Author Topic: The battle of Charlottesville: A continuing discussion thread about the War between the States  (Read 13425 times)

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Offline INVAR

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Who/what are the 3 percenters? Never heard of them before.

The name is taken from the historical fact of the Revolutionary war, that only 3% of the existing population took an active role in our Independence.  Many are Militia and a good number are ex-mil.  Not affiliated directly with Oathkeepers, but many Oathkeepers also identify as 3 Percenters.

Usually you can find patches with roman numeral 3 inside the stars of a Betsy Ross flag or the stars and bars.

HonestJohn

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Trump and his supporters need to denounce these scum loudly and long.  No one can be blamed if repugnant people support them, but they can be blamed if they do not disavow that support.  And we have Trump supporters here trying to defend their actions.

They had many, MANY chances to do so during the 2016 primaries and general election.  (When David Duke endorsed Trump, when the Klan newspaper endorsed Trump, when alt-right leaders robocalled for him with explicitly white nationalist calls, etc, etc, etc).

How many times does he have to not denounce these things... before one understands that he doesn't disapprove of this type of this.

Heck, he's got Bannon at the White House... the guy who made Breitbart 'home of the alt-right' and employed Milo Yiannopoulos.  I mean, for Pete's sake... look at it!
« Last Edit: August 13, 2017, 06:00:32 AM by HonestJohn »

Offline EC

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They had many, MANY chances to do so during the 2016 primaries and general election.  (When David Duke endorsed Trump, when the Klan newspaper endorsed Trump, when alt-right leaders robocalled for him with explicitly white nationalist calls, etc, etc, etc).

How many times does he have to not denounce these things... before one understands that he doesn't disapprove of this type of this.

First - my opinion is that Trump is about as racist as a lump of limestone. In other words, not in the slightest - he gives damn one about the green, not the colour or religion of hand that's holding it.

At the same time, I can sort of see a reasoning behind being slow to denounce (he DID denounce Duke during the primaries  in the end, just way too slowly) above and beyond the "any publicity is good publicity" mindset he has. The left have their shock troops, their emminently disposable useful idiots. Why shouldn't the right? It's twisted, but it's a possible. Bannon is certainly capable of being that cynical.
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Offline catfish1957

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@catfish1957

So,you suddenly believe the media when they tell you all the white people marching to preserve the Lee statue are Kluxxers and Neo-Nazi's?

Well,HELL,WHY NOT? After all,the leftist media would never lie to manipulate public opinion,would they?

@sneakypete

I am guessing you didn't notice or didn't want to acknowledge the many pics of the idiots in robes at this rally.  I stand 100% behind every post in this thread.  I am a southern preservationist for any reasons (including my tagline), and absolutely detest the Klan and their ilk for hijacking the CBF, and creating the backlash toward icons of southern heritage.

Didn't expect an apology in any case.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline catfish1957

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@catfish1957 Uh,huh. And YOUR plan to help preserve the south,and by extension America,is to label ever white person that the left and the racists of Black Lives Matter hate and protest against as being Nazi's and Kluxxers?

Whose side did you say you are on,again?


And,other than the media,the college alleged "intellectual" airheads,and the BLM crowd,who we all know would never lie to us,WHO exactly identified all those white marchers as Kluxxers?

They certainly didn't identify THEMSELVES as being Kluxxers or Nazi's.

@sneakypete

Guess those hooded guys were Boy Scouts huh?

Misplaced meltdowns are a "b" aren't they?
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline EC

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@sneakypete

I am guessing you didn't notice or didn't want to acknowledge the many pics of the idiots in robes at this rally.  I stand 100% behind every post in this thread.  I am a southern preservationist for any reasons (including my tagline), and absolutely detest the Klan and their ilk for hijacking the CBF, and creating the backlash toward icons of southern heritage.

Didn't expect an apology in any case.

Pete shoots first and asks questions later - if he can remember or be bothered to.
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Offline Rivergirl

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Offline Cripplecreek

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They had many, MANY chances to do so during the 2016 primaries and general election.  (When David Duke endorsed Trump, when the Klan newspaper endorsed Trump, when alt-right leaders robocalled for him with explicitly white nationalist calls, etc, etc, etc).

How many times does he have to not denounce these things... before one understands that he doesn't disapprove of this type of this.

Heck, he's got Bannon at the White House... the guy who made Breitbart 'home of the alt-right' and employed Milo Yiannopoulos.  I mean, for Pete's sake... look at it!

David Duke was at the rally yesterday and said he was there in part to support Trump.

Online edpc

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First - my opinion is that Trump is about as racist as a lump of limestone. In other words, not in the slightest - he gives damn one about the green, not the colour or religion of hand that's holding it.

That was apparent in his association with Don King and defense of Mike Tyson.
Don't encourage me.

Offline mountaineer

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A day without sunshine is like, you know, night.

HonestJohn

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@sneakypete

I am guessing you didn't notice or didn't want to acknowledge the many pics of the idiots in robes at this rally.  I stand 100% behind every post in this thread.  I am a southern preservationist for any reasons (including my tagline), and absolutely detest the Klan and their ilk for hijacking the CBF, and creating the backlash toward icons of southern heritage.

Didn't expect an apology in any case.

I don't know why Southern preservationists only seem to focus in on the Civil War.

A rebellion against the US and its Constitution.

Online TomSea

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FWIW, via Facebook:I do not know this poster and cannot vouch for her veracity. Just posting this for informational purposes.

This report is somewhat similar to one where I heard a local female reporter go to a rally to cover an event, a different event, not yesterday's; and though a "neutral reporter", basically got harassed by the antifas, she wanted to leave as soon as possible. Her car being parked in a Sear's parking lot, she thought if she didn't leave, her car was going to get rocks thrown at it.

For the record, ACLU Virginia; one can read their tweets and yes, their observers were there.
https://twitter.com/ACLUVA
« Last Edit: August 13, 2017, 08:11:41 AM by TomSea »

Offline bigheadfred

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FWIW, via Facebook:I do not know this poster and cannot vouch for her veracity. Just posting this for informational purposes.

I saw something similar on twitter.

Whoever let the blm/antifa crowd do their part should be charged with inciting a riot and blamed for the violence and deaths.

Such utter BS, IMO.

All the polly's are gonna be crying for Trump to denounce the "white supremacists" for this. All those polly's, including the rubio and cruz need to be slapped down. They are total POS.

Offline mountaineer

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Also making the rounds is a video about 27 minutes long posted on Facebook by members of a patriot group who were in Charlottesville during the violent events. I didn't watch the entire thing. Again, I nothing about these guys and do not vouch for their veracity, nor do I endorse the profanity.  :nometalk:
https://www.facebook.com/joshgemmipatriotmedia/videos/335928490197751/
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Offline Cripplecreek

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That was apparent in his association with Don King and defense of Mike Tyson.

Unfortunately not caring where his money and support comes from only encourages them. The statement from the Daily Stormer clearly states that Trump didn't name them so Trump still supports them.

Look at Klan Republic, they're saying it was a George Soros false flag operation even as one poster sits there among them complaining that the alt right neonazis haven't been aggressive enough and haven't busted enough jaws.

When I was 14 or 15 years old an elderly German man spoke at the men's club breakfast at our church. He says he didn't support the nazis but ended up just as guilty because he chose to look away rather than oppose them when he had a chance. He laid out the same arguments I'm seeing here. "The nazis aren't with us so we don't need to denounce them or defend ourselves". "The communists are just as bad, why isn't anyone doing something about them". In the end, nazi crimes were ignored as countless communists were charged on ridiculously trumped up charges but by then, no one had the courage to speak. He said it was not widely believed that the communists started the reichstag fire but it was well known that attracting the attention of the nazis was bad.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Didn't Trump get a higher percentage of the black vote than either Romney or McCain?
I am not a conservative.

Offline aligncare

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I saw something similar on twitter.

Whoever let the blm/antifa crowd do their part should be charged with inciting a riot and blamed for the violence and deaths.

