'I HAD TO LEAVE'

[Suppressed]

'I HAD TO LEAVE'
Former state seismologist testifies officials coerced him to alter research on induced quakes
By Mack Burke | Transcript News Editor Nov 16, 2017 
 4 min to read
     
NORMAN — Oklahoma’s former lead seismologist has testified he was pressured by officials at the University of Oklahoma to suppress findings linking earthquakes with fracking wastewater disposal.

In a deposition taken on Oct. 11, Austin Holland alleges he was reprimanded for publishing a peer-reviewed journal article connecting the two and was pressured to alter his findings by Larry Grillot, dean of OU’s Mewbourne College of Earth and Energy, and Randy Keller, the former director of the Oklahoma Geological Survey.

Holland said his decision to leave OU and the Oklahoma Geologic Survey in 2015 was a direct result of pressure from his employers.

[...]

http://www.normantranscript.com/news/former-state-seismologist-testifies-officials-coerced-him-to-alter-research/article_d8383864-cb20-11e7-8206-2bc32ae1169a.html

[skeeter]

Of course there's always the possibility that Holland was the one with the agenda and the university officials were simply trying to maintain the integrity of the research.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Of course there's always the possibility that Holland was the one with the agenda and the university officials were simply trying to maintain the integrity of the research.

reading this article, it appears that supposition has legs.

All scientists are subject to peer review of his/her work.  Why did this guy believe he was not?

[Sanguine]

It's not exactly a secret that waste-water injection is related to earthquakes.

[KingsX]

It's not exactly a secret that waste-water injection is related to earthquakes.

Yes... with ever increasing fracking/injection wells came ever increasing earthquake activity...
so much so that Oklahoma became as earthquake active as California but with totally different tectonics.

Similar earthquake activity has been happening NW of the DFW area where there is much oil/gas production.

[TomSea]

I forget how the story goes and I don't want to get it wrong but that even Rex Tillerson was against fracking near Denton which of course, seems to be where his residence is.

[Sanguine]

Yes... with ever increasing fracking/injection wells came ever increasing earthquake activity...
so much so that Oklahoma became as earthquake active as California but with totally different tectonics.

Similar earthquake activity has been happening NW of the DFW area where there is much oil/gas production.

One tiny point- it doesn't appear to be fracking, but the re -injection of waste water.

[KingsX]

I forget how the story goes and I don't want to get it wrong but that even Rex Tillerson was against fracking near Denton which of course, seems to be where his residence is.

I don't know about Denton County... but private water wells have been polluted in next door Wise County from all the oil/gas abuse.

[Sanguine]

I don't know about Denton County... but private water wells have been polluted in next door Wise County from all the oil/gas abuse.

You sure about that?  It's technically hard to do.

[Suppressed]

reading this article, it appears that supposition has legs.

All scientists are subject to peer review of his/her work.  Why did this guy believe he was not?

Sentence two notes that his work was peer-reviewed.

[Smokin Joe]

You sure about that?  It's technically hard to do.

Unless there is a lot of surface spillage, you are right. If there is a lot of surface spillage, someone isn't doing it right.

[Smokin Joe]

One tiny point- it doesn't appear to be fracking, but the re -injection of waste water.

Correct. Fracking may induce fractures, but the majority of the fluid is produced back from the well. Some companies will re-use it after treating it, and eventually that and produced water will be disposed of in injection wells. If those injection wells are causing problems, perhaps a different disposal site would solve the problem. If there is a problem, it needs to be identified, characterized, and then steps taken to correct it.

Seismic problems would depend on the geology of the disposal formations, as in North Dakota we have almost no seismicity, even though a considerable amount of produced water and frac water are injected daily.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Sentence two notes that his work was peer-reviewed.

Obviously, some peers objected to it.  Does he think only those that agree with him are able to review his work?

[Bigun]

Obviously, some peers objected to it.  Does he think only those that agree with him are able to review his work?

That seems to be the prevailing attitude among many these days!

