's degree and one masters, but they have given me 45 years of great joy in teaching from pre-school, through the college level.  I love kids, and I love the youthful thinking and vitality they have added to my life.  I love continuing to learn myself in order to teach more effectively, and have treasured the time I've spent in study to that end. I love making music (my HS choirs excelled at State Contests and performed great music, including a Bach motet).   And I love that my life and my teaching has made a difference in hundreds of people's lives.

I can't speak for verga, but for me, and for most teachers, our degrees have brought us great fulfillment both professionally and personally.

I hope that answers your question, insincere though it may have been.   

[verga]

@verga
@musiclady

I have 23 collectors cars as well as a new Mercedes S class as a beater car, a 6 bedroom 4 bath house with a billiard room and bar,  swimming pool and massive garage to house my toys including a boat and camper on a lot of land. I also have a hot wife as well as massive real estate holdings and a successful business.

What are your degrees doing for you other than hiding mold stains on the wall?

@Frank Cannon @musiclady To date I have taught several dozen engineers, Half a dozen Architects, About a dozen police officers, 1 Pediatrician, 1 Dentist. I have a half a dozen current and former students involved in IT. My wife and I live in a very modest 3 bedroom home and we also do animal rescue and are active in our Church and several civic organizations. Nothing in your CV screams of improving the world in the least. Feel free to live vicariously through me if you like.

[verga]

Well, unlike @verga , I only have one bachelor's degree and one masters, but they have given me 45 years of great joy in teaching from pre-school, through the college level.  I love kids, and I love the youthful thinking and vitality they have added to my life.  I love continuing to learn myself in order to teach more effectively, and have treasured the time I've spent in study to that end. I love making music (my HS choirs excelled at State Contests and performed great music, including a Bach motet).   And I love that my life and my teaching has made a difference in hundreds of people's lives.

I can't speak for verga, but for me, and for most teachers, our degrees have brought us great fulfillment both professionally and personally.

I hope that answers your question, insincere though it may have been.   

@ffrankcannon @musiclady    Ditto what the nice lady said.