Why we mustn't support Donald Trump

[INVAR]

The only bashing going on here seems to be coming from you. Relax … there are no Trump militants here - they’re all over at TOS. Don’t turn this site into a NeverTrump militant site, please.

Oh really?  The mantra from the Trump Militant is as you just stated:  "It is however, a fact that voting for anyone but Trump is voting for Hillary."

I'm not going to play nice with bullies who engage in that kind of intimidation game, because it is part and parcel of what the Trump Militant does at TOS and elsewhere.

So as I said, making such accusations for refusing to vote for your train wreck is not only bashing, it only grows our ranks and steels our resolve.

No one here is voting for Hillary.  Many here are not voting for Trump, but someone else in November. 

[Smokin Joe]

#NeverTrump has further reaching ramifications that just the White House. Think about all of those that vote straight ticket. Those that do and have given in to the #NeverTrump hype will stay home … or vote independent on the presidential ballot while ignoring the rest. This is a green light for the Dems to gain back congressional seats. This, coupled with the fact that we know beyond a doubt what Hillary would do as president, we need to drop the hardline stance against Trump. Otherwise, #NeverTrump is nothing more that #RepublicansForHillary.

That’s my opinion.

I'll go and vote downticket, because we have State races involved, too. Just because I won't support Trump, doesn't mean I won't vote, it just means I won't vote for Trump.

[Smokin Joe]

Well Trump may be all that you believe him to be, and you are certainly not alone in thinking that... But he IS currently the Nominee.... and if as you say, "God is in control here", then  Trump would not be where he is at since God does raise leaders up to use for HIS purposes no matter how we might view them....or for that matter how they see themselves.

He is the presumptive nominee. It isn't official until the Convention. He isn't where you say he is, even if the fat lady is warming up in the wings.

[Smokin Joe]

It is however, a fact that voting for anyone but Trump is voting for Hillary.

And voting for anyone but Hillary is a vote for Trump, by that tired, nonsensical "logic".

Therefore I get to vote for both, because I'm not voting for either one.

What is this dreck, common core math?

[aligncare]

#NeverTrump has further reaching ramifications that just the White House. Think about all of those that vote straight ticket. Those that do and have given in to the #NeverTrump hype will stay home … or vote independent on the presidential ballot while ignoring the rest. This is a green light for the Dems to gain back congressional seats. This, coupled with the fact that we know beyond a doubt what Hillary would do as president, we need to drop the hardline stance against Trump. Otherwise, #NeverTrump is nothing more that #RepublicansForHillary.

That’s my opinion.

It's helpful to think of #NeverTrump as Democrat party enablers. Certainly I wouldn't say they're Hillary supporters, although the effect is essentially the same: lend their name, their prestige, and give aid to the single most corrupt politician in American history in her quest to achieve the ultimate prize. She can just about hear the cash register going ka-ching!

[INVAR]

It's helpful to think of #NeverTrump as Democrat party enablers.

Says the person supporting a vulgar threatening loudmouth for president who funded, supported, voted and campaigned for a known Communist for NYC mayor less than 3 years ago and supported the Clintons for much of the 90's.

Whose Trade policy he revealed this week is identical to Hillary Clinton's trade policies with the exception that Hillary came out with hers first.

Certainly I wouldn't say they're Hillary supporters, although the effect is essentially the same: lend their name, their prestige, and give aid to the single most corrupt politician in American history in her quest to achieve the ultimate prize.

You're projecting.

You betrayed your name, your prestige and any honor or integrity towards upholding Conservative and Constitutional principles to a cult of personality who is no more Conservative than the woman you want him to beat.

[DB]

It's helpful to think of #NeverTrump as Democrat party enablers. Certainly I wouldn't say they're Hillary supporters, although the effect is essentially the same: lend their name, their prestige, and give aid to the single most corrupt politician in American history in her quest to achieve the ultimate prize. She can just about hear the cash register going ka-ching!

Is there any any candidate the Republican party could nominate that you wouldn't say the same thing? That would be a bridge too far for you? How about David Duke?

And if you do have a limit then this is really about where you draw the line. So then it is like the person who screams that those who drive faster than you are a reckless madmen endangering everyone and others who drive slower than you are old coots clogging up the roads...

Can you not accept that different people draw the lines in different places? That they have different capabilities and different perspectives?

[geronl]

I cannot say that Trump would do likewise because all the videos of him throughout they years he's always shown his desire for this nation exclusively over any other that he shows any degree of loyalty to.

Trump is a liberal who thinks the GOP wasn't compromising with the Democrats enough.

[Victoria33]

This is a rebuttal of Carol Brown's Op-ed at the American Thinker http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2016/06/why_we_must_support_donald_trump.html

(His behavior)  It's everyday.  And we know what he did to every Conservative running in the race; the personal and the viciousness assaults on character and families that we are never going to forget.  That is who Trump is, and we are not risking lending a hand to put such a man in power.  Assuredly he will more easily turn that vulgar unhinged rage against anyone who dares oppose him as we have already witnessed so far - and such is the making of a despot far more dangerous than even Hildabeast will be in that office.

Trump is the final nail in the coffin of Conservatism and our foundational principles. He and his are already busy redefining what those things are as they resculpt them into the image of Trump.

The above you wrote is especially important.  The Trump we have seen is the Trump we get.  He will not change as this is his behavior since he was very young, even as a child.

He is not mentally able to be president.  I have never said that about any candidate in my 83 years.  I am not a "sore loser", I am an intelligent person who has studied human behavior for over 20 years.  He is the final nail in the coffin as he reacts emotionally to every criticism and must destroy any thinking except his own.  He will turn on any person in the United States including those who praise his name, when they have a different opinion than his and that is bound to happen.

He will make every country, even our allies, turn against us if any leader questions his actions - and they are already doing that and he is already lashing out at them.  He is wrapped up in himself to an extreme I have never seen before in all patients with whom I have worked or heard about in my human behavior profession. 

This is a serious problem for the country, not a choice between two normal people with differing political goals.  You can diss Clinton for being a liberal and I can't stand her, but she will not destroy the country in four years, but I believe he will because he has no idea what he believes from one day to the next.  That is because he believes in nothing except his pleasure and that requires praise to him every single day for him to keep believing he is the very best of all people in the world.  The above is my opinion and it distresses me greatly.  I wish it were not true.
@CatherineofAragon
@mystery-ak
@Norm Lenhart

[WAC]

@WAC "his illiteracy regarding how things work in Washington is to our advantage"
Ignorance is strength

Well I couldn't say that's true in the Halls of Washington.......there be land-minds there!

[Henry Noel]

What was it I read by @Henry Noel ?  Better statists for better statism?

Yes, that was me. I still think it would be a great slogan for the Trump campaign!

[al_c]

Oh really?  The mantra from the Trump Militant is as you just stated:  “It is however, a fact that voting for anyone but Trump is voting for Hillary."

I don’t see that as bashing, but okay.

[al_c]

I'll go and vote downticket, because we have State races involved, too. Just because I won't support Trump, doesn't mean I won't vote, it just means I won't vote for Trump.

 

[Half Vast Conspiracy]

Ignorance is strength

Perfect!

@Idaho_Cowboy

[wolfcreek]

And voting for anyone but Hillary is a vote for Trump, by that tired, nonsensical "logic".

Therefore I get to vote for both, because I'm not voting for either one.

What is this dreck, common core math?

If you vote for Stein you might take a vote away from Hillary.

[wolfcreek]

The above you wrote is especially important.  The Trump we have seen is the Trump we get.  He will not change as this is his behavior since he was very young, even as a child.

He is not mentally able to be president.  I have never said that about any candidate in my 83 years.  I am not a "sore loser", I am an intelligent person who has studied human behavior for over 20 years.  He is the final nail in the coffin as he reacts emotionally to every criticism and must destroy any thinking except his own.  He will turn on any person in the United States including those who praise his name, when they have a different opinion than his and that is bound to happen.

He will make every country, even our allies, turn against us if any leader questions his actions - and they are already doing that and he is already lashing out at them.  He is wrapped up in himself to an extreme I have never seen before in all patients with whom I have worked or heard about in my human behavior profession. 

