The wall is out: Latest GOP offer to avoid shutdown excludes money for border wall

[Frank Cannon]

Here's a mockup of a proposed design.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBVcTLz_8Lk
I don't think they have the concept down. Hey maybe if they build it they could use Lincolns?

LOL. That guy who owned it was a real trip. I found the old Charles Kuralt interview after he built it...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuvO4StUUbo

[DB]

LOL. That guy who owned it was a real trip. I found the old Charles Kuralt interview after he built it...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuvO4StUUbo

The EPA would fine him today for doing that...

[Hondo69]

The EPA would fine him today for doing that...

And he'd have to use Fiats

[DiogenesLamp]

How did funding for the wall end up in the budget in the first place? Thought Mexico was going to pay for it. Yes the Republicans will get a lot of heat here for removing it, but lets not forget the broken promise that got it there in the first place. That ones on you Trump.

Oh stop it.   The plan always was for us to initially pay for the wall and recover our costs through taxing money being sent to Mexico.   


And as with George HW Bush's "read my lips,  no new taxes!"  campaign pledge,  there is nothing wrong with the promise,  what is wrong is the breaking of it. 


Yes,  i'm getting annoyed that Trump feels like he can let this sit for awhile,   but it is not yet time to accuse him of breaking that promise.   


I fully believe the reelection of his administration is completely tied to constructing that wall,  and if he doesn't do it,  he will feel the shame of being defeated in the next election. 

[DiogenesLamp]

They are not kings; they operate in a system where the minority has power, including to shut down the government just like Ted Cruz wanted to do.   

Besides, the wall is a waste of money. 

It is not.   It is a physical manifestation of the will to control our border.  It is a reassurance of a permanence of the policy that Americans want.     We will achieve more real value from it than we ever have from the 21 trillion dollars we have spent on the vote bribing scheme called "The War on Poverty."   

Illegal border crossings are way down;  credit Trump's rhetoric for that.   A physical wall is a metaphor only; 

The effectiveness on that rhetoric is based on the premise that Trump means what he says and will do what he says.   If he does not carry through with the real-world manifestation of his promise,  the effectiveness of his rhetoric will atrophy.   

  A physical wall is a metaphor only;  stop with your childishness that Trump is "breaking promises".    Let's reduce corporate tax rates and juice this economy into boom times.

No arguments here. 

[INVAR]

They control all branches of government and still they negotiate away anything they promised.

Which is why all the lectures about a 'wasted vote' voting for third party Conservatives is laughable.

The fruits are - anyone voting for a Republican is wasting their vote because the Democrat/Leftist agenda will just continue under GOP management.

[DiogenesLamp]

Which is why all the lectures about a 'wasted vote' voting for third party Conservatives is laughable.

The fruits are - anyone voting for a Republican is wasting their vote because the Democrat/Leftist agenda will just continue under GOP management.

Gorsuch alone refutes your assertion. 

[starstruck]

They can pass anything they want under reconciliation as it relates to this budget/debt limit mess.

Why even negotiate with dems?

Because the way I understand it, while the filibustering of judges and appointees was a Senate rule which could be overturned by a simple majority, the Budget Act of 1974 is a Federal Law and has a 3/5 majority requirement on various points.

[Free Vulcan]

Because the way I understand it, while the filibustering of judges and appointees was a Senate rule which could be overturned by a simple majority, the Budget Act of 1974 is a Federal Law and has a 3/5 majority requirement on various points.

OK, now that makes things more clear. They have to negotiate because they have no choice.

[geronl]

Which is why all the lectures about a 'wasted vote' voting for third party Conservatives is laughable.

The fruits are - anyone voting for a Republican is wasting their vote because the Democrat/Leftist agenda will just continue under GOP management.

It's like expecting the end of the Dept of Energy, lol.

[GrouchoTex]

LOL. That guy who owned it was a real trip. I found the old Charles Kuralt interview after he built it...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuvO4StUUbo

I wonder if anyone is still maintaining this, and putting in new Cadillacs?

I haven't driven past it in years.

I think Pink Floyd had something to do with a wall.

I'd like to think that the El Chapo bill could happen, but I guess we will wait and see.

[INVAR]

Gorsuch alone refutes your assertion.

ONE potential anomaly within decades of evidence to support my assertion?  I'm not moved by the notation.

Let's wait to see whether or not Gorshuch makes rulings supporting Conservative principles everyone claims he will.  I recall all the optimism over Roberts, and look what that got us.

I'm not holding my breath - and the fact so many now willingly see the SCOTUS as the last hope or the mechanism to either preserve or change our foundations - proves my contention anyway.

If your hope rests in 9 justices in black robes - then this whole experiment in liberty is already lost and we lie to ourselves that we have a voice in the direction the country goes.

[libertybele]

Gorsuch alone refutes your assertion.

So far that's been the bright spot in all this darkness, but in reality we haven't really experienced any of his rulings.

[truth_seeker]

So far that's been the bright spot in all this darkness, but in reality we haven't really experienced any of his rulings.

Care to expand on what you mean, about "all this darkness?"

Be kind enough, to segregate "darkness" caused by actions solely taken by Trump,

...and "darkness" caused by Congress' inaction, foot-dragging, delay, etc.

...and "darkness" outside the ability of any President.

Then list steps taken by the President, of which you approve.