Such utter BS, IMO.

All the polly's are gonna be crying for Trump to denounce the "white supremacists" for this. All those polly's, including the rubio and cruz need to be slapped down. They are total POS.

Remember how the left shut down Trump's Chicago rally? And, all the other candidates quickly came out from under their rocks to denounce the hate and violence of Trump supporters! not the leftist BLM/ soros protesters?! I was most disappointed to see Cruz among the GOP candidates who were deeply concerned about Trump's behavior inciting his supporters to violence.
NeverTrump wants to deny you YOUR voice, YOUR presidential choice.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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I don't know why Southern preservationists only seem to focus in on the Civil War.

A rebellion against the US and its Constitution.
Exactly what is a "Southern preservationist" anyway?  Someone proud of their heritage perhaps?

And you really need to read up on your history a bit more.  There was no 'Civil War' in this country.

Call it a War Between the States or a War Against Union Aggression if you like, but there was never a war to overthrow the government of this country, which is a Civil War.
Yearning to stay free takes place in many ways at many different times, whether by withstanding planes or bayonets

Offline bigheadfred

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Remember how the left shut down Trump's Chicago rally? And, all the other candidates quickly came out from under their rocks to denounce the hate and violence of Trump supporters! not the leftist BLM/ soros protesters?! I was most disappointed to see Cruz among the GOP candidates who were deeply concerned about Trump's behavior inciting his supporters to violence.

I think the statement Trump made, denouncing both sides, was the correct response.  The statements being made by the pollys like rubio and cruz, are not.

Offline jpsb

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I think what jp is saying, and I happen to agree, is that NT as a movement (which has its origins in the political right) is a destructive force to positive change. It's standing in the way of stopping the left's relentless march forward. It gives them aid and comfort.

As an example of what the progressives are trying to stop, Pres. Trump reversed 860 burdensome business regulations which is just one part of his conservative, constitutional agenda. His goal is to bring federal regulatory excesses to a screeching halt. The left would like nothing more than to stop this president's agenda by fomenting unrest against him by any means necessary. NeverTrump gives them cover to make the claim that the country as a whole hates Trump, both the left and the right.

So, those of us who see Trump's agenda as an opportunity to tame the federal Leviathan sometimes have trouble distinguishing between the aims of leftists and those of NeverTrumpers.

Exactly correct and thank you for taking the time to explain. I've just about given up trying to explain things here.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2017, 09:04:15 AM by jpsb »

Offline don-o

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FWIW, via Facebook:I do not know this poster and cannot vouch for her veracity. Just posting this for informational purposes.

That account lines up with what I read from eyewitnesses in the park. At first I was troubled at how the cops performed. BUT, the blame for all of this falls on the Mayor or Governor, whoever ordered the ending of the permitted rally, and then allowed the antifa et al to illegally march in the street. 

Offline Blizzardnh

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Romans 7

Offline aligncare

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Exactly correct and thank you for taking the time to explain. I've just about given up trying to explain things here.

You're welcome.

Yes, you are so right. There's so much being said here by Trump critics that just isn't so. I read someone's post and just gotta throw up my hands. What's the point of engaging? I can't spend my days arguing with people willfully ignoring the facts and in a constant state of high dudgeon.
NeverTrump wants to deny you YOUR voice, YOUR presidential choice.

Online goatprairie

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Exactly what is a "Southern preservationist" anyway?  Someone proud of their heritage perhaps?

And you really need to read up on your history a bit more.  There was no 'Civil War' in this country.

Call it a War Between the States or a War Against Union Aggression if you like, but there was never a war to overthrow the government of this country, which is a Civil War.
"but there was never a war to overthrow the government of this country"
Well, actually, if you declare yourselves to an independent country and fire upon the soldiers of the country which had been your country, you have effectively overthrown that previous government.

Online Sanguine

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FWIW, via Facebook:I do not know this poster and cannot vouch for her veracity. Just posting this for informational purposes.

Interesting.  I sure wish she had said what she thought she was going to.  What was it she was attending and why?  Who had the permit?
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