Author Topic: Pew: More Americans now prefer a bigger government with more services to a smaller one with fewer services  (Read 3464 times)

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Online mystery-ak

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Pew: More Americans now prefer a bigger government with more services to a smaller one with fewer services
posted at 10:21 pm on April 24, 2017 by Allahpundit

 

That’s not unheard of, according to Pew, but it’s awfully rare over the last 40 years polling. And it doesn’t seem to be a fluke result in light of yesterday’s NBC poll. That survey found 57 percent saying that government should do more to solve problems and meet the needs of Americans, a 20-year high. Pew asked a different question along the same lines: Do you prefer a bigger government that offers more services or a smaller one that offers fewer services? Result: 48/45. The last time that metric was evenly split was 2008.

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http://hotair.com/archives/2017/04/24/pew-americans-now-prefer-bigger-government-services-smaller-one-fewer-services/

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Offline Frank Cannon

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The national survey by Pew Research Center, conducted April 5-11 among 1,501 adults,

I polling even relevant anymore?

Offline Bigun

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More Americans now prefer a bigger government with more services to a smaller one with fewer services

According to who?  Based on what? Responses to a poll designed to get that result?
« Last Edit: April 25, 2017, 03:22:00 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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I’m sure it’s also partly due to Republicans getting more comfortable with federal spending under Trump.

Mod note:  Comment pulled.  WTF, stop calling TBR posters and site "Mental Midgets" or any related descriptor.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2017, 04:14:13 pm by MOD3 »

Offline jmyrlefuller

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This is a national, and dare I say it, international addiction to Big Government.
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Offline Hurricane Andrew

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Ugh, have we reached a tipping point?  Given the growth of the entitlement state we're on a full scale "Atlas Shrugged" kind of slide...
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Offline Frank Cannon

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According to who?  Based on what? Responses to a poll designed to get that result?

Just remember Pew had Clinton +7 in their last Presidential poll. They have no clue what they are doing.

Offline ABX

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I've been warning this for a while. Even Conservatives who used to claim to be for limited government are wanting more and more a centralized, powerful government that uses the hammer of authority for their own pet issues. They are becoming very similar to liberals in terms of using he hammer of the government, just with different issues.

Offline ABX

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Ugh, have we reached a tipping point?  Given the growth of the entitlement state we're on a full scale "Atlas Shrugged" kind of slide...

We've been tipping towards the European model of right/left for a while, where even the right wants a big, authoritarian government.

Look at how many Conservatives are cheering Le Pen for example, who, by many accounts, is even to the left of some like Ralph Nader on a lot of issues. She is for nationalization of banks and other industries and even signed on to a global economic authority agreement that makes the WTO look like a child's game.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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I've been warning this for a while. Even Conservatives who used to claim to be for limited government are wanting more and more a centralized, powerful government that uses the hammer of authority for their own pet issues. They are becoming very similar to liberals in terms of using he hammer of the government, just with different issues.

Of course. Any of the "collapsing middle class" BS from Zero Hedge sounds identical to what liberals were writing in the 2000's.

Rank hypocrisy and contradiction is rampant in conservatism. Take a look at home many "small government conservatives" are pro-social security or medicare or are on disability.

Offline Free Vulcan

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Of course. Any of the "collapsing middle class" BS from Zero Hedge sounds identical to what liberals were writing in the 2000's.

Rank hypocrisy and contradiction is rampant in conservatism. Take a look at home many "small government conservatives" are pro-social security or medicare or are on disability.

With a sizeable population wanting more govt while we rush headlong into automation, poor education system, and crushing debt, what exactly is the way forward for the middle class?
The Republic is lost.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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With a sizeable population wanting more govt while we rush headlong into automation, poor education system, and crushing debt, what exactly is the way forward for the middle class?

Here you go, a prime example of a "Conservative" begging for the government teet to suckle on!

Offline Free Vulcan

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Here you go, a prime example of a "Conservative" begging for the government teet to suckle on!

I asked the question genius. You've made claims, now give us the scenario. What is the way forward for the middle class?
The Republic is lost.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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I asked the question genius. You've made claims, now give us the scenario. What is the way forward for the middle class?

New jobs/careers are going to have to be created, as they always have. Go look at a list of the top 20 highest paying jobs nowadays for starters.

High pay = high demand. As things become automated, their price comes down, and frees up capital for more productive enterprises.

Read this article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lump_of_labour_fallacy

There is simply not a fixed supply of work to do in the world. Are you suggesting there is a finite amount of programs to program, things to invent, music and art to create. Have we run out of diseases to cure?

