Another Major Incident Between Russia And The U.S.! Tