Linux People Should Say, ‘You’re Welcome, Windows Users’

[Blizzardnh]

If it wasn’t for Linux setting the bar, would Windows users still be dealing with the “blue screen of death” several times a day?

There was a time when a computer operating system called Windows totally dominated the market, and it sucked. I mean, really sucked. Blue screens of death, unexplained crashes, viruses and worms galore, re-re-reboots all the darn time…and still, despite all the problems, people used this Windows thing. Why? Because except for the artsy/hipster $MacOS, it was the only computer OS you could get for your desktop, and it was the one that ran all the 17 jillion programs businesses wanted their office workers to use. Luckily, Windows has gotten a lot better over the years. Except…was it luck or was it Linux that made Windows improve?

Before we get into that, let’s talk about cars for a minute. Specifically Volkswagens, Renaults and Fiats. Once upon a time. American cars ruled our nation’s highways and byways. They were big. They had 738 cubic inch Hemiverberator V-8 engines, and loved to stop at gas stations. But hey! Gas was cheap. A couple of friends, maybe me and Indian Ron, could put $5 worth of premium into the big black Chrysler and cruise Van Nuys Boulevard all night or until we found honeys to ride with us, after which…. Sorry, this is a family website.

the rest. http://fossforce.com/2017/01/linux-people-say-youre-welcome-windows-users/

[ShadowAce]

@BikkFire @geronl @Smokin Joe @roamer_1 @Blizzardnh @markomalley @VarmintAl @Doug Loss @Unlimited @guitar4jesus
@kevindavis

[Sanguine]

Thank you, Linux!

[Oceander]

Honda, Toyota, and Datsun (aka Nissan) should have been thrown in there as well. 

Generally, it probably is correct to say that linux has put some pressure on MS Windows, those more likely in the enterprise area; however, since the consumer editions of Windows are usually pithed versions of the enterprise editions (i.e., certain components are removed), the pressure from linux most likely filtered down to the consumer editions as well.

Now what we need is a first or second tier consumer brand to start offering linux-based systems as OEM.  By that I mean beyond tablets and phones.

[Elderberry]

I started with a Yggdrasil distribution of Linux back in the early 90's on my 386 dual boot machine.

I always said that when I felt that I was lacking in frustration in my life I would boot up in Linux.

[Oceander]

I started with a Yggdrasil distribution of Linux back in the early 90's on my 386 dual boot machine.

I always said that when I felt that I was lacking in frustration in my life I would boot up in Linux.

The first time I tried linux I got so frustrated I managed to get myself suspended from a discussion forum for 3 days.

Linux has come a long way since then, as has my level of patience and my experience, however little, with linux.

[Elderberry]

What I hated with early Linux, was every-time I wanted to load a new program, there were all the dependencies that had to be taken care of first.

What helped in my case was I was using Unix at work.

Now I only use Linux on my phones and my Synology movie server.

[Doug Loss]

What I hated with early Linux, was every-time I wanted to load a new program, there were all the dependencies that had to be taken care of first.

What helped in my case was I was using Unix at work.

Now I only use Linux on my phones and my Synology movie server.

Well, most current Linuxes have software repositories built into the distro installation, which allow you to install any program in the repository with one click, all dependencies taken care of automatically.  For those unusual programs that may not be in the standard repositories you can often find a specialized repository to add to your software manager configuration (which will also take care of all the dependencies).  If not, the installation is usually still much easier than it was back in the days of "configure; make; make install."

[Frank Cannon]

[Oceander]

More or less. 

[Just_Victor]

If it wasn’t for Linux setting the bar, would Windows users still be dealing with the “blue screen of death” several times a day?

In fairness to Microsoft, virtually every BSoD I've ever experienced, I was able to trace to a hardware failure.

[jmyrlefuller]

Generally, it probably is correct to say that linux has put some pressure on MS Windows, those more likely in the enterprise area; however, since the consumer editions of Windows are usually pithed versions of the enterprise editions (i.e., certain components are removed), the pressure from linux most likely filtered down to the consumer editions as well.

Not just that, but the whole open-source software movement in general.

I mean, why buy Photoshop when the GIMP is just as effective? Why spend hundreds on Microsoft Office when LibreOffice does almost all of the same things for free? (Now we have the Google cloud suite on top of that for simpler users, which, not coincidentally, is also free.) Audacity cleans the clock of Windows' built-in "sound recorder." Most anyone would agree Firefox was preferable to Internet Explorer.

I don't think I've ever bought software for any of my laptops in over a decade. I'm an intermediate-level user, but still, I can't say I've ever found myself lacking something I needed.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

Well, most current Linuxes have software repositories built into the distro installation, which allow you to install any program in the repository with one click, all dependencies taken care of automatically.  For those unusual programs that may not be in the standard repositories you can often find a specialized repository to add to your software manager configuration (which will also take care of all the dependencies).  If not, the installation is usually still much easier than it was back in the days of "configure; make; make install."

./configure && make && sudo make install

Never have "." in your PATH, and there's no reason to run configure and make as root.  The && thing is just me being picky.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

Not just that, but the whole open-source software movement in general.

I mean, why buy Photoshop when the GIMP is just as effective? Why spend hundreds on Microsoft Office when LibreOffice does almost all of the same things for free? (Now we have the Google cloud suite on top of that for simpler users, which, not coincidentally, is also free.) Audacity cleans the clock of Windows' built-in "sound recorder." Most anyone would agree Firefox was preferable to Internet Explorer.

I don't think I've ever bought software for any of my laptops in over a decade. I'm an intermediate-level user, but still, I can't say I've ever found myself lacking something I needed.

How about a decent CD ripping program?  grip was everything I'd want, but is no more.  k3b is about the best alternative I can find, but I have to manually configure the save directory instead of having it automatic based on rules using the cddb results, and I can't find an option for quality/mono (most of what I rip is audiobooks).

[JustPassinThru]

No OS is perfect.  I'm using Ubuntu Linux...Linux For Dummies; Linux for the Masses.

It does its share of crashing.  Not completely, but programs...the current gestation of Firefox crashes easily.  Surprisingly, Chromium (De-Googlized Chrome) is much more stable.  It may be that whoever was volunteering his time with earlier editions of Firefox Linux, got a life and moved on.

I deal with the crashes, as I've dealt with forced, unable-to-stop updates when backdoors were found that enabled easy, instantaneous capture of Yoob Toob vids.  Just reach into the TEMP file and pull it out.  Google bought the Yoobs; and Google leaned on Canonical, the non-profit that holds Ubuntu's trademark and archive, to force an update.  That was the end of THAT.

But it's relatively hack-free...no open ports to let bots in.  There's an integral firewall that tightens security MORE.  One tenth the size of Windoze...

I have Windoze Ate on another box JUST for the RARE time I need something that Windoze, only Windoze, can do.  Such as scan documents.  Or communicate with government websites...which I sometimes have to do.  Otherwise, it's Linux all the way.

Tried OSX.  It's stable and it's slick but it's DELIBERATELY blocked of features.  For example, it WILL NOT SEARCH external hard drives.  Obviously the fruit-heads at Apple want everyone to store everything in their "cloud."  No, that ain't happening...I'm not putting password archives, bank records, bootlegged movies, my Napster music collection, up in that cloud so that one of those dweebs can claim I violated copyright laws and dumps it.  Or until it gets hacked...AGAIN.

I'm done with the tree-fruit machines.  FOREVER.

[Frank Cannon]

Not just that, but the whole open-source software movement in general.

I mean, why buy Photoshop when the GIMP is just as effective? Why spend hundreds on Microsoft Office when LibreOffice does almost all of the same things for free? (Now we have the Google cloud suite on top of that for simpler users, which, not coincidentally, is also free.) Audacity cleans the clock of Windows' built-in "sound recorder." Most anyone would agree Firefox was preferable to Internet Explorer.

I don't think I've ever bought software for any of my laptops in over a decade. I'm an intermediate-level user, but still, I can't say I've ever found myself lacking something I needed.

I use the other items like Firefox and Libre, but I always wanted Photoshop and thanks to you I now have a cut rate version. You're my hero. Thanks. Just look at this masterpiece I just created....

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

No OS is perfect.  I'm using Ubuntu Linux...Linux For Dummies; Linux for the Masses.

It does its share of crashing.  Not completely, but programs...the current gestation of Firefox crashes easily.  Surprisingly, Chromium (De-Googlized Chrome) is much more stable.  It may be that whoever was volunteering his time with earlier editions of Firefox Linux, got a life and moved on.

I deal with the crashes, as I've dealt with forced, unable-to-stop updates when backdoors were found that enabled easy, instantaneous capture of Yoob Toob vids.  Just reach into the TEMP file and pull it out.  Google bought the Yoobs; and Google leaned on Canonical, the non-profit that holds Ubuntu's trademark and archive, to force an update.  That was the end of THAT.

But it's relatively hack-free...no open ports to let bots in.  There's an integral firewall that tightens security MORE.  One tenth the size of Windoze...

I have Windoze Ate on another box JUST for the RARE time I need something that Windoze, only Windoze, can do.  Such as scan documents.  Or communicate with government websites...which I sometimes have to do.  Otherwise, it's Linux all the way.

Tried OSX.  It's stable and it's slick but it's DELIBERATELY blocked of features.  For example, it WILL NOT SEARCH external hard drives.  Obviously the fruit-heads at Apple want everyone to store everything in their "cloud."  No, that ain't happening...I'm not putting password archives, bank records, bootlegged movies, my Napster music collection, up in that cloud so that one of those dweebs can claim I violated copyright laws and dumps it.  Or until it gets hacked...AGAIN.

I'm done with the tree-fruit machines.  FOREVER.

Interesting.  I use a RedHat 6 derivative and I don't remember the last time I had a real crash of app or OS (save for trying to install RH7, until I figured out that it -- probably kernel 3.x actually -- won't boot with AMD cool-n-quiet enabled). But then, I don't use javascript/flash/etc, I don't let applications self update, etc.

I've actually been thinking about looking at Ubuntu for the LTS (Long Term Support) line, as a lot of folks are using it for openstack.

If you're seeing crashes, something's wrong.  It doesn't need to be that way.

BTW, if by "scan documents" you mean using a scanner to save paper documents to pdf, et al, you might want to take a look at xsane it you haven't.  I've never figured out how to scan multiple page documents with it, but then 99% of what I scan are single page anyway, so I've never put much effort into it either.

[JustPassinThru]

Interesting.  I use a RedHat 6 derivative and I don't remember the last time I had a real crash of app or OS (save for trying to install RH7, until I figured out that it -- probably kernel 3.x actually -- won't boot with AMD cool-n-quiet enabled). But then, I don't use javascript/flash/etc, I don't let applications self update, etc.

I've actually been thinking about looking at Ubuntu for the LTS (Long Term Support) line, as a lot of folks are using it for openstack.

If you're seeing crashes, something's wrong.  It doesn't need to be that way.

BTW, if by "scan documents" you mean using a scanner to save paper documents to pdf, et al, you might want to take a look at xsane it you haven't.  I've never figured out how to scan multiple page documents with it, but then 99% of what I scan are single page anyway, so I've never put much effort into it either.

I never had crashes with earlier versions of Ubuntu.  I started with, IIRC, Ubuntu 8...someone steered me over there.  I'd tried RedHat around 2002, off a CD, and it didn't work hardly at all with the Wintel boxes of the time.  I had three, two bought secondhand, out of an office-furniture liquidator's; and then an HP.  Two old P2 boxes and one Pentium IV.  Didn't work on any of them.

Already I was cloning my HD with Ghost, saving Windows 2000; so I could wipe the hard-drive and install RedHat.  Dual Booting wasn't around then.

RedHat didn't recognize my modem and ran at an incredibly-slow pace.  I don't know if that distro was supposed to be intentionally kludgy, as a teaching tool, for programmer wannabees to open it up and rewrite it...but it was unworkable.  Later I'd see Red Hat for sale in CompUSA.  Uh-uh, brother...

In that environment Ubuntu was a revelation.  Went in easily and painlessly and WORKED.  EVERY time.

Versions 8, and 9, didn't crash. Version 10 was the one they forced the patch to seal the flash-video backdoor...interestingly, I'd tried any number of ways to capture FLV vids and nothing worked, and then one day I was on a Ubuntu discussion board, and it was spelled right out there.  I tried it immediately, and it worked just like the poster said.

Two months later I made the mistake of booting my machine while the Ethernet cable was plugged in and the modem on.  Forced-update...and that was the end of my Yoob Toob video library.  I did at least get the full World at War series...

Only starting with version 14, have I had frequent crashes.  The more updated version, 16, it happens more frequently.  I have the two side-by-side on this old Toshiba machine.  Toshiba used to work flawlessly with Ubuntu, but maybe they're using different test mules now.

[DB]

How about a decent CD ripping program?  grip was everything I'd want, but is no more.  k3b is about the best alternative I can find, but I have to manually configure the save directory instead of having it automatic based on rules using the cddb results, and I can't find an option for quality/mono (most of what I rip is audiobooks).

This is the best CD ripping software I'm aware of:
https://www.dbpoweramp.com/

I rip to FLAC which is lossless so there's no need to ever rip it again and from there you can batch convert to any other common standard. I've used it to rip tens of thousands of songs.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

I never had crashes with earlier versions of Ubuntu.  I started with, IIRC, Ubuntu 8...someone steered me over there.  I'd tried RedHat around 2002, off a CD, and it didn't work hardly at all with the Wintel boxes of the time.  I had three, two bought secondhand, out of an office-furniture liquidator's; and then an HP.  Two old P2 boxes and one Pentium IV.  Didn't work on any of them.

Already I was cloning my HD with Ghost, saving Windows 2000; so I could wipe the hard-drive and install RedHat.  Dual Booting wasn't around then.

RedHat didn't recognize my modem and ran at an incredibly-slow pace.  I don't know if that distro was supposed to be intentionally kludgy, as a teaching tool, for programmer wannabees to open it up and rewrite it...but it was unworkable.  Later I'd see Red Hat for sale in CompUSA.  Uh-uh, brother...

In that environment Ubuntu was a revelation.  Went in easily and painlessly and WORKED.  EVERY time.

Versions 8, and 9, didn't crash. Version 10 was the one they forced the patch to seal the flash-video backdoor...interestingly, I'd tried any number of ways to capture FLV vids and nothing worked, and then one day I was on a Ubuntu discussion board, and it was spelled right out there.  I tried it immediately, and it worked just like the poster said.

Two months later I made the mistake of booting my machine while the Ethernet cable was plugged in and the modem on.  Forced-update...and that was the end of my Yoob Toob video library.  I did at least get the full World at War series...

Only starting with version 14, have I had frequent crashes.  The more updated version, 16, it happens more frequently.  I have the two side-by-side on this old Toshiba machine.  Toshiba used to work flawlessly with Ubuntu, but maybe they're using different test mules now.

Dual booting has been around since at least the early 90's, FWIW.

You probably had a "softmodem" or "winmodem".  My Toshiba laptop around that time had one.  Basically, modem makers left a lot of the hardware out and relied on making it up in software to save money.  But if they wouldn't release programming info, OSS was kind of screwed.  I think I actually bought a commercial modem driver.

Back in 2002, you could get RedHat Linux at CompUSA, or download it.  It's really not the same thing that we refer to as RedHat today (technically, RedHat Enterprise Linux or RHEL).  RHEL is made for machines that just need to work, and keep working.  While it costs big money to support, you can also get free versions such as CentOS or Scientific Linux.  What replaced the old RH distro is now known as Fedora.  It's "bleeding edge", only patched for about 13-18 months, and really doesn't play well with being upgraded (or it didn't used to, I got sick of running an OS where you were expected to reinstall around once a year and went to a RHEL based distro).  Not entirely like, or unlike, the relationship between Ubuntu and Debian.

But again, if it's crashing, something's wrong.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

This is the best CD ripping software I'm aware of:
https://www.dbpoweramp.com/

I rip to FLAC which is lossless so there's no need to ever rip it again and from there you can batch convert to any other common standard. I've used it to rip tens of thousands of songs.

Thanks, but that looks like commercial software, and jmyrlefuller said:

"I don't think I've ever bought software for any of my laptops in over a decade. I'm an intermediate-level user, but still, I can't say I've ever found myself lacking something I needed."

Also, I don't see Ogg Vorbis support.

[JustPassinThru]

Yeah, Fedora was what it was.

Nothing in the loading process asked for, or invited, dual-booting or partitioning of the hard drive.  I remember when I first went to Windoze...98.  I asked around at the time if there was any sort of dual boot partitioning or ability to boot off an external drive...at the time I was trying to learn at hackers' boards and wanted to load up my machine with stolen music and movies.

I was told, no way.  Put a second HD in your box, and switch cables when you're out to smash-and-grab.  Can't dual boot and you don't want to dare have a virus cross the partition anyway.

Then, Ubuntu.  Nice, easy and slick.  It went in good with my custom-box with an Asus motherboard; but even better in the Toshiba laptop at the time.  I've had troubles since with Ubuntu, but never, until recently, on Toshibas.  Since my Asus EeePC died, Toshibas have been all I've had, except for my brief return to Apple.  I guess an iMac wasn't punishment enough.

I don't like how Ubuntu rewrites everything, almost overnight every night, but I do like the huge repository of apps and programs.  I have three browsers, Tor, two movie players...everything but the driver to run my Epsom scanner.

[DB]

Thanks, but that looks like commercial software, and jmyrlefuller said:

"I don't think I've ever bought software for any of my laptops in over a decade. I'm an intermediate-level user, but still, I can't say I've ever found myself lacking something I needed."

Also, I don't see Ogg Vorbis support.

You didn't look very hard:
http://www.dbpoweramp.com/codec-central-ogg-vorbis.htm

I reward people who produce tools that make my life easier and do what I want to do. That's how you get people to make those tools. It isn't expensive and saves a lot of my time and my time has value.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

Yeah, Fedora was what it was.

Nothing in the loading process asked for, or invited, dual-booting or partitioning of the hard drive.  I remember when I first went to Windoze...98.  I asked around at the time if there was any sort of dual boot partitioning or ability to boot off an external drive...at the time I was trying to learn at hackers' boards and wanted to load up my machine with stolen music and movies.

I was told, no way.  Put a second HD in your box, and switch cables when you're out to smash-and-grab.  Can't dual boot and you don't want to dare have a virus cross the partition anyway.

Then, Ubuntu.  Nice, easy and slick.  It went in good with my custom-box with an Asus motherboard; but even better in the Toshiba laptop at the time.  I've had troubles since with Ubuntu, but never, until recently, on Toshibas.  Since my Asus EeePC died, Toshibas have been all I've had, except for my brief return to Apple.  I guess an iMac wasn't punishment enough.

I don't like how Ubuntu rewrites everything, almost overnight every night, but I do like the huge repository of apps and programs.  I have three browsers, Tor, two movie players...everything but the driver to run my Epsom scanner.

Since I was dual booting off a single hard drive in the early 90's, I'd say you were misinformed.

[InHeavenThereIsNoBeer]

You didn't look very hard:
http://www.dbpoweramp.com/codec-central-ogg-vorbis.htm

I reward people who produce tools that make my life easier and do what I want to do. That's how you get people to make those tools. It isn't expensive and saves a lot of my time and my time has value.

No, I didn't.  I followed the provided link, and found:

"Supports FLAC, mp3, m4a (Apple Lossless, AAC for iTunes & iPod), Windows Media Audio (wma), Wave and AIFF."  No mention of .ogg.

Then I looked at the next link you provided, and saw that it requires windows, which makes it pretty much useless.