Author Topic: Measuring the Future  (Read 5266 times)

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Online bigheadfred

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #25 on: November 10, 2016, 07:49:15 AM »
@Smokin Joe

There was something about carmakers voiding engine warranties for using E15. Don't know if that holds true today.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #26 on: November 10, 2016, 08:38:59 AM »
@Smokin Joe

There was something about carmakers voiding engine warranties for using E15. Don't know if that holds true today.
I'm not sure about the warranties, but the "Blend Wall", the maximum recommended for the average or existing auto engine is 10%. Beyond that, damage is expected.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #27 on: November 10, 2016, 09:06:57 AM »
More promises: Compiled by Jenna Johnson, in the Washington Post article at the link Additional commentary and links are available there. Note: These may overlap the ones in the initial post. Again, this is done in the spirit of being able to compare stated goals with performance, and is not intended to commend nor decry Mr Trump, the President-elect.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/01/22/here-are-76-of-donald-trumps-many-campaign-promises/

Quote
1. Build a wall along the southern border that's taller than the arenas where Trump holds his rallies, taller than any ladder and one foot taller than the Great Wall of China. This "artistically beautiful" wall will be constructed out of hardened concrete, rebar and steel, and it will be "the greatest wall that you've ever seen" -- so great that the nation will likely one day name it "The Trump Wall."

2. Make Mexico pay for the wall. If Mexico refuses, then the United States will impound all remittance payments taken from the wages of illegal immigrants, cut foreign aid, institute tariffs, cancel visas for Mexican business leaders and diplomats, and increase fees for visas, border-crossing cards and port use.

3. "If I become president, we're all going to be saying 'Merry Christmas' again."

4. Get rid of Common Core because it's "a disaster" and a "very bad thing." Trump says he wants to give local school districts more control and might even eliminate the Department of Education.

5. The Environmental Protection Agency might also disappear.

6. Get rid of Obamacare and replace it with something "terrific" that is "so much better, so much better, so much better."

7. Knock down the regulatory walls between states for health insurance, making plans available nationally instead of regionally.

8. Rebuild the country's aging infrastructure -- especially bridges and airports that look like they belong in a third-world country -- for one-third of what the United States is currently paying for such projects.

9. Save Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security without cutting benefits.

10. Defund Planned Parenthood.

11. "I will take care of women, and I have great respect for women. I do cherish women, and I will take care of women."

12. Frequently use the term "radical Islamic terrorism."

13. Temporarily ban most foreign Muslims from entering the United States "until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on." Trump would allow exceptions for dignitaries, business people, athletes and others who have "proven" themselves.

14. Bar Syrian refugees from entering the country and kick out any who are already living here. Trump says wealthy Persian Gulf nations like Saudi Arabia should pay to set up a heavily guarded "safe zone" in Syria.

15. Heavily surveil mosques in the United States. Trump has said he's open to the idea of closing some mosques.

16. Create a database of Syrian refugees. Trump hasn't ruled out creating a database of Muslims in the country.

17. Never take a vacation while serving as president.

18. Prosecute Hillary Clinton for her use of a private e-mail server while serving as secretary of state.
http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,235298.0/topicseen.html
pending verification.


19. Make medical marijuana widely available to patients, and allow states to decide if they want to fully legalize pot or not.

20. Stop spending money on space exploration until the United States can fix its potholes. Encourage private space-exploration companies to expand.

21. Pick Supreme Court justices who are "really great legal scholars."

22. Ensure that Iowa continues to host the nation's first presidential nominating contest.

23. Strengthen the military so that it's "so big and so strong and so great" that "nobody's going to mess with us."

24. Be unpredictable. "No one is going to touch us, because I'm so unpredictable."

25. Allow Russia to deal with the Islamic State in Syria and/or work with Russian President Vladimir Putin to wipe out shared enemies.

26. "Bomb the s--- out of ISIS." Also bomb oil fields controlled by the Islamic State, then seize the oil and give the profits to military veterans who were wounded while fighting.

27. Target and kill the relatives of terrorists.

28. Shut down parts of the Internet so that Islamic State terrorists cannot use it to recruit American children.

29. Bring back waterboarding, which the Obama administration considers torture. Trump has said he's willing to use interrogation techniques that go even further than waterboarding. Even if such tactics don't work, "they deserve it anyway, for what they're doing."

30. Leave troops in Afghanistan because it's such "a mess." Protect Israel. And increase U.S. military presence in the East and South China Seas.

31. Find an "out" clause in the Iran deal and then "totally" renegotiate the whole thing.

32. "I promise I will never be in a bicycle race. That I can tell you." (This promise is connected to criticism of Secretary of State John F. Kerry, who was injured while riding a bicycle amid the Iran negotiations.)

33. Refuse to call Iran's leader by his preferred title. "I guarantee you I will be never calling him the Supreme Leader... I'll say, 'Hey baby, how ya doing?' I will never call him the Supreme Leader."

34. Negotiate the release of all U.S. prisoners held in Iran before taking office. > snip <

35. Oppose the killing of journalists: "I hate some of these people, but I would never kill them."

36. Find great generals -- like the next Gen. Patton or Gen. MacArthur -- and do not allow them to go onto television news shows to explain their military strategy: "I don't want my generals being interviewed, I want my generals kicking a--." > snip<

37. Drop that "dirty, rotten traitor" Bowe Bergdahl out of an airplane into desolate Afghanistan without a parachute.

38. Fire "the corrupt and incompetent" leaders of the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs and dramatically reform the agency. Allow veterans to take their military identification card to any medical facility that accepts Medicaid patients to receive care. Embed satellite VA clinics in rural hospitals and underserved areas, and ensure than every VA hospital is permanently staffed with OBGYN doctors.

39. Invest more heavily in programs that help military veterans transition back to civilian life, including job training and placement services. Also increase funding for the treatment of post-traumatic stress disorder, traumatic brain injuries and mental health issues. Veterans who apply for a job at a VA facility will have five points added to their qualifying scores.

40. Bring back jobs from China -- and Mexico, Japan and elsewhere.

41. "I will be the greatest jobs president that God ever created." Trump says cities like Reno, Nev., will "be a big fat beautiful beneficiary" of these new jobs.

42. Students at Wofford College in South Carolina, where Trump attended a town hall, will all have jobs at graduation.

43. Aggressively challenge China's power in the world by declaring the country a currency manipulator, adopting a "zero tolerance policy on intellectual property theft and forced technology transfer" and cracking down on China's "lax labor and environmental standards."

44. Rather than throw the Chinese president a state dinner, buy him "a McDonald's hamburger and say we've got to get down to work."

45. Replace "free trade" with "fair trade." Gather together the "smartest negotiators in the world," assign them each a country and renegotiate all foreign trade deals.

46. Put billionaire hedge fund manager Carl Icahn in charge of trade negotiations with China and Japan, and pick an ambassador to Japan who is "a killer," unlike the current ambassador, Caroline Kennedy.

47. Tell Ford Motor Co.'s president that unless he cancels plans to build a massive plant in Mexico, the company will face a 35 percent tax on cars imported back into the United States. Trump is confident he can get this done before taking office. (Last year he incorrectly said this had already happened.)

48. Force Nabisco to once again make Oreos in the United States. And bully Apple into making its "damn computers" and other products here.

49. Impose new taxes on many imports into the country. Numbers thrown around have included 32 percent, 34 percent and 35 percent.

50. Grow the nation's economy by at least 6 percent.

51. Reduce the $18 trillion national debt by "vigorously eliminating waste, fraud and abuse in the federal government, ending redundant government programs and growing the economy to increase tax revenues."

52. Cut the budget by 20 percent by simply renegotiating.

53. Get rid of the Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act.

54. Simplify the U.S. tax code and reduce the number of tax brackets from seven to four. The highest earners would pay a 25-percent tax. The corporate tax rate would fall to 15 percent. Eliminate the "marriage penalty" for taxpayers and get rid of the alternate minimum tax.

55. No longer charge income tax to single individuals earning less than $25,000 per year or couples earning less than $50,000. These people will, however, be required to file a one-page form with the Internal Revenue Service that states: "I win."

56. Ensure that Americans can still afford to golf.

57. Allow corporations a one-time window to transfer money being held overseas, charging a much-reduced 10 percent tax.

58. Get rid of most corporate tax loopholes or incentives, but continue to allow taxpayers to deduct mortgage interest and charitable donations from their taxes.

59. On his first day in office, Trump would get rid of gun-free zones at military bases and in schools.

60. Use "common sense" to fix the mental health system and prevent mass shootings. Find ways to arm more of the "good guys" like him who can take out the "sickos." Get rid of bans on certain types of guns and magazines so that "good, honest people" can own the guns of their choice.

61. Impose a minimum sentence of five years in federal prison for any violent felon who commits a crime using a gun, with no chance for parole or early release.

62. Fix the background check system used when purchasing guns to ensure states are properly uploading criminal and health records.

63. Allow concealed-carry permits to be recognized in all 50 states.

64. Sign an executive order calling for the death penalty for anyone found guilty of killing a police officer.

65. Provide more funding for police training.

66. And provide more funding for drug treatment, especially for heroin addicts.

67. On the first day in office, terminate President Obama's executive orders related to immigration. This includes getting rid of "sanctuary cities" that Trump says have become refuges for criminals.

68. Deport the almost 11 million immigrants illegally living in the United States.

69. Triple the number of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officers.

70. Continue to allow lowly paid foreign workers to come to the United States on temporary works visas because Trump says they are the only ones who want to pick grapes.

71. End birthright citizenship.

72. Say things that are politically incorrect, because the country does not have time to waste with political correctness. 73. Make America great again -- and strong again, as it has become too weak. 74. Be a cheerleader for America and bring the country's spirit back. "Take the brand of the United States and make it great again."

75. Bring back the American Dream.

76. Start winning again. "We're going to win so much -- win after win after win -- that you're going to be begging me: 'Please, Mr. President, let us lose once or twice. We can't stand it any more.' And I'm going to say: 'No way. We're going to keep winning. We're never going to lose. We're never, ever going to lose."
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 03:27:51 AM by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression
And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses. Nehemiah 4:14 (KJV)

About the only "Big" Liberals don't revile is "Big Government"

Online LateForLunch

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #28 on: November 10, 2016, 10:17:37 AM »
Thanks of that list and commentary Joe.

Given what Trump has been, and is - according to his fruits, statements and interviews, I do not expect much of that list to be accomplished or even attempted outside of lip service and perhaps some more kabuki theater.

I am immune from being disappointed in any failure of those things he said he would do from ever coming to fruition because I never believed he was serious about doing any of those things.   And, some of the things he said he intended to do - the Executive has no power to do or interfere with.

Low or non-existent expectations in Trump's leadership does provide me with the opportunity to be surprised in the positive, should he actually attempt to make good on those things beyond the rhetoric to placate the crowds and get votes, but I am not expecting much if any fulfillment at all.  i.e.:, Trump's stated plan to "fix" Obamacare is to do exactly what the Democrats intended Obamacare to achieve in the first place: to impose Single Payer and expand the mandate that every person in the country must be 'covered'.

What I am going to be most watchful of - is the circumvention, the sidestepping, or the wholesale ignoring of the Rule of Law and the Constitution that both parties, the Courts and the Obama regime have made SOP.   I think there is real danger in Trump following lawless precedents set by Obama, given his only experience is acting as a sole dictator (which all CEOs of your own corporation are).   This Republic is not a corporation, and the Constitution does not provide for Trump to run the country like his own private business.  He has imposed limits, and it is already disconcerting to read people who claim to be Conservative, opining and hoping that Trump use his own pen and phone as Obama has.

 I will be very sensitive to moves, statements and actions which will further entrench the Executive into the dictatorship the GOP leadership under Boehner, McConnell, Pelosi and Reid have already enabled and established.  I have no faith that Trump is going to slow, stop or reverse what we have been fundamentally transformed into already - but that said - I am better positioned to be pleasantly surprised should that discernment prove wrong.

But we are dealing with government - and chances are - my discernment about that is more correct than not.

We shall see.

Not a bad commentary from both Smokin' Joe, Invar and the whole thread. That's what I'm talkin' about !!

The only thing that I think might be a little unfair would be to expect President Trump not to utilize some of the enlarged scope of executive power created by the Eightball Obama to UNDO some of the destructive things that were done with it.

Of course that recalls the famous line from Star Wars when Senator Palpatine swears that he will," relinquish these emergency powers I have been granted the second that order is restored to the Republic." Of course, he had absolutely no intention of ever giving up those powers and immediately used them to help to create the Empire and become Emperor.

That is a razor's edge that will require both wisdom and restraint for a leader to walk. Let us hope that President Trump has an ample supply of both. 
« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 10:47:48 AM by LateForLunch »
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Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #29 on: November 10, 2016, 01:03:18 PM »
@sneakypete

You ain't got a leg to stand on. The fed gov is the largest land owner in every state in the west. We don't need em all up in our business. Gating everything off like we ain't got a right.




@roamer_1

How does that negate ANYTHING I wrote about Yellowstone,for example?
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Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #30 on: November 10, 2016, 01:06:31 PM »


 I would much rather see ethanol on the market as an option rather than a requirement, and let the market decide.

@Smokin Joe

The days when ethanol marketing,or anything else is left up to the consumers are long ago in a distant land,and will never be seen again. Big Massa Goobermint knows what is best for us.
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Online roamer_1

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #31 on: November 10, 2016, 03:38:05 PM »

How does that negate ANYTHING I wrote about Yellowstone,for example?

In the first place, the fed ain't supposed to own land, beyond govt buildings, military bases and etc.
That being said, I have no real objection to a natl park here and there... Hell, I didn't even mind federal forests when they were held for the people - That ain't so anymore.

Hell, you can't hardly piss on the ground around here without some federal sh*tbag showing up and declaring it a national wetland, and another one showing up two days later to claim all the land from that spot to the nearest river as an 'eagle flyway'.

They ain't managing the land 'for the people', they're shutting us out of it, and shutting it off.
Try to find someplace to go four wheeling. I got rid of my mud truck because there wasn't a mudhole left - they're all shut down. Same with a four-wheeler and a snow machine. Used to be you could throw a snow machine out of the pickup just about anywhere, and putt on out to any lake, get in some ice fishing, and putt on home. Not anymore.

Try to get a mining claim. Try to use open range. Hell, even firewood permits are getting damn selective.
We're experiencing WHY the government isn't supposed to own land.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2016, 03:58:19 PM »
In the first place, the fed ain't supposed to own land, beyond govt buildings, military bases and etc.
That being said, I have no real objection to a natl park here and there... Hell, I didn't even mind federal forests when they were held for the people - That ain't so anymore.

Hell, you can't hardly piss on the ground around here without some federal sh*tbag showing up and declaring it a national wetland, and another one showing up two days later to claim all the land from that spot to the nearest river as an 'eagle flyway'.

They ain't managing the land 'for the people', they're shutting us out of it, and shutting it off.
Try to find someplace to go four wheeling. I got rid of my mud truck because there wasn't a mudhole left - they're all shut down. Same with a four-wheeler and a snow machine. Used to be you could throw a snow machine out of the pickup just about anywhere, and putt on out to any lake, get in some ice fishing, and putt on home. Not anymore.

Try to get a mining claim. Try to use open range. Hell, even firewood permits are getting damn selective.
We're experiencing WHY the government isn't supposed to own land.
I know a fellow who tried to put in a stock tank on BLM land, and was going to feed it from a windmill pumped well. He had to get all the permits to run the water line and do the studies for the site that an oil company would have had to have done to drill an oil well, with the exception of building a road and drilling a well. Cost to put in a stock tank and run a hose up to it (in permits and studies alone) would have been close to six figures. He said "F*ck it. The cattle can walk to water." (Of course, purt'near every critter that drinks water would have benefitted from having the tank up there, too.

If you look at a map of North Dakota, there is a huge lake in the western part known as Lake Sakakawea. Pretty to look at, but purt'near inaccessible. There are a couple of private holdings down at Tobacco Gardens and Hoffland Bay, a little private land at Chris Cove, and one state park next to that with a boat ramp, but aside from Reservation lands, that's about it for over 140 miles of shoreline. The rest is mostly Corps of Engineers land, and that includes some real nice beaches. But don't go out there on a Saturday afternoon, the Corps will run you off, if they don't fine you. But it sure is a pretty lake to look at.