If you are entirely honest, it will be MORE than just Gorsuch. Cutting the EPA's budget by over 30% for example. Some cabinet appointments.   

[libertybele]

Which is why all the lectures about a 'wasted vote' voting for third party Conservatives is laughable.

The fruits are - anyone voting for a Republican is wasting their vote because the Democrat/Leftist agenda will just continue under GOP management.

I agree; however, the fact still remains that the 'system' was designed to make it more difficult and costly for a 3rd party to win for the very simple fact that they have to adhere to more stringent guidelines in order to qualify and be put on the ballot; someone with very deep pockets may be able to pull it off. Also, a 3rd party would still be operating under the restraints of the other party members elected and seated in the House and Senate.  Perhaps if we were to see an exodus to the Constitution Party (as an example) that included people like Cruz, Lee, Meadows, Paul, Brat, etc., I'd say there would be a real chance of a victory, but the swamp would still exist would it not?

[libertybele]

Care to expand on what you mean, about "all this darkness?"

Be kind enough, to segregate "darkness" caused by actions solely taken by Trump,

...and "darkness" caused by Congress' inaction, foot-dragging, delay, etc.

...and "darkness" outside the ability of any President.

Then list steps taken by the President, of which you approve.

If you are entirely honest, it will be MORE than just Gorsuch. Cutting the EPA's budget by over 30% for example. Some cabinet appointments.

Look, I agree that credit should be given where due.  I've never disputed that.  The fact of the matter is the one issue that Trump campaigned on was the WALL and just about every GOP candidate campaigned on repealing Bammycare.  IMHO Trump has been two eager to back down and surrender.  Yes, I get that Congress holds the wallet ... but again, Trump has a majority to work with ... and I don't see him negotiating or making threats or putting pressure on anyone but conservatives as in the case of Bammycare and as for the wall ... he just flat out backed down.

[XenaLee]

I'll say it again.   I don't give a tinker's damn about any friggin "wall".   It's enough for right now that the immigration laws, already on the books, are being enforced for a refreshing change (from the Obamanation).  And that fact is due to Trump. 

[Sanguine]

I'll say it again.   I don't give a tinker's damn about any friggin "wall".   It's enough for right now that the immigration laws, already on the books, are being enforced for a refreshing change (from the Obamanation).  And that fact is due to Trump.

Yes, his appointee, Jeff Sessions, is doing an awesome job.

[Bigun]

I'll say it again.   I don't give a tinker's damn about any friggin "wall".   It's enough for right now that the immigration laws, already on the books, are being enforced for a refreshing change (from the Obamanation).  And that fact is due to Trump.

And I seem to recall a few people here and elsewhere who were vociferously saying to do just that since way back in the 1st Bush administration!

Something like this IIRC!  "Just enforce the damned laws we already have! We don't need any new ones!"

[DiogenesLamp]

So far that's been the bright spot in all this darkness, but in reality we haven't really experienced any of his rulings.

I have little doubt that his rulings will be an improvement over whatever rulings would have been handed down by Merrick Garland,   or whatever more extreme kook-bat Judge Hillary would have appointed.   


If he turns out to be a Kennedy or a Roberts,  I will still consider ourselves lucky compared to what we could have had alternatively. 

[DiogenesLamp]

I'll say it again.   I don't give a tinker's damn about any friggin "wall".   It's enough for right now that the immigration laws, already on the books, are being enforced for a refreshing change (from the Obamanation).  And that fact is due to Trump.

I agree that he is doing a far better job on this than Hillary would have done,  but he still needs to build that wall.   He must have some construction occurring before the 2020 election. 

[starstruck]

I'll say it again.   I don't give a tinker's damn about any friggin "wall".   It's enough for right now that the immigration laws, already on the books, are being enforced for a refreshing change (from the Obamanation).  And that fact is due to Trump.

And yet that promise is what catapulted him to winning the Republican primaries. I didn't think he was going to do what he promised and therefore didn't vote for him. I can only judge what a person's future actions are going to be based on his past choices. Your standards appear to be much lower. I hope you turn out to be right, but I believe that as the economy improves with no wall, illegal immigration will be rampant. I would do anything to take care of my family, and to think that Mexicans wouldn't is asinine.

[Sighlass]

Well just like most everything Trump promised this too has failed to materialize. Other than a handicapped Sessions appointment, I don't know that Trump has done anything major of note. What few grass roots conservatives he had advising him have either quit or been fired. Even the few immigration measures Trump wanted to put in place seemed to be shut down by legislative liberal judges that are unconstitutionally ruling beyond what power they were given. 

Btw... I wholeheartedly would love to see a wall built. The argument that electronic surveillance (cameras) works is against what I have read. Duncan Hunter's wall worked for the most part dropping illegal crossing in the area by huge amounts. I am surprised others put so much faith in cameras. 

[Smokin Joe]

Here's a mockup of a proposed design.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PBVcTLz_8Lk
I don't think they have the concept down. Hey maybe if they build it they could use Lincolns?

That would never work. Day 1 the hubcaps would be gone...then bit by bit, it would disappear.

[Jazzhead]

Well just like most everything Trump promised this too has failed to materialize. Other than a handicapped Sessions appointment, I don't know that Trump has done anything major of note.

Give him time.   I for one think his tax cut plan, the outlines of which were released yesterday although I don't see any article about it on the board,  is brilliant.