Author Topic: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today  (Read 53839 times)

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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #75 on: January 23, 2017, 10:05:31 pm »
I doubt very much that you've "chosen celibacy".   Your seconds of pleasure leads to nine months of burden for the woman.   The decision is hers, bub - it has to be.   

Unless she's raped, the decision is hers.  If she doesn't want a baby, she tells the man, "No!".  And if the man doesn't obey, it's rape.

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #76 on: January 23, 2017, 10:05:59 pm »
Are you inferring that a woman can become pregnant in some other way, excluding rape, than by choice? Are women so ignorant as to not have the capacity to act on the word 'no'? So mindless as to let sexual urges override intelligence?

Actually 'Bub', The decision may be made by her but it's murder. No way around it. And advocating for it is evil defined.

It's not murder.  If it were, you'd be advocating the death penalty or life in prison for a woman who has an abortion.   
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Offline r9etb

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #77 on: January 23, 2017, 10:07:13 pm »
Thank you.  That is the reality, and why it must be the woman's decision.   

Nope. 

Quote
The best way to make abortion obsolete is to make unplanned pregnancies obsolete.

Well, sure.  But in the meantime you seem determined to avoid taking a moral stand on the killing of an unborn child.

Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #78 on: January 23, 2017, 10:08:02 pm »
Unless she's raped, the decision is hers.  If she doesn't want a baby, she tells the man, "No!".  And if the man doesn't obey, it's rape.

Hah!   The usual situation is that both want sex, but when a pregnancy occurs the man heads for the hills (or worse, leans hard on the woman to take care of "her" problem).   
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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #79 on: January 23, 2017, 10:09:02 pm »
So what are you saying?  That a man shouldn't be financially responsible for the child he produces?   That's exactly the attitude that forces so many women to seek abortions - and often, it's the man who leans hard on his partner to take care of his little problem with a trip to PP.

That's not what I'm saying (nice try at putting words into my mouth).  If I say what I'm thinking I'll have a Mod in here slapping me from one side to the other, so I think I'm just going to leave this conversation.  May god have mercy on your soul if @chae ever gets her hands on you.
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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #80 on: January 23, 2017, 10:09:07 pm »
  Your seconds of pleasure leads to nine months of burden for the woman.   

You mean being "punished with a baby"?  Gee, where have I heard that one before?

Offline Norm Lenhart

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #81 on: January 23, 2017, 10:10:50 pm »
It's not murder.  If it were, you'd be advocating the death penalty or life in prison for a woman who has an abortion.

It's murder. You are ending a life that is not asking to be terminated. And even if that someone was, current law defines euthanasia as murder in most places. You don't get to redefine reality to justify your beliefs.

Offline Norm Lenhart

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #82 on: January 23, 2017, 10:12:27 pm »
Hah!   The usual situation is that both want sex, but when a pregnancy occurs the man heads for the hills (or worse, leans hard on the woman to take care of "her" problem).

"You can't always get what you want..."
-Rolling Stones

Wingnut

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #83 on: January 23, 2017, 10:13:57 pm »
You mean being "punished with a baby"?  Gee, where have I heard that one before?

 :pondering:

Offline Norm Lenhart

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #84 on: January 23, 2017, 10:32:25 pm »
:pondering:

"punished with a baby"

I'll take "What is a phrase or concept no conservative ever entertained?" for $1000 Alex

Offline chae

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #85 on: January 23, 2017, 10:58:40 pm »
@r9etb


Life itself is risk.  There is nothing that you do ever that doesn't have inherent risk.  My brother could have died when this crazy lady decided to protest CPS taking her kids by plowing into the side of our house, where my brother's bedroom was.  Everything in life is risky.

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #86 on: January 23, 2017, 10:59:00 pm »
"punished with a baby"

I'll take "What is a phrase or concept no conservative ever entertained?" for $1000 Alex

I don't think we're dealing with a conservative here, Norm.  This the second thread I've been on where he's demonstrated out-an-out leftism.  Living proof TBR tolerates all views.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline Norm Lenhart

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #87 on: January 23, 2017, 11:02:31 pm »
I don't think we're dealing with a conservative here, Norm.  This the second thread I've been on where he's demonstrated out-an-out leftism.  Living proof TBR tolerates all views.

Oh I know. His leftist opinions here are far from new. I just hope people/lurkers here see it for what it is and don't subscribe to the same evil.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2017, 11:03:14 pm by Norm Lenhart »

Wingnut

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #88 on: January 23, 2017, 11:04:16 pm »
Living proof TBR tolerates all views.

Dem Plant!

j/k.....  Jazzy H ain't no plant.  A closeted liberal maybe.   A plant not.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #89 on: January 23, 2017, 11:04:51 pm »
Hoodat,  I have no interest in arguing abortion with you.

Translation:  I am unable to come up with a legal basis for denying Federal and State legislatures the Constitutional right to establish their own laws regarding abortion.


I think it's wrong just as you do

But not as wrong as protecting a unique individual life inside the womb.


but I oppose the government imposing my or your morality on others.

BS.  You are the one her supporting the government imposing the morality of five men in black robes upon the rest of the nation while denying self-determination to the citizenry in shaping the very society in which we live.