There is a lot more, but I have things to do. But the Federal Government is actively squeezing out people with inholdings in National Forests and other Federal Land blocs, and that includes people like ranchers in Oregon, people who have cabins on private land in the George Washington National Forest, and others whose land is effectively controlled by arbitrary buffer zones established and controlling the use of their land adjacent to Federal land and the resources on it. It is ongoing, and our tax dollars are being used against us.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 03:59:54 PM by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression
And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses. Nehemiah 4:14 (KJV)

About the only "Big" Liberals don't revile is "Big Government"

Offline GrouchoTex

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #33 on: November 10, 2016, 04:27:39 PM »
More promises: Compiled by Jenna Johnson, in the Washington Post article at the link Additional commentary and links are available there. Note: These may overlap the ones in the initial post. Again, this is done in the spirit of being able to compare stated goals with performance, and is not intended to commend nor decry Mr Trump, the President-elect.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/01/22/here-are-76-of-donald-trumps-many-campaign-promises/


Number 13, the Muslim Ban, may have just bitten the dust, if this article is correct:

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/donald-trumps-muslim-ban-was-quietly-removed-from-his-website/ar-AAk8QKu?li=BBnb7Kz

Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #34 on: November 10, 2016, 04:31:15 PM »
In the first place, the fed ain't supposed to own land, beyond govt buildings, military bases and etc.
That being said, I have no real objection to a natl park here and there... Hell, I didn't even mind federal forests when they were held for the people - That ain't so anymore.

Hell, you can't hardly piss on the ground around here without some federal sh*tbag showing up and declaring it a national wetland, and another one showing up two days later to claim all the land from that spot to the nearest river as an 'eagle flyway'.

They ain't managing the land 'for the people', they're shutting us out of it, and shutting it off.
Try to find someplace to go four wheeling. I got rid of my mud truck because there wasn't a mudhole left - they're all shut down. Same with a four-wheeler and a snow machine. Used to be you could throw a snow machine out of the pickup just about anywhere, and putt on out to any lake, get in some ice fishing, and putt on home. Not anymore.

Try to get a mining claim. Try to use open range. Hell, even firewood permits are getting damn selective.
We're experiencing WHY the government isn't supposed to own land.

@roamer_1

All very good valid points.

Howsoever, that ain't really the fault of the feral goobermint. It's the fault of the city pinheads who push their political leaders to promote "feel good" (to them,anyway) legislation.

That's  how America works. If the government is doing something we don't like or not doing something we want done,we are supposed to complain to our political leaders to have things changed

It really is up to us to become more pro-active with local and state politics,and try to teach a little reality to pinheads occasionally. I know I fall short to often,myself. Mostly because I don't deal well with pinheads in person.
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Online Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #35 on: November 10, 2016, 04:33:43 PM »
Maybe if the West would stop electing Democrats this might change?


Didn't Ted Cruz introduce a bill for the Federal Government to give up it's land?

Online roamer_1

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #36 on: November 10, 2016, 05:19:55 PM »
[...] the Federal Government is actively squeezing out people with inholdings in National Forests and other Federal Land blocs, and that includes people like ranchers in Oregon, people who have cabins on private land in the George Washington National Forest, and others whose land is effectively controlled by arbitrary buffer zones established and controlling the use of their land adjacent to Federal land and the resources on it. It is ongoing, and our tax dollars are being used against us.

That's exactly right. We're having that going on here too - Buddy of mine has been on a federal lease for 3 generations. Leasing the land cost roughly a couple grand for 50 years. the '50' is coming around again, and after assessment (of the work and labor HIS FAMILY did on the land), the lease is north of $104,000.00 for the next 50.

He's bringing suit, leaning on squatter's rights, but he's going to lose.. And a ranch that's been going since before Montana was a state will fold up and disappear. Same with Echo Lake. All those beach-front leases are up and every one of the cabins is for sale - Cabins that have been there for a century - Because the locals can't make the new lease price... The only hope they have is that they can rub them off on some tourist, because everyone here knows that after the 50-70k ask, comes the 150k lease in two years.

The sonsabiches. They're driving people off the land on purpose... Driving them into the cities where they can be controlled. Don't think we don't know what's going on.