Work = problems. When humans have run out of work to do, we will have run out of problems. That is called a post-scarcity economy and would be a good thing.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2017, 03:53:18 pm by Weird Tolkienish Figure »

Offline XenaLee

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Odd, since....

last November's poll (the only one that really counts)...

says differently.  (Psst!  Big-government Democrats like Hillary lost)
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Offline jmyrlefuller

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There is simply not a fixed supply of work to do in the world. Are you suggesting there is a finite amount of programs to program, things to invent, music and art to create. Have we run out of diseases to cure?
Yes, we can run out of things to invent, music and art to create. Once you pass a certain point, you cannot create new without stepping on something that has already been created.

I would also argue that it's also possible to run out of diseases we CAN cure. Despite all our medical efforts, cancer, for example, is more prominent than ever.

Quote
Work = problems. When humans have run out of work to do, we will have run out of problems. That is called a post-scarcity economy and would be a good thing.
No, it means we will have run out of solvable problems, and there will be problems that will never be solved. At that point, we all die. That is a bad thing.
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Offline Idaho_Cowboy

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I've been warning this for a while. Even Conservatives who used to claim to be for limited government are wanting more and more a centralized, powerful government that uses the hammer of authority for their own pet issues. They are becoming very similar to liberals in terms of using he hammer of the government, just with different issues.

Nailed it.
“The way I see it, every time a man gets up in the morning he starts his life over. Sure, the bills are there to pay, and the job is there to do, but you don't have to stay in a pattern. You can always start over, saddle a fresh horse and take another trail.” ― Louis L'Amour

Offline ABX

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Odd, since....

last November's poll (the only one that really counts)...

says differently.  (Psst!  Big-government Democrats like Hillary lost)

Actually, it pretty much reinforced it. Republicans chose a big government politician promising more centralized power on the issues they want and to use the hammer of the government to enforce their desires.

Offline jmyrlefuller

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Odd, since....

last November's poll (the only one that really counts)...

says differently.  (Psst!  Big-government Democrats like Hillary lost)
Lost to a big-government Republican like Trump.

Small-government types had no candidate. Even the staunchly small-government, big-L Libertarians nominated a mid-sized-government liberal.
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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Yes, we can run out of things to invent, music and art to create. Once you pass a certain point, you cannot create new without stepping on something that has already been created.

Really? You think we are reaching the point where nothing new can be created?  :silly:

Quote
I would also argue that it's also possible to run out of diseases we CAN cure. Despite all our medical efforts, cancer, for example, is more prominent than ever.
 No, it means we will have run out of solvable problems, and there will be problems that will never be solved. At that point, we all die. That is a bad thing.

You're a medicinal genius too!  :silly:

Offline Free Vulcan

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New jobs/careers are going to have to be created, as they always have. Go look at a list of the top 20 highest paying jobs nowadays for starters.

High pay = high demand. As things become automated, their price comes down, and frees up capital for more productive enterprises.

Read this article:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lump_of_labour_fallacy

There is simply not a fixed supply of work to do in the world. Are you suggesting there is a finite amount of programs to program, things to invent, music and art to create. Have we run out of diseases to cure?

Work = problems. When humans have run out of work to do, we will have run out of problems. That is called a post-scarcity economy and would be a good thing.

All those vague glossed over generalities do not have any connection to the nuts and bolts of the situation. Schumpeter's theory was great while it lasted, but it always assumed a human link in the chain.

All that is being taken way. For every problem, the solution, the 'job' will be done by robots and AI. It will eventually require 1% of the existing workforce to run it all. It completely breaks the circular flow of income. I don't care how cheap it becomes, if you have no money you can't afford it.

Our education system is not producing people that can fit in that new world of technology. You can't fix or invent machines, even cheap machines, if you don't know how. Those people will have little opportunity for making income. And even if they switch careers, we will have a glut of people in the job market, as it will take very few people to produce enough for the existing population. The circle of income/demand will be broken for a very large segment of our current population.

None of this addresses our debt, taxation, or currency issues.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2017, 04:07:22 pm by Free Vulcan »
The Republic is lost.

Offline jmyrlefuller

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Really? You think we are reaching the point where nothing new can be created?  :silly:
Have you turned on a radio lately?
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Offline roamer_1

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I've been warning this for a while. Even Conservatives who used to claim to be for limited government are wanting more and more a centralized, powerful government that uses the hammer of authority for their own pet issues. They are becoming very similar to liberals in terms of using he hammer of the government, just with different issues.

THEN, quite literally, they are not Conservatives.

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I think we can carry on this discussion without calling each other stupid.  Deal?