Author Topic: America’s first bullet train is already a failure and it hasn’t even been built (Texas)  (Read 2145 times)

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Offline thackney

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Can't go too much in the way of old school if one wishes a streamlined speedy train.  Aerodynamics still have to be considered to get that 200mph

I was thinking more about the requirements of the cow catcher at the front of the train.
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Offline RoosGirl

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The wandering topic has made this old joke germane to the conversation:

In an issue of Meat & Poultry magazine, editors quoted from “Feathers,” the publication of the California Poultry Industry Federation, telling the following story:

The US Federal Aviation Administration has a unique device for testing the strength of windshields on airplanes. The device is a gun that launches a dead chicken at a plane’s windshield at approximately the speed the plane flies.

The theory is that if the windshield doesn’t crack from the carcass impact, it’ll survive a real collision with a bird during flight.

It seems the British were very interested in this and wanted to test a windshield on a brand new, speedy locomotive they’re developing.

They borrowed FAA’s chicken launcher, loaded the chicken and fired.

The ballistic chicken shattered the windshield, broke the engineer’s chair and embedded itself in the back wall of the engine’s cab. The British were stunned and asked the FAA to recheck the test to see if everything was done correctly.

The FAA reviewed the test thoroughly and had one recommendation:

“Use a thawed chicken.”

Hah, my Materials professor would tell that joke over and over again, but he used jet turbines and not windshields.
Truth has to be repeated constantly, because Error also is being preached all the time, and not just by a few, but by the multitude. In the Press and Encyclopaedias, in Schools and Universities, everywhere Error holds sway, feeling happy and comfortable in the knowledge of having Majority on its side.

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Offline dfwgator

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It seems that everyone is, at least thus far, ignoring the elephant in the room.  How much currently taxable land would have to be condemned and removed from the tax rolls for this project to proceed?

Bart: Mongo, why would Hedley Lamarr care about where the choo-choo goes?
Mongo: Don't know. Mongo only pawn in game of life.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Hah, my Materials professor would tell that joke over and over again, but he used jet turbines and not windshields.

There was a segment on Mythbusters, but I forgot how it went.  Their experiments are often very poorly designed, and I think this was one of the worst (I'm sure as an Engineer you appreciate this).  I don't think they even used a windshield from a jet aircraft for the experiment.

I seem to recall the chicken penetrated the screen, whether thawed or frozen, and it was because they were using the windshield off a Cessna.  Idiots.  It's not supposed to protect from something moving several hundred MPH.
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Offline RoosGirl

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There was a segment on Mythbusters, but I forgot how it went.  Their experiments are often very poorly designed, and I think this was one of the worst (I'm sure as an Engineer you appreciate this).  I don't think they even used a windshield from a jet aircraft for the experiment.

I seem to recall the chicken penetrated the screen, whether thawed or frozen, and it was because they were using the windshield off a Cessna.  Idiots.  It's not supposed to protect from something moving several hundred MPH.

Yeah, those two guys were FOS, but they had a fun job. :)
Truth has to be repeated constantly, because Error also is being preached all the time, and not just by a few, but by the multitude. In the Press and Encyclopaedias, in Schools and Universities, everywhere Error holds sway, feeling happy and comfortable in the knowledge of having Majority on its side.

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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This should place a damper on this bullet train.  Derailment at less than 8o mph

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/amtrak-washington-state-derail-interstate/2017/12/18/id/832359/
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Offline Bigun

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Offline Cyber Liberty

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@IsailedawayfromFR

Should but very likely won't.

Hey, it's Seattle/Tacoma.  You can't make an omelet without breaking some eggs...
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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@IsailedawayfromFR

Should but very likely won't.
I would think that Texans are a bit more skeptical in the first place to this non-essential endeavor.  Coupled with the thousands of acres that would have to be seized from private landowners in Texas (as opposed to mostly public lands crossed in Washington state), yes it is another nail in the box.
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Offline Bigun

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I would think that Texans are a bit more skeptical in the first place to this non-essential endeavor.  Coupled with the thousands of acres that would have to be seized from private landowners in Texas (as opposed to mostly public lands crossed in Washington state), yes it is another nail in the box.

I sincerely hope you are correct.

Offline Sanguine

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Cui bono?

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See then that you walk circumspectly, not as fools but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil.

But the noble make noble plans, and by noble deeds they stand.

Offline thackney

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This should place a damper on this bullet train.  Derailment at less than 8o mph

No one is designing 30 mph max curves on a new 200 mph train route.