This is a serious problem for the country, not a choice between two normal people with differing political goals.  You can diss Clinton for being a liberal and I can't stand her, but she will not destroy the country in four years, but I believe he will because he has no idea what he believes from one day to the next.  That is because he believes in nothing except his pleasure and that requires praise to him every single day for him to keep believing he is the very best of all people in the world.  The above is my opinion and it distresses me greatly.  I wish it were not true.
@CatherineofAragon
@mystery-ak
@Norm Lenhart

She won't need 4 years to destroy America.

http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/05/25/clinton-releases-plan-dissolve-us-border-within-100-days/

[betty boop]

...It is easy to pick up on the absolute disdain and borderline vehement hatred of those who on principle, will not vote for Trump in November and it often reminds me of the same kind of attitude one expects when arguing with a rabid secular Leftist over matters of morality.  That anyone would stand on a moral principle is deemed a danger to society when they will not embrace that which is anathema to their foundations....

Oh my word, INVAR, where did you get this sanctimonious claptrap? That I am a Trump supporter does not make me the enemy of people "who stand on moral principles." Though sometimes I wonder exactly what those "principles" are.

The principle I most see at work in you and some of your colleagues is an ad hominem hatred of Donald Trump so deep that you land yourselves in a position where you just give aid and comfort to our common enemy. That would be Hillary Clinton.

You and your friends are doing a splendid job of broadcasting and promoting her entire stock Campaign narrative. The ONLY thing she has to run on is the demonization of Donald Trump as not only unfit for presidential office, but unfit to be a human being, period.

You guys are doing a splendid job helping out the Hillary Campaign....

Oh, but you are so virtuous nonetheless....

@wolfcreek;

[aligncare]

Oh my word, INVAR, where did you get this sanctimonious claptrap? That I am a Trump supporter does not make me the enemy of people "who stand on moral principles." Though sometimes I wonder exactly what those "principles" are.

The principle I most see at work in you and some of your colleagues is an ad hominem hatred of Donald Trump so deep that you land yourselves in a position where you just give aid and comfort to our common enemy. That would be Hillary Clinton.

You and your friends are doing a splendid job of broadcasting and promoting her entire stock Campaign narrative. The ONLY thing she has to run on is the demonization of Donald Trump as not only unfit for presidential office, but unfit to be a human being, period.

You guys are doing a splendid job helping out the Hillary Campaign....

Oh, but you are so virtuous nonetheless....

@wolfcreek;

Pity, ain't it? Of course, there are plenty of other ways to characterize their position and it's impact on this election, but seeing as how we're going into the Independence Day weekend, I've no intention of starting a flame war.

[musiclady]

I don’t see that as bashing, but okay.

Of COURSE it's bashing.

You obviously choose to see Trump followers' bashing of Conservatives as benign and Constitutionalists' bashing of liberals as malicious.

It's OK for you to have your pro-Trump opinion, but it's not OK to make distorted comments defending the Trump followers who are accusing the rest of us as being liberals and supporting Hillary when that is a bald faced lie.

Both Trump and Hillary are dangerous liberals, and I cannot in good conscience support EITHER.

And this is the first time in nearly 50 years of voting that I absolutely cannot vote for the "Republican" candidate.

He is vile.  He is corrupt.  He is dishonest.  He's pro-abortion.  He's never looked at the Constitution.

And he is a Progressive.

Can't do it.

[musiclady]

She won't need 4 years to destroy America.

http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/05/25/clinton-releases-plan-dissolve-us-border-within-100-days/

Neither will the leftist Donald Trump.

[INVAR]

Oh my word, INVAR, where did you get this sanctimonious claptrap? That I am a Trump supporter does not make me the enemy of people "who stand on moral principles." Though sometimes I wonder exactly what those "principles" are.

The principle I most see at work in you and some of your colleagues is an ad hominem hatred of Donald Trump so deep that you land yourselves in a position where you just give aid and comfort to our common enemy. That would be Hillary Clinton.

You and your friends are doing a splendid job of broadcasting and promoting her entire stock Campaign narrative. The ONLY thing she has to run on is the demonization of Donald Trump as not only unfit for presidential office, but unfit to be a human being, period.

You guys are doing a splendid job helping out the Hillary Campaign....

I'm so sick of this insulting crap that there's no point attempting to rebut or reason with you people.

