For those who are Never Trump or leaning that way, what would he need to do in order for you to change your mind?

[XenaLee]

Considering how many times Trump has already flip-flopped, reversed position, and claimed that what he said ""previously"" was just a suggestion, sarcasm, a joke, etc.....nothing he says now could convince me that he actually means what he says.  He has already permanently trashed his credibility with me. 

[musiclady]

@musiclady

Hey remember when you said this in the Levin thread?

I shall restate my talking points.

These are real positions held here.

So now your desperation to be "right" in spite of being wrong is causing you to ping me to other threads??  LOL!

Nothing on your list was stated as anyone has stated any position here.  Every thing you listed was a distortion of what has actually been said.  (i.e. lacking in reading comprehension)

Now please, do me the honor of not pinging me again.  I don't need your insults, nor your arrogance.

And I'm certainly not going to vote for the object of your affection.

Now cut out the TOS techniques, and man up.

[Jazzhead]

Drop out of the race and never enter politics again.

That would work for me.   I'd gladly cast a vote for Mike Pence for President.

My main problem with Trump is Trump himself.   He's temperamentally unfit to be President and be in charge of putting our troops in harms way.  He's a megalomaniac with a short fuse, who bears grudges and keeps his own counsel.   I have disagreements with him on the issues,  and don't like that he's a demagogue who is adored by racialists and bigots.   But Hillary's hip-deep with racialists as well.   No,  his disqualifying characteristic is his amoral and unhinged temperament. 

[Bigun]

Considering how many times Trump has already flip-flopped, reversed position, and claimed that what he said ""previously"" was just a suggestion, sarcasm, a joke, etc.....nothing he says now could convince me that he actually means what he says.  He has already permanently trashed his credibility with me.

It is impossible for me to believe a word that comes out of his mouth at this point.

[musiclady]

It is impossible for me to believe a word that comes out of his mouth at this point.

I don't know how any rational person can believe what he says.

[ScottinVA]

I see Trump as arrogant and for the most part reprehensible.

But...

I abhor the fact Hillary Clinton continues to draw shares of earthly oxygen.  The "woman" is deeply and totally evil.

I will be holding my nose with a vice grip and casting a vote against Hillary Clinton on November 8.  As Trump will be the one drawing that vote, so be it.  Hillary Clinton is dangerously unfit for the office.

[aligncare]

I'm voting for Donald Trump willingly and happily. We got lucky this time around.

[geronl]

Trump is a scumbag, one of the most vile human beings who ever lived.

I hope he loses badly.

[skeeter]

I see Trump as arrogant and for the most part reprehensible.

But...

I abhor the fact Hillary Clinton continues to draw shares of earthly oxygen.  The "woman" is deeply and totally evil.

I will be holding my nose with a vice grip and casting a vote against Hillary Clinton on November 8.  As Trump will be the one drawing that vote, so be it.  Hillary Clinton is dangerously unfit for the office.

So here we'll be, just like 4, 8 and for some of us 12 years now, voting AGAINST someone instead of FOR someone.

When it could've been so much better.

[Idaho_Cowboy]

@musiclady

Hey remember when you said this in the Levin thread?

I shall restate my talking points.

These are real positions held here.

Those are just the snowflake resting on the tip of the iceberg.

When it comes to Trump:
-He's been a lifelong liberal.
-He's on record praising Billzebubba as a great President
-He's on record praising Hillary Clinton as secretary of State
-He was a registered Democrat during Obama first term
-He's on record against the first and second amendments
-He's on record wanting to raise taxes
-He's on record wanting to raise minimum wage
-He's on record supporting the individual mandate of Obama care,
-He started his campaign because of a phone call with the Clintons.

I am 100% certain Trump is a lifelong liberal democrat with an R behind his name in this race acting out the crazy caricatures of what he thinks conservatives are (ie. a bigoted, racist, foulmouthed jerk) so that Hillary can win. We've been had.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

Let me see if I understand your argument correctly. Are you saying that since George W. Bush lied about being a conservative, we should now vote for Donald Trump, because he also lies about being a conservative?

Is that your argument?

Great post.

[andy58-in-nh]

Short of changing his essential character and beginning to act like a grown up, there is nothing that Donald Trump can do at this point to convince me to vote for him.

Nevertheless, if the election is closely contested in my state, and I remain convinced as I already am that Hillary Clinton would be a disaster wrapped inside a nightmare folded inside a cataclysm, I may yet be convinced to vote for the miserable SOB.

[Frank Cannon]

I'm voting for Donald Trump willingly and happily. We got lucky this time around.

You're right. Having a constantly shifting baffoon who has 60% of the country that hates him as the nominee is a real stroke of luck. How could it get any better.

[jmyrlefuller]

At this point in the cycle, nothing.

For 2020, he can start by selling off all his big city real estate, settling down in flyover country, and learning how to behave like an adult.

[Formerly Once-Ler]

I have been #nevertrump for 6 months now.  What can Trump do in the next 2 months he couldn't do in the last 6 months?  Nothing.  It's too late. The man has proven himself to be irrational, petty, vindictive, ignorant, and dangerous.  I can't do that to America.

[Vulcan]

Trump is a scumbag, one of the most vile human beings who ever lived.

I hope he loses badly.

Yes he is and yes he will.

[Idaho_Cowboy]

You're right. Having a constantly shifting baffoon who has 60% of the country that hates him as the nominee is a real stroke of luck. How could it get any better.

80% of the country could hate him look on the bright side Frank. But don't look too long, it might blind you.

[aligncare]

I'm voting for Donald Trump willingly and happily. ...

....oh, I forgot to mention the reasons why I'm voting for Mr. Trump. It's because I'm amoral and have no core principles.  What else?

 

[Formerly Once-Ler]

....oh, I forgot to mention the reasons why. It's because I'm amoral and have no core principles. 

 

Ah Ha!

[Wingnut]

For those who are Never Trump or leaning that way, what would he need to do in order for you to change your mind?

If he shot Hillary Clinton in the ass on Fifth Avenue in NYC....  I'd consider it. 

[ABX]

A physical and detailed contract signed that says he will honor and protect the constitution in all decisions and not circumvent congress or the people (no pen and phone games), filed with the Supreme Court and Congress, and by determination of 2/3rds of Congress or a plurality of the Supreme Court (with some sort of accelerated review process) or 2/3rds of governors, if that contract is breached, he will voluntary step down within 30 days of the ruling.

IE, he doesn't need to be impeached to be removed, the contract is an agreement he will follow the Constitution or step down on his own.

Trust is the key factor that causes many of us not to support him. We know he can spout any words he wants but his history shows words and the truth mean little to him so it will have to be something legally binding, not just get in, act like Obama with a pen and phone, and sneer that he can't be removed unless Congress gets the balls to impeach him (and he actually crosses the 'high crime' line).

For example, if he tries to take executive action to seize the assets of anyone sending money overseas outside of legal due process 4th & 5th Amendment, that is a violation of the Constitution and if Congress, SCOTUS, or 2/3rds of the governors says it is unconstitutional, he steps down.

Even then, just like contract he makes with his vendors and contractors, I would be wary to trust him. It would have to be rock solid.

Otherwise, everything he is spouting, to me, is just Words, words, words, a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

Strike that. After some contemplation, even a physical binding contract wouldn't turn me at this point because some of the issues are much bigger than Trump, it is about the overall direction of the nation to an anti-individual, pro- authoritarian, nationalistic, unconstitutional entity, and even holding one man's feet to the fire won't change that. We need a fundamental shift and I don't want to see any empowerment of the direction we have been heading. Any victory for Trump is an empowerment of some very disturbing ideology that will continue to grow and fester like a cancer.

[ABX]

1. Trump isn't really a conservative because he was once a Democrat and is from New York.
2. Whatever Trump says, he doesn't mean. It doesn't matter how conservative his policies appear.
3. Trump's policies are just words
4. Because he contributed to Hillary years ago, likely for special favor, he is as bad as she is
5. Neither candidate is moral enough to garner my vote

You forgot one- (goes along with 'just words) everything he has done through his entire career and with his own money shows a blatant disregard for the Constitution, individual rights, or the actual free market which are evidence his words now are about as honest as a WWE 'wrassler's' persona. Add to that, he even brags in his own books that he will lie to close the deal.

In other words, his 70 years of actions do not match his words now and we have no real evidence he has changed other than empty promises.

To me, him saying what he is saying now is just as believable as if Hillary herself started spouting those same lines and policies to try to win over more votes. In both cases, they have a long history of showing us they both don't believe it.

[sinkspur]

Vote for a Texas Conservative, was a vote for a Presidency that had amnesty for illegal aliens on the table, got involved in a war that accelerated the persecution of Christians most closely associated with Jesus Christ, Iraqi Christians and yes, that started during that administration, Thanks Dubya and helped inflame sectarianism throughout the region.

Total jackassery.  All Christians are closely associated with Jesus Christ, so your statement above is silly.  Your continued trashing of Bush for the Iraq War (a war that Trump supported BEFORE it started) is repetitious and ill-informed.  The American public supported going into Iraq by 80%.

[sinkspur]

I will never vote for Trump under any circumstances.

[ABX]

Here is a simpler way to put my last comment.

If tomorrow, George Soros went on TV and started saying all the exact same things Trump is saying now, and making the same promises, would you believe him?

Of course not. Why?

Because you have his entire history to look back on and know what he really believes.

And there you have it...