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Yes... with ever increasing fracking/injection wells came ever increasing earthquake activity...
so much so that Oklahoma became as earthquake active as California but with totally different tectonics.

Similar earthquake activity has been happening NW of the DFW area where there is much oil/gas production.

I'll get resident geologist @Smokin Joe to chime in, but saying Oklahoma is as earthquake active as California is akin to saying the traffic in Oklahoma is as bad as California.  Yes, they both have traffic but there is really no comparison whatsoever due to scale.

Any earthquakes recorded in Oklahoma are minor compared to California. The largest ever recorded in OK was 5.8 on Richter scale vs a 7.9 in California. 

For you and guys in Rio Linda, that is over a hundred times as strong.

And are you suggesting that NW of DFW has similar earthquakes as to California?  Most earthquakes recorded in Texas occur near El Paso.  Do you have a record of these Texas earthquakes recorded near DFW as I cannot find them?

I believe you are simply parroting some decidedly anti-industry talking points and throwing them against the wall to see what sticks.

[Smokin Joe]

I'll get resident geologist @Smokin Joe to chime in, but saying Oklahoma is as earthquake active as California is akin to saying the traffic in Oklahoma is as bad as California.  Yes, they both have traffic but there is really no comparison whatsoever due to scale.

Any earthquakes recorded in Oklahoma are minor compared to California. The largest ever recorded in OK was 5.8 on Richter scale vs a 7.9 in California. 

For you and guys in Rio Linda, that is over a hundred times as strong.

And are you suggesting that NW of DFW has similar earthquakes as to California?  Most earthquakes recorded in Texas occur near El Paso.  Do you have a record of these Texas earthquakes recorded near DFW as I cannot find them?

I believe you are simply parroting some decidedly anti-industry talking points and throwing them against the wall to see what sticks.

There have been earthquakes associated with disposal wells, from Rocky Flats (CO) to the Midwest, and in other areas. Increasing the pore pressure in formations under stress has been shown to increase the likelihood of seismic events in SOME geological settings. Deferring to the USGS and for good basic information on the topic, I recommend seeing this: https://earthquake.usgs.gov/research/induced/myths.php

Keep in mind that without stresses already present, the amount of rock movement will be small or nonexistent. In North Dakota, the nation's second largest oil producer, there are virtually no earthquakes, despite injecting unprecedented amounts of production and used frac water in recent years.


As for groundwater contamination, there should not be any, if the well is properly constructed and operated with spill containment and prevention measures observed. A properly constructed injection well looks like this in schematic:


Anyone who is really interested in this topic can get scads of info here: http://www.statesfirstinitiative.org/induced-seismicity-work-group There is a webinar on the site, and links to other information as well, including a primer on induced seismicity.

[Smokin Joe]

As a follow-on and in the interest of presenting more complete information, http://energyindepth.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Energy-In-Depth-Report-Injection-Wells-and-Earthquakes-Quantifying-the-Risk1.pdf

A little more technical, but includes assessments in Oklahoma and Texas: https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2015/1070/pdf/ofr2015-1070.pdfIncorporating Induced Seismicity in the 2014 United States National Seismic Hazard Model—Results of 2014 Workshop and Sensitivity Studies

[Smokin Joe]

Now, a comment. If information that quakes, even small ones, are being induced by injection well activity is being suppressed, it shouldn't be. We don't find the answers to potential problems by ignoring them.

[truth_seeker]

Correct. Fracking may induce fractures, but the majority of the fluid is produced back from the well. Some companies will re-use it after treating it, and eventually that and produced water will be disposed of in injection wells. If those injection wells are causing problems, perhaps a different disposal site would solve the problem. If there is a problem, it needs to be identified, characterized, and then steps taken to correct it.

Seismic problems would depend on the geology of the disposal formations, as in North Dakota we have almost no seismicity, even though a considerable amount of produced water and frac water are injected daily.

In Huntington Beach and Long Beach, water produced from water injection, has be reused for at least 45 years. So called fracking was used even before that.