There will be places near the beginning and end where the trains will have to travel slower.

Any train going over 250% the rated speed for the curve is going to have problems.
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Offline Bigun

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I'll make a deal with the Texas bullet train folks!  Get rid of property taxes entirely and then we'll talk about letting you take more property off of the tax rolls!

Offline thackney

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I'll make a deal with the Texas bullet train folks!  Get rid of property taxes entirely and then we'll talk about letting you take more property off of the tax rolls!

If this is to be a privately owned rail, why would the property be taken off the tax roles?  Pipeline, Electric Utility easements pay taxes.
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Offline Bigun

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If this is to be a privately owned rail, why would the property be taken off the tax roles?  Pipeline, Electric Utility easements pay taxes.

That's true but it's my understanding that this isn't planned to work that way.  I may be wrong about that but I don't think so.

If it is, in fact, a completely private project how will they compel anyone who refuses to sell them the property they need to do so?
« Last Edit: December 19, 2017, 10:50:24 AM by Bigun »

Offline thackney

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That's true but it's my understanding that this isn't planned to work that way.  I may be wrong about that but I don't think so.

If it is, in fact, a completely private project how will they compel anyone who refuses to sell them the property they need to do so?

Like a privately owned pipeline or power line, they are able to invoke eminent domain laws if they are a "common carrier", open to all to use.

If ExxonMobil builds a pipeline to only move ExxonMobil product, they cannot use eminent domain.  If Kinder Morgan builds a common carrier pipeline, FERC regulated, open to anyone to bid on moving product, they can use eminent domain.
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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No one is designing 30 mph max curves on a new 200 mph train route.

There will be places near the beginning and end where the trains will have to travel slower.

Any train going over 250% the rated speed for the curve is going to have problems.
who said they were?

A Brand New Rail Line With Its First Run deRailing RESULTING In Deaths And Many INJURIES WILL NOT PLAY Well With Texas constituents.  A bullet train will go much faster, with commensurate risks of even more tragedy if derailed.  Design may be better for higher speeds, but human error is still there.

Lots of folks would rather trust themselves behind the wheel of their own car.
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Offline thackney

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Design may be better for higher speeds, but human error is still there.

I have confidence this event will greatly push congress to legislate "Positive Control", an automated system that slows the train down when required to passenger trains.  It has been discussed before.

https://www.fra.dot.gov/ptc

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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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I have confidence this event will greatly push congress to legislate "Positive Control", an automated system that slows the train down when required to passenger trains.  It has been discussed before.

https://www.fra.dot.gov/ptc
Sounds like it is similar to a self-driving car.  They never wreck do they?
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Offline thackney

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Sounds like it is similar to a self-driving car.  They never wreck do they?

I have mixed emotions about their use.  There have been some very clear cases of operator error that this type system would have saved lives.  But the dependence upon such a system will likely cost lives as well.  Which way is best?

Perhaps their could be an automated system that inflicts pain upon the engineer which fails to slow down at the predesignated point...
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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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I have mixed emotions about their use.  There have been some very clear cases of operator error that this type system would have saved lives.  But the dependence upon such a system will likely cost lives as well.  Which way is best?

Perhaps their could be an automated system that inflicts pain upon the engineer which fails to slow down at the predesignated point...
Being an engineer myself, I sure would tread carefully taking a job that has that happen....
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Offline thackney

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Being an engineer myself, I sure would tread carefully taking a job that has that happen....

'twas meant as a joke, but as an engineer myself, I'm naturally humor impaired.

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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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'twas meant as a joke, but as an engineer myself, I'm naturally humor impaired.
Here's a tragic example of a new guy on the job where things go horribly wrong in an automated situation.

A real life human error in action.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNcsTRQNZLE
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Here's a tragic example of a new guy on the job where things go horribly wrong in an automated situation.

A real life human error in action.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNcsTRQNZLE

A video and a very, very long article, and I still don't know what happened there.

Added:  I continued reading, and way down at the end of the story they say the temp worker was killed by a falling pallet of Bacardi.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2017, 05:57:28 PM by Cyber Liberty »
I will NOT comply.
Thanks to Cripplecreek and Oceander for the medal!

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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A video and a very, very long article, and I still don't know what happened there.

Added:  I continued reading, and way down at the end of the story they say the temp worker was killed by a falling pallet of Bacardi.
video is less than 3 minutes
Yearning to stay free takes place in many ways at many different times, whether by withstanding planes or bayonets


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