Online roamer_1

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #37 on: November 10, 2016, 05:27:36 PM »
Howsoever, that ain't really the fault of the feral goobermint. It's the fault of the city pinheads who push their political leaders to promote "feel good" (to them,anyway) legislation.


@sneakypete

Oh the hell you say... That's precisely the point! If the state owned the land, OUR reps down in Helena, that WE elect, would have the say.

Then those pinheaded bunnyhuggers in California and New York wouldn't have a damn bit of say in any of it.

The Federal gvt is not supposed to own it, and because they do, people in DC have more power over it than the people who live here. That's a damnable curse.

Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #38 on: November 10, 2016, 05:34:39 PM »


The sonsabiches. They're driving people off the land on purpose... Driving them into the cities where they can be controlled. Don't think we don't know what's going on.

@roamer_1

I am GUESSING,and it is only a guess,that you are 180 degrees off on that prediction.

*I* THINK what is behind it is a plan to chase off all the locals and other "rubes" in order to clear the titles so that once America turns into a key part of The North American Economic Zone the people that sit on the corporate board that runs things and their relatives will be able to sell it to themselves and they will have HUGE tracts of beautiful scenery to enjoy vacations in private without having to deal with the rubes and other "common people".

They will even have room to build barracks to house the family bodyguards,and not have to worry about any of those silly EPA laws or property taxes.

Rules are for common people,not Royalty.

Think "Red Ted Turner" and the enormous ranch he owns in Wyoming (I THINK) for the blueprint.
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Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #39 on: November 10, 2016, 05:40:24 PM »
@sneakypete

Oh the hell you say... That's precisely the point! If the state owned the land, OUR reps down in Helena, that WE elect, would have the say.

Then those pinheaded bunnyhuggers in California and New York wouldn't have a damn bit of say in any of it.



@roamer_1

And you would still have to deal with the local pinheads. Some of the local pinheads out west have names like Red Ted Turner,Bill Gates,etc,etc,etc. All you have to do to be a local is get a local address. You can rent it,you don't even have to own it.

What it boils back down to is WE need to put more pressure on state and local politicians. That's the ONLY place where our pressure even means anything. Nobody on the fedral level,including your local congresscritter or US Senator is going to do much more than smile and nod at you while agreeing,and then not doing a damn thing because YOU as an individual can't touch him or her. The ONLY people who can are your local and state party officials and reps. Put pressure on them and THEY will put pressure on the federal boys. The truth is THEY are the only ones who can that aren't billionaires with access.
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In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #40 on: November 10, 2016, 06:12:22 PM »
@roamer_1

I am GUESSING,and it is only a guess,that you are 180 degrees off on that prediction.

*I* THINK what is behind it is a plan to chase off all the locals and other "rubes" in order to clear the titles so that once America turns into a key part of The North American Economic Zone the people that sit on the corporate board that runs things and their relatives will be able to sell it to themselves and they will have HUGE tracts of beautiful scenery to enjoy vacations in private without having to deal with the rubes and other "common people".

They will even have room to build barracks to house the family bodyguards,and not have to worry about any of those silly EPA laws or property taxes.

Rules are for common people,not Royalty.

Think "Red Ted Turner" and the enormous ranch he owns in Wyoming (I THINK) for the blueprint.
Turner's ranch is in Montana. A few locals got jobs actually making it run, but not the same as having your own operation.

But you did hit on why I want homesteading back instead of a 'sale'. Either the sale blocks on hardscrabble land will be so large that few can afford them, or the price will be nuts, and locals still lose to those guys with money. Sometimes a decent relationship can develop there, but more often than not, you have a bunch of arrogant, moneyed tinhorns with no damned sense who would sic a lawyer on you if you pulled them out of the ditch and sloshed their latte or didn't do it just right. There goes the neighborhood. Folks out this way don't much cotton to highfalootin' folks from elsewhere looking down their noses at them because they had some overpaid job back east or out west. We just remind them they are a lot like Teddy Rooseveldt when he first got out here (a skinny, good for nothing much rich kid from back East, who as time went by matured and earned his stripes by doing, not by cutting a check).
« Last Edit: November 10, 2016, 06:13:49 PM by Smokin Joe »
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression
And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses. Nehemiah 4:14 (KJV)

About the only "Big" Liberals don't revile is "Big Government"

Online roamer_1

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #41 on: November 10, 2016, 06:37:41 PM »
But you did hit on why I want homesteading back instead of a 'sale'.