There are thousands of $1+ million homes in the immediate area, literally on the same blocks with both injection and production wells.

The risks involved, have not stopped the building of more homes, hotels and shopping centers.

** Am I the only one having trouble posting images, lately ... using?

[Cyber Liberty]

** Am I the only one having trouble posting images, lately ... using?

I haven't, but I have noticed more sites are not allowing hot-linking, and not all of them substitute a picture saying "Don't hot-link our images, you pooty-head," they just don't appear.  I've gotten to where I preview every post with an image to make sure I have a good link, and that the pic isn't the sized of the side of a barn.

[Smokin Joe]

In Huntington Beach and Long Beach, water produced from water injection, has be reused for at least 45 years. So called fracking was used even before that.

There are thousands of $1+ million homes in the immediate area, literally on the same blocks with both injection and production wells.

The risks involved, have not stopped the building of more homes, hotels and shopping centers.

** Am I the only one having trouble posting images, lately ... using?

The worst spots for induced seismicity appear to be in the Anadarko basin (Oklahoma and Kansas). others have happened, and the first I heard of were at the Rocky Mountain Arsenal ("Rocky Flats") in Colorado, decades ago. The effects (or lack of them) depend on the geology in the area, not on just whether there is wastewater injection going on. Fraccing has been around for over 80 years, and saltwater injection (disposal) even longer.

What we are seeing is that far greater amounts of flowback water and produced (formation) water are being disposed of than in the past in a shorter time frame. In some areas where there is existing stress in the rock and along existing fault lines, that stress is being released as friction is reduced.

Not all wastewater injection wells are oil and gas related. (The Rocky Mountain Arsenal situation had nothing to do with the oil industry).

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Now, a comment. If information that quakes, even small ones, are being induced by injection well activity is being suppressed, it shouldn't be. We don't find the answers to potential problems by ignoring them.

My comment:  The author said he felt intimidated by Harold Hamm when he relayed that his paper expressed his opinion that hydraulic fracturing caused earthquakes.

First, there are few peers in industry that agree with that statement.  An earthquake by definition is simply an earth movement that is recordable.  The earth is constantly moving, we just do not feel it most of the time.    I have sat wells where we record tiltmeters for injection and fracced wells and also recorded microseismic events.  In every case, one can see a recorded 'earthquake' on the instruments.  These are non-damaging events.  So running around saying 'earthquake' is akin to running around saying 'the sky is falling' when there it is raining.

@Smokin Joe , is that suppressing things?

Secondly, he agrees that the oil industry had no censure whatsoever of his papers.  It was 'staff', which I assume are scientific peers, who questioned his papers.  As I read the article, it appears he offered opinions that others disagreed with, which is the need for peer reviews.

[Smokin Joe]

My comment:  The author said he felt intimidated by Harold Hamm when he relayed that his paper expressed his opinion that hydraulic fracturing caused earthquakes.

First, there are few peers in industry that agree with that statement.  An earthquake by definition is simply an earth movement that is recordable.  The earth is constantly moving, we just do not feel it most of the time.    I have sat wells where we record tiltmeters for injection and fracced wells and also recorded microseismic events.  In every case, one can see a recorded 'earthquake' on the instruments.  These are non-damaging events.  So running around saying 'earthquake' is akin to running around saying 'the sky is falling' when there it is raining.

@Smokin Joe , is that suppressing things?

Secondly, he agrees that the oil industry had no censure whatsoever of his papers.  It was 'staff', which I assume are scientific peers, who questioned his papers.  As I read the article, it appears he offered opinions that others disagreed with, which is the need for peer reviews.

Note I didn't say who might be conducting any alleged suppression, I just stated that there shouldn't be any, and did not mean to imply there was any.

The other factor is one of intensity, and that needs to be put into perspective as well. Break a rock it will send out a shockwave. I have been on drilling rigs where in fractures the bit would 'hop', and the whole location would shake. With 40K on the bit, that is a small seismic event: the whole location shakes noticeably. But that isn't the sort of thing that brings down buildings and causes widespread destruction.  Minor events occur all the time.