So fine - let's do it your way then.  Because I'm not ever voting for Trump and because the Trump Militant have made me your enemy with all the death threats for treason that I now will work directly to ensure Trump is defeated with every fiber of my being.

I think Trump is more dangerous than Hillary in that office.  He proves it nearly every single time he speaks.  His supporters validate that thought every time they issue their 'tree of liberty must be refreshed with blood' quote from Jefferson to apply to Nevertrump.

Your fellow Trump supporters wanted a war.  Palin just today said we are either with them or against them.

SO GUESS WHAT?  I'M AGAINST YOU AND I'M AGAINST TRUMP.

WHAT DO YOU PLAN TO DO ABOUT IT?

[al_c]

Of COURSE it's bashing.

You obviously choose to see Trump followers’ bashing of Conservatives as benign and Constitutionalists’ bashing of liberals as malicious.

Nope. Why do you think I’m over here instead of TOS?

It’s OK for you to have your pro-Trump opinion, but it’s not OK to make distorted comments defending the Trump followers who are accusing the rest of us as being liberals and supporting Hillary when that is a bald faced lie.

I’m not pro-Trump … I’m anti-Hillary. Cruz was my vote.

Both Trump and Hillary are dangerous liberals, and I cannot in good conscience support EITHER.

And this is the first time in nearly 50 years of voting that I absolutely cannot vote for the "Republican" candidate.

He is vile.  He is corrupt.  He is dishonest.  He's pro-abortion.  He's never looked at the Constitution.

And he is a Progressive.

Can't do it.

And that’s your opinion. Mine is that Hillary is a much worse beast and would do irreparable damage to the future of this country. Trump, on the other hand, is a delegator. Alone, he can not be a good president. But if (and I’m hoping he does) surround himself with the right team to do the job, his damage to this country would be minimal … something we could recover from. I don’t see recovery from a Hillary presidency.

[musiclady]

Nope. Why do you think I’m over here instead of TOS?

I’m not pro-Trump … I’m anti-Hillary. Cruz was my vote.

And that’s your opinion. Mine is that Hillary is a much worse beast and would do irreparable damage to the future of this country. Trump, on the other hand, is a delegator. Alone, he can not be a good president. But if (and I’m hoping he does) surround himself with the right team to do the job, his damage to this country would be minimal … something we could recover from. I don’t see recovery from a Hillary presidency.

Trump has stated (more than once) that he surrounds himself with inferior people so that he's the smartest guy in the room and they listen to him and praise him.

He is the OPPOSITE of what is needed to be a good President.

We won't recover from either of them.  Trump is potentially worse than Hillary because he knows absolutely NOTHING and he's a narcissist.

(btw, accusing #NeverTrumpers of being PRO-Hillary is the worst kind of personal attack because it's an ugly lie.  #NeverTrump people oppose Trump because he's liberal.  They do NOT support Hillary.  Any time you see that ad hominem, you should counter it with the truth.  Otherwise you ARE pro-Trump, and not pro-TRUTH).

[DB]

Trump has stated (more than once) that he surrounds himself with inferior people so that he's the smartest guy in the room and they listen to him and praise him.

He is the OPPOSITE of what is needed to be a good President.

We won't recover from either of them.  Trump is potentially worse than Hillary because he knows absolutely NOTHING and he's a narcissist.

(btw, accusing #NeverTrumpers of being PRO-Hillary is the worst kind of personal attack because it's an ugly lie.  #NeverTrump people oppose Trump because he's liberal.  They do NOT support Hillary.  Any time you see that ad hominem, you should counter it with the truth.  Otherwise you ARE pro-Trump, and not pro-TRUTH).

If Trump were to get elected under the Republican banner, once he's done, the Republican party will finished. The GOP will be so tarnished it will be laughing stock of the country and the Republicans will own it. Bush's presidency brought us Obama, Trump will bring us something worse.

[betty boop]

I'm so sick of this insulting crap that there's no point attempting to rebut or reason with you people....

SO GUESS WHAT?  I'M AGAINST YOU AND I'M AGAINST TRUMP.

WHAT DO YOU PLAN TO DO ABOUT IT?

Man, are you ever "over the top."

What do I "plan to do about it?" Why, absolutely nothing -- other than to continue listen to you "fart proudly for liberty."

Sure is getting stinky around here.