There's something to be said for preserving open range and public forests. I sure don't like cutting it up.

One of the very best parts of being a cowboy in Montana is that you can still actually cowboy... Not a lot of fences (still to many) on open range, and it ought to be that way. I've been in places, bustin cows out of the breaks, where you won't hit a fence for days. It's part of what makes cattle possible.

And the same with the forest. I love that I can walk out my door and into vast stretches of forest where you might not see another human for a week or more. High lonesome. Hanging valleys where nobody's been in the last 20-30 years.

That stuff is precious... and has a purpose in itself, as wilderness.
there is a way to strike a balance.

Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #42 on: November 10, 2016, 06:49:13 PM »
Turner's ranch is in Montana.

Number 1 on my bucket list of "thing to do before I die" is to go to his ranch and take a dump in his well. Unless of course he dies before me. Then I want to take a dump on his grave.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

Offline geronl

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #43 on: November 10, 2016, 06:58:47 PM »
@bigheadfred

No can do. The US military needs and uses huge tracts of public land to train on,and if you stop this Americans WILL die in combat that wouldn't have died if they had been able to train properly.

They need to train in the cities, run tanks over occupied houses, blow up lots full of cars and people for more realistic training. Since we no longer have enemies and you oppose foreign wars and Russia's tsar is an ally, we don't need a military any more. right...
35 36! 36 on ignore.

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #44 on: November 10, 2016, 07:00:51 PM »
Number 1 on my bucket list of "thing to do before I die" is to go to his ranch and take a dump in his well. Unless of course he dies before me. Then I want to take a dump on his grave.
Kinda off topic, but I think the gutters will run yellow around his ex's grave for years, when the time comes...Won't be able to get sod to take within 50 feet of that spot.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression
And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses. Nehemiah 4:14 (KJV)

About the only "Big" Liberals don't revile is "Big Government"

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #45 on: November 10, 2016, 07:02:31 PM »
They need to train in the cities, run tanks over occupied houses, blow up lots full of cars and people for more realistic training. Since we no longer have enemies and you oppose foreign wars and Russia's tsar is an ally, we don't need a military any more. right...
Running back and forth where the wall is supposed to go might be a good exercise. One time when Posse Comitatus could actually be a problem.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression
And I looked, and rose up, and said unto the nobles, and to the rulers, and to the rest of the people, Be not ye afraid of them: remember the Lord, which is great and terrible, and fight for your brethren, your sons, and your daughters, your wives, and your houses. Nehemiah 4:14 (KJV)

About the only "Big" Liberals don't revile is "Big Government"

Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #46 on: November 10, 2016, 07:28:09 PM »
They need to train in the cities, run tanks over occupied houses, blow up lots full of cars and people for more realistic training. Since we no longer have enemies and you oppose foreign wars and Russia's tsar is an ally, we don't need a military any more. right...

@geronl

COOL! Give me your address,and I'll tell some people I know in the Special Warfare Center that your place would be a good place to practice a hostage rescue.

Awful nice of you to volunteer.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

Offline geronl

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #47 on: November 10, 2016, 07:29:34 PM »
@geronl

COOL! Give me your address,and I'll tell some people I know in the Special Warfare Center that your place would be a good place to practice a hostage rescue.

Awful nice of you to volunteer.

1600 Pennsylvania Avenue...
35 36! 36 on ignore.

Online sneakypete

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #48 on: November 10, 2016, 07:42:10 PM »
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue...

@geronl


Ahhhh,just another poser with no actual convictions........
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In the entire history of the world,the only nations that had to build walls to keep their own citizens from leaving were those with leftist governments.

Online bigheadfred

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Re: Measuring the Future
« Reply #49 on: November 10, 2016, 08:05:01 PM »
 "Bomb the s--- out of ISIS."

I wonder if P-E Trump knows there are two esses in ISIS?

What city people don't understand is that ruralites are the BEST stewards of their land, including the lands they use for range or whatever. The last thing they want to see is those lands ruined. And the very last thing they want or need is some clueless desk jockey writing up rules and regulations that only accomplish destroying people's ways of life and livelihoods.



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