Map of the last 24 hours: https://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/map/#%7B%22autoUpdate%22%3A%5B%22autoUpdate%22%5D%2C%22basemap%22%3A%22grayscale%22%2C%22feed%22%3A%221day_all%22%2C%22listFormat%22%3A%22default%22%2C%22mapposition%22%3A%5B%5B-16.13026201203474%2C-171.73828125%5D%2C%5B78.63000556774836%2C-59.23828124999999%5D%5D%2C%22overlays%22%3A%5B%22plates%22%5D%2C%22restrictListToMap%22%3A%5B%22restrictListToMap%22%5D%2C%22search%22%3Anull%2C%22sort%22%3A%22newest%22%2C%22timezone%22%3A%22utc%22%2C%22viewModes%22%3A%5B%22settings%22%2C%22list%22%2C%22map%22%5D%2C%22event%22%3Anull%7D

Most of those are small potatoes, the sort of thing that would go unnoticed by someone walking along. or even sitting.

By contrast, filter out the little ones that no one feels, and you get this, over a week: https://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/map/#%7B%22autoUpdate%22%3A%5B%22autoUpdate%22%5D%2C%22basemap%22%3A%22grayscale%22%2C%22feed%22%3A%227day_m45%22%2C%22listFormat%22%3A%22default%22%2C%22mapposition%22%3A%5B%5B-75.32002523220802%2C-228.1640625%5D%2C%5B85.02070774312594%2C-3.1640625%5D%5D%2C%22overlays%22%3A%5B%22plates%22%5D%2C%22restrictListToMap%22%3A%5B%22restrictListToMap%22%5D%2C%22search%22%3Anull%2C%22sort%22%3A%22newest%22%2C%22timezone%22%3A%22utc%22%2C%22viewModes%22%3A%5B%22settings%22%2C%22list%22%2C%22map%22%5D%2C%22event%22%3A%22nc72923380%22%7D(Those are magnitude 4.5+, and New Caledonia--the French territory, not Louisiana--seems to be a busy place at the moment, but to my knowledge there isn't much completion work going on there.)

When people think of an "earthquake" they tend to think of the latter, with abundant destruction and people buried in rubble. So causing panic on the basis of minor events is pretty much irresponsible science, unless it can be shown these events are precursors to a major event--something which hasn't been done on a regular basis. That simply hasn't been shown in this geological context. This isn't a volcano building pressure, nor an active plate boundary.

Fraccing has not been known to cause any significant disturbances. The questions about induced seismicity revolve (or should revolve) around wastewater injection wells. If he stated otherwise, then without information to back that claim (avoiding circular reasoning), it isn't substantiated.

[Suppressed]

My comment:  The author said he felt intimidated by Harold Hamm when he relayed that his paper expressed his opinion that hydraulic fracturing caused earthquakes.

Obviously, "hydraulic fracturing" is being used to represent the actual fracking and the associated activities, including wastewater injection -- which was what he had written about.

Induced seismicity isn't just a short-term effect.  Induced seismic events can occur long after the actual injections.

As has been said above, these aren't huge events being noted.  And as @Smokin Joe says, if there's intimidation to prevent reporting on them, that's not good at all.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Obviously, "hydraulic fracturing" is being used to represent the actual fracking and the associated activities, including wastewater injection -- which was what he had written about.

Induced seismicity isn't just a short-term effect.  Induced seismic events can occur long after the actual injections.

As has been said above, these aren't huge events being noted.  And as @Smokin Joe says, if there's intimidation to prevent reporting on them, that's not good at all.

You are lumping all associated activities into hydraulic fraccing including wastewater injection?

Do you realize that most oil and gas activities include wastewater injection, not just hydraulic fraccing?

To combine them together makes no sense at all to people who understand the oil industry.

And BTW, there are plenty of areas where hydraulic fracturing is used where the produced water is resused in fraccing, so wastewater injection is done.