States have laws against theft.  These laws impose someone's morality upon the society of a State.  So who gets to decide what set of moral rules are imposed?  The people of that State, of course.  This is how our Founding Fathers intended it.  We the people choose who will govern us.  We the people choose how our society will be shaped.  We the people choose to protect property rights by passing laws against theft.  This wasn't done by five tyrants in black robes.  It was done by the very people who live in that society.  That isn't government-imposed morality.  That is a legally binding moral code chosen by the people, for the people.

Yet you are the one who demand that the citizenry be denied that right.  It is you imposing your morality on the rest of us using the point of a government gun while denying us the ability to assess for our own society exactly where the line should be drawn.

It is you, sir, that sides with tyranny.  It is you forcing your belief on us without recourse.  And it is you that tramples on the Constitution of the United States of America just because you arrogantly think you know what is better for the citizens of Georgia.

This is a decision that every adult woman in America has had the right to make FOR HERSELF for over 40 years now.

And slavery was a decision that every slave owner in American had the right to make for him/herself for over 80 years.


That is how is should be, and must remain.

Again, based upon what?  Emotion?  Seriously, you keep repeating that claim - that it must remain legal.  But you have absolutely zero to back it up.  So we have the Constitution of the United States of America on one side, and your baseless emotional appeal on the other.  How do you suppose those two line up?


I am sick of this issue keeping conservatives and libertarians from advancing their agendas.

I am sick of people pretending to be libertarians yet advocating tyranny.  Upholding the Constitution is my agenda.  What is yours?


It is a narrow issue pushed by religious social conservatives,  and they simply cannot be permitted to have their way, at the expense of the rest of our issues.   

What does religion have to do with this?  It is a Constitutional issue - not a religious one.  Roe would have been equally egregious if it had banned abortion in every state.


Why should any woman agree to the abrogation of the most precious right she possesses?

The most precious right she possesses?  Really?  You actually think that the right to kill a child is the most precious right a woman has?  Wow.  Just wow.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

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"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #90 on: January 23, 2017, 11:06:11 pm »
Dem Plant!

j/k.....  Jazzy H ain't no plant.  A closeted liberal maybe.   A plant not.

Reminds me of "Sakic" at TOS.  (Jazzy, you aren't Sakic, are you?)

Wingnut

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #91 on: January 23, 2017, 11:08:00 pm »
@Hoodat

Hoodie,

Save your breath brother.  Jazzy is like a gas.  He fills all the space available.  Take his space away and all that is left is a popcorn fart.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2017, 11:08:25 pm by Wingnut »

Offline truth_seeker

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #92 on: January 23, 2017, 11:09:15 pm »
Rape is wrong, but women should have no say about it, and certainly not the state.

A rapist must have the right to decide for himself.   Persuade him to do the right thing!

I say an American should be legally able to kill his dog, his cat, his parakeet.

It is not a human, and keeping them may be inconvenient.
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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #93 on: January 23, 2017, 11:12:03 pm »
Dem Plant!

j/k.....  Jazzy H ain't no plant.  A closeted liberal maybe.   A plant not.

Heck, this one ain't even in the closet, Wingding.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline r9etb

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #94 on: January 23, 2017, 11:13:11 pm »
Life itself is risk.  There is nothing that you do ever that doesn't have inherent risk.  My brother could have died when this crazy lady decided to protest CPS taking her kids by plowing into the side of our house, where my brother's bedroom was.  Everything in life is risky.

Quite true.  But my point is that we cannot forget that, for the women we're talking about, being pregnant and having a child is far from cost-free. 

Jazzhead is correct that abortion is currently legal; and the only way to change that is, first, to remind people of the hideous reality of the act itself.  But it also requires us to address the "but, what about" sort of questions that are generally used to disguise the reality of it.

So if we're against abortion, then as a practical matter we should seek ways for women to avoid pregnancy (not that difficult, these days); and for those who are pregnant, make it easier to avoid abortion.

And, of course, to utterly shame and ruin those people and organizations who make millions of years dollars killing babies.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #95 on: January 23, 2017, 11:13:20 pm »
The standard retort to your question is because it's their body.  Somehow that eliminates us totally from the picture...unless of course the woman decides to have the baby then it's only the man's wallet the woman is interested in.

@driftdiver
@txradioguy

I am waiting for the pro-choice position to be applied to men in that men should have a choice whether they want to pay child support or not.  Their wallets.  Their rights.  Government, keep your hands off!
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

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"The [U.S.] Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals ... it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government ... it is not a charter for government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection against the government."

-Ayn Rand-

Offline Norm Lenhart

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #96 on: January 23, 2017, 11:14:37 pm »
Heck, this one ain't even in the closet, Wingding.

More like proudly marching in the Castro District in full leather gear.

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #97 on: January 23, 2017, 11:16:44 pm »
Heck, this one ain't even in the closet, Wingding.

More like proudly marching in the Castro District in full leather gear.

Loud Proud and in assless chaps?

Offline DCPatriot

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #98 on: January 23, 2017, 11:20:29 pm »
So.....a Conservative that doesn't agree with the social conservatives on abortion is deemed a straight out liberal in here?

This is why there isn't a "Religion" category in here.   :police:
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Wingnut

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Re: Trump Signs First Anti Abortion Legislation Today
« Reply #99 on: January 23, 2017, 11:23:25 pm »
So.....a Conservative that doesn't agree with the social conservatives on abortion is deemed a straight out liberal in here?

This is why there isn't a "Religion" category in here.   :police:

Did they serve Tapioca pudding or jello squares for desert at the home tonight?  :laugh: