Author Topic: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico  (Read 2650 times)

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Offline kevindavis007

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Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« on: November 24, 2016, 01:55:06 am »

A giant deposit of buried ice on Mars contains about as much water as Lake Superior does here on Earth, a new study reports.


The ice layer, which spans a greater area than the state of New Mexico, lies in Mars' mid-northern latitudes and is covered by just 3 feet to 33 feet (1 to 10 meters) of soil. It therefore represents a vast possible resource for future astronauts exploring the Red Planet, study team members said.


"This deposit is probably more accessible than most water ice on Mars, because it is at a relatively low latitude and it lies in a flat, smooth area where landing a spacecraft would be easier than at some of the other areas with buried ice," co-author Jack Holt, of the University of Texas, Austin, said in a statement


The researchers, led by Cassie Stuurman of the Institute for Geophysics at the University of Texas, analyzed observations of Mars' Utopia Planitia region made by the ground-penetrating Shallow Radar (SHARAD) instrument aboard NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. They focused on this area because Utopia Planitia features "scalloped depressions" similar to landscapes in the Canadian Arctic that lie atop buried ice.


Data gathered by SHARAD during 600 MRO passes over Utopia Planitia revealed the deposit between 39 and 49 degrees north latitude. The layer ranges in thickness from 260 feet to 560 feet (80 to 170 m) and is made up of 50 to 85 percent water ice, researchers said. (The remainder is dirt and rock.)


That puts the deposit's water volume roughly on a par with that of Lake Superior, the largest of the Great Lakes, which holds 2,900 cubic miles (12,090 cubic kilometers) of the wet stuff.


SHARAD is capable of distinguishing between layers of liquid and frozen water, and the instrument's data indicate that all of the Utopia Planitia water is ice at the moment. That's bad news for anyone hoping to find evidence of Mars life, because life here on Earth is intimately tied to liquid water.


But there may have been some melting in the past, during times when Mars' poles were tilted at a different angle, researchers said. The planet has a 25-degree lean at the moment, but this axial tilt varies to about 50 degrees over a 120,000-year cycle.


Read More: http://www.isn-news.net/2016/11/huge-underground-ice-deposit-on-mars-is.html
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Offline Cripplecreek

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2016, 01:59:12 am »
I'll sail on the River Iss.

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2016, 02:38:00 am »
I'll sail on the River Iss.


That could make a lot of Beer on Mars..
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Offline DB

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2016, 02:49:08 am »
That's big news. Now add some greenhouses and you can grow food.

Isn't the biggest problem at this point radiation exposure due to no magnetic field and a thin atmosphere?

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2016, 02:56:56 am »
That's big news. Now add some greenhouses and you can grow food.

Isn't the biggest problem at this point radiation exposure due to no magnetic field and a thin atmosphere?

I think those are the two primary problems with Mars.  The thin atmosphere can be dealt with using suits and sealed vehicles, but dealing with the radiation is harder.

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2016, 03:28:13 am »
I think those are the two primary problems with Mars.  The thin atmosphere can be dealt with using suits and sealed vehicles, but dealing with the radiation is harder.


Living underground or under the rocks can solve the radiation problem..  That is why I think trying to find a planet outside our solar system and ways to get there fast should be a top priority. I see Mars as a backup plan for humanity, however, either a black hole or a Neutron star can destroy our system.
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Offline DB

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2016, 03:31:25 am »

Living underground or under the rocks can solve the radiation problem..  That is why I think trying to find a planet outside our solar system and ways to get there fast should be a top priority. I see Mars as a backup plan for humanity, however, either a black hole or a Neutron star can destroy our system.

How much soil/rock does it take to provide an effective barrier? Just an educated guess is close enough (please don't work for the answer if you don't know).

Offline kevindavis007

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2016, 03:37:01 am »
How much soil/rock does it take to provide an effective barrier? Just an educated guess is close enough (please don't work for the answer if you don't know).


I don't know..
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Online Elderberry

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #9 on: November 24, 2016, 03:48:32 am »

Sept. 30, 2015
Real Martians: How to Protect Astronauts from Space Radiation on Mars

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/real-martians-how-to-protect-astronauts-from-space-radiation-on-mars


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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #10 on: November 24, 2016, 03:50:01 am »
Calculated Risks: How Radiation Rules Manned Mars Exploration
By Sheyna E. Gifford, MD, Astrobiology Magazine | February 18, 2014 04:02pm ET

http://www.space.com/24731-mars-radiation-curiosity-rover.html


Oceander

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #11 on: November 24, 2016, 03:54:12 am »
How much soil/rock does it take to provide an effective barrier? Just an educated guess is close enough (please don't work for the answer if you don't know).

Interestingly enough, water is a  fairly good shield, so living under this water deposit might provide the necessary protection. 

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2016, 05:50:48 am »
Interestingly enough, water is a  fairly good shield, so living under this water deposit might provide the necessary protection.
If you don't mind that constant drip...drip....drip...

Ice miners! The question is one of what's in the water?

I wonder if the pockmarks are impacts that melted the underlying water, collapsed the overburden and refroze, with the ice sublimating until it was covered back up?
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Offline DB

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #13 on: November 24, 2016, 07:11:32 am »
Sept. 30, 2015
Real Martians: How to Protect Astronauts from Space Radiation on Mars

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/real-martians-how-to-protect-astronauts-from-space-radiation-on-mars

Thank you for the link. That was interesting. For the most part it looks like it should be manageable.

Offline Gefn

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #14 on: November 24, 2016, 07:52:21 am »
Ping @Hopalong Ginsberg:seeya:

Are you feeling Deimosian today? 
« Last Edit: November 24, 2016, 07:53:21 am by Freya »
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Offline EC

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #15 on: November 24, 2016, 08:12:56 am »
How much soil/rock does it take to provide an effective barrier? Just an educated guess is close enough (please don't work for the answer if you don't know).

36 inches of packed dirt provides enough protection from the radiation of a nuclear blast a mile away for you to survive with no ill effects. Ground zero survival has never been really studied, since radiation is the least of your worries there! Gamma rays are far more penetrating (but far less damaging) than high energy protons.
Assuming Solar radiation is primarily high energy protons, similar to cosmic rays (It's a fudge, but a reasonably valid assumption) and looking at the energy levels recorded by the ISS, both mean and storm max, you would need approximately 20 feet of solid rock to be safe. You could get away with less of a denser material, or if you charged the shielding. Me. I'd go about 100 feet straight down.
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Offline Cripplecreek

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #16 on: November 24, 2016, 11:27:10 am »
36 inches of packed dirt provides enough protection from the radiation of a nuclear blast a mile away for you to survive with no ill effects. Ground zero survival has never been really studied, since radiation is the least of your worries there! Gamma rays are far more penetrating (but far less damaging) than high energy protons.
Assuming Solar radiation is primarily high energy protons, similar to cosmic rays (It's a fudge, but a reasonably valid assumption) and looking at the energy levels recorded by the ISS, both mean and storm max, you would need approximately 20 feet of solid rock to be safe. You could get away with less of a denser material, or if you charged the shielding. Me. I'd go about 100 feet straight down.

The thin atmosphere of mars does provide some protection so you wouldn't be totally exposed like on the moon. As I understand it the ambient radiation on the surface is similar to that on the space station but there are dangerous spikes.

Water is a good shielding material because the hydrogen absorbs the radiation then re emits it in a less dangerous form.

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #17 on: November 25, 2016, 05:05:44 am »
Interestingly enough, water is a  fairly good shield, so living under this water deposit might provide the necessary protection.

Good for a sci-fi story or two

Offline uglybiker

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #18 on: November 25, 2016, 10:46:29 am »
Gamma rays are far more penetrating (but far less damaging) than high energy protons.

Except for that whole....turning green when you get irritable....thing.  :whistle:
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Offline EC

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #19 on: November 25, 2016, 12:09:56 pm »
Except for that whole....turning green when you get irritable....thing.  :whistle:

That's a feature, not a bug. (Just dealt with customer support here ... )
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Offline 240B

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Re: Huge Underground Ice Deposit on Mars Is Bigger Than New Mexico
« Reply #20 on: November 25, 2016, 12:16:41 pm »

Martian Scotch on the rocks. What better way is there to celebrate not being dead? (yet)
« Last Edit: November 25, 2016, 12:18:18 pm by 240B »
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