What if We Discovered an Alien Civilization Less Advanced Than Our Own?

[goodwithagun]

We already have. There is a mysterious bacteria growing on interplanetary devices that no one can explain. They grow in space. As weird as this may seem, space seems to be full of life.

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[truth_seeker]

Re: "What if We Discovered an Alien Civilization Less Advanced Than Our Own? "

Some would try to come up with the most clever names to call them, their leaders, their supporters.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Actually its kind of funny. Conservatives overwhelmingly cried foul over the poor portrayal of humanity in the Avatar flick. Yet here in this thread its a near unanimous consensus that we would be exactly like humans in  Avatar.

While it stands in direct conflict with my reasons for not wanting an alien race to discover us, I still have no problem with us interfering with a minimally less advanced race. Sure it would change them but that doesn't mean it would be a great harm. More likely than not we would be the greatest thing ever to happen to them.

Look at the animals we consider to be very intelligent like dogs, horses, great apes, dolphins and whales. Most of us treat them with great compassion when despite their intelligence, they're millions of years behind us. If those same animals could sing an opera, write novels, or discuss quantum physics they would deserve and win the same rights as humans.

There's no reason to believe we wouldn't treat a slightly lass advanced race than ours with respect.

Montezuma's treasure, Trail of Tears, "Until the Sun no longer rises in the East..."

 Yeah. Bullshit. Just one thing which was perceived as "needed", one profitable or 'critical' resource and their asses would be crushed.

[Cripplecreek]

Montezuma's treasure, Trail of Tears, "Until the Sun no longer rises in the East..."

 Yeah. Bullshit. Just one thing which was perceived as "needed", one profitable or 'critical' resource and their asses would be crushed.

And other groups of natives thrived and grew by learning and accepting white man's ways.

[Smokin Joe]

And other groups of natives thrived and grew by learning and accepting white man's ways.

Who? If there was anything to loot, it was done. Children were taken from their families and sent to boarding schools and not even allowed to speak their native tongue. Land was taken, wholesale. Anything of value was stripped from them. So who thrived?
The Europeans were a bit smarter, they asserted colonial dominion, exploited mineral and other resources, but left the locals where they were. The British did teach India a common language.

[truth_seeker]

America's treatment of natives is nothing to be proud about. Canada did better.

I had a grandfather killed in 1706 in New Hampshire, and another in 1812 in Indiana.

No idea who was "right" and "wrong." I know the natives were here, first.

https://www.theislandwiki.org/index.php/The_brothers_who_emigrated_to_the_USA_and_were_killed_by_Indians

https://www.geni.com/people/Atha-Meeks-Sr/6000000001671545413

[Cripplecreek]

Who?

The numbers of Navajo grew exponentially when they adopted ranching and farming. A lot of the eastern tribes weren't wiped out by any kind of violence. Most who died were infected by European diseases that they had no immunity to. Interbreeding with whites took a major toll. Many tribes simply disintegrated due to internal disputes over how to deal with the white men. I have a distant ancestor who was kidnapped by indians in the northeast and caused a split when one faction decided to try living in cabins, learning to read and write, and farm. Seems that the idea that children born during the winter actually having a chance to survive till spring was attractive.

The indians weren't exactly treating each other like loving brothers either. One of the theories about the origins of the name "Saginaw" is the Ojibwe translation of "Where the Sauk were" before the Ojibwe drove them out. The simple fact is that most of the indians who had been here were long gone before any white man ever set foot on this continent.

I don't know where people get this fantasy that people were so spectacularly primitive 500 years ago. Christopher Columbus could have learned to pilot a supertanker if they had existed and he could have done it without radar. Ben Franklin could have easily learned to use a computer or a cell phone. The fact is that Cro Magnon man was no less intelligent than us. The only real distinction between them and us a lack of technology but they were technology creators and still are.

[Smokin Joe]

The numbers of Navajo grew exponentially when they adopted ranching and farming. A lot of the eastern tribes weren't wiped out by any kind of violence. Most who died were infected by European diseases that they had no immunity to. Interbreeding with whites took a major toll. Many tribes simply disintegrated due to internal disputes over how to deal with the white men. I have a distant ancestor who was kidnapped by indians in the northeast and caused a split when one faction decided to try living in cabins, learning to read and write, and farm. Seems that the idea that children born during the winter actually having a chance to survive till spring was attractive.

The indians weren't exactly treating each other like loving brothers either. One of the theories about the origins of the name "Saginaw" is the Ojibwe translation of "Where the Sauk were" before the Ojibwe drove them out. The simple fact is that most of the indians who had been here were long gone before any white man ever set foot on this continent.

I don't know where people get this fantasy that people were so spectacularly primitive 500 years ago. Christopher Columbus could have learned to pilot a supertanker if they had existed and he could have done it without radar. Ben Franklin could have easily learned to use a computer or a cell phone. The fact is that Cro Magnon man was no less intelligent than us. The only real distinction between them and us a lack of technology but they were technology creators and still are.

Yet the only advantage you cite for the navajo is technology. Despite assimilation, eradication by disease, etc, and a bit of tourist trade in jewelry, rugs, and pottery, I'm not seeing the 'benefit' that did not overwhelmingly benefit the people who had the edge in technology. Much of the intermarriage was not with whites, but blacks who were often treated as a servant class or menial labor. This was not, for the most part, wildly beneficial, unless you consider the taking of millions of acres and inestimable timber and mineral wealth beneficial. Pretty one-sided, if you ask me.

Advantage went to those with the tech, and they mercilessly exploited, occasionally massacred (intentionally, not just through epidemics), and even enslaved indigenous people wherever they went. It doesn't matter how large a ship the Spanish could have piloted, they would have loaded it with loot and taken it 'home'.

I think if we are going to do anything but unabashedly loot other less developed species, we should leave them alone. Let's at least be honest about it.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

America's treatment of natives is nothing to be proud about. Canada did better.

I had a grandfather killed in 1706 in New Hampshire, and another in 1812 in Indiana.

No idea who was "right" and "wrong." I know the natives were here, first.

https://www.theislandwiki.org/index.php/The_brothers_who_emigrated_to_the_USA_and_were_killed_by_Indians

https://www.geni.com/people/Atha-Meeks-Sr/6000000001671545413

By 'America' who are you talking about?  Spanish? British?  French? And what is meant by 'Canada did it better'? 

And what do you mean by 'No idea who was "right" and "wrong."'?

And you must be pretty old to have had a grandfather who was alive in 1706.

[Cripplecreek]

By 'America' who are you talking about?  Spanish? British?  French? And what is meant by 'Canada did it better'? 

And what do you mean by 'No idea who was "right" and "wrong."'?

And you must be pretty old to have had a grandfather who was alive in 1706.

The "natives" were just a remnant of an earlier immigration wave. Their society rose to a fairly high level and collapsed before Columbus ever arrived here.

[Sanguine]

The "natives" were just a remnant of an earlier immigration wave. Their society rose to a fairly high level and collapsed before Columbus ever arrived here.

And, replaced the population that was here before them.

[Cripplecreek]

And, replaced the population that was here before them.

And it was still going on when we arrived as noted by the place "Where the Sauk were"

[truth_seeker]

The "natives" were just a remnant of an earlier immigration wave. Their society rose to a fairly high level and collapsed before Columbus ever arrived here.

Hint: There wasn't a single "society." There were hundreds of separate tribes with unique languages and cultures, dating back 10,000 yrs. or more, stretching from the Arctic to Tierra del Fuego.

[truth_seeker]

And, replaced the population that was here before them.

Native American populations descend from three key migrations 12 July 2012

Scientists have found that Native American populations — from Canada to the southern tip of Chile — arose from at least three migrations, with the majority descended entirely from a single group of First American migrants that crossed over through Beringia, a land bridge between Asia and America that existed during the ice ages, more than 15,000 years ago.

By studying variations in Native American DNA sequences, the international team found that while most of the Native American populations arose from the first migration, two subsequent migrations also made important genetic contributions. The paper is published in the journal Nature today.

“For years it has been contentious whether the settlement of the Americas occurred by means of a single or multiple ....

snip

...plus there is an amusement park, in Kentucky, called Ark Encounter (I report, you decide)

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-articles/1207/12072012-native-american-migration

[truth_seeker]

And you must be pretty old to have had a grandfather who was alive in 1706.

Sorry. I should have counted the g's for you. like gggggggg grandfather,etc.  but I assume most people would understand.

The men that were killed were my direct male ancestors, by the way.  As you can see from the cited stories, they are well documented.

Invest years in genealogy research, and find lots of interesting stuff. Over the last month, my sister and I helped a 73 year old woman (cousin) who was adopted, find her family ?? She is thrilled and grateful, btw.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

Invest years in genealogy research, and find lots of interesting stuff. Over the last month, my sister and I helped a 73 year old woman (cousin) who was adopted, find her family ?? She is thrilled and grateful, btw.

That is neat and a great side-product of what I know is hours and hours of research.

[truth_seeker]

That is neat and a great side-product of what I know is hours and hours of research.

My mother and my sister did Ancestry DNA tests. I have my hard copy of my material from 15+ tears ago. And now the LDS site and Ancestry have computerized material, that wasn't there over 15 years back.

So the gal contacts my sister, and we start in from our side. We narrow it down, send her what we had. Her daughter picks it up.

Mother lives in White Horse, Yukon Terr. Daughter lives in Grand Prairie Alberta. Mom was adopted, said to be born in Winnipeg, records sealed until this year. Thinks name was Linn or Linnell.

My records cover my Swedish immigrant ancestors that first settled in Minnesota in the 1850s. I send them my stuff, tell them about other sources, etc.

After a few days the daughter sends some photos from her handwritten family tree on paper n her dining room table. She confirmed they did indeed connect with the Swedes in Minnesota, and a chap that went to Winnipeg.

But that still left out a few generations. In the meantime the provincial records previously sealed, were available if she knew who and where to ask about.

And she filled in one side, and awaits the other in a few weeks.

We got a warm thank you. We are pleased to help, and happy to add nice people to the family.

Early in my research years ago, I surmised that many families would up split between Canada and the US, and that turned out to be true.

In our case, on both mother's side and father's side.

[IsailedawayfromFR]

We are pleased to help, and happy to add nice people to the family.

You may also turn up some not-so-nice ones too.

[Smokin Joe]

You may also turn up some not-so-nice ones too.

Just win the lottery. They'll show up in droves. Fourteenth cousins, even.

[minnesota_bound]

What if We Discovered an Alien Civilization Less Advanced Than Our Own?
Enslave them until their big brother "The Organians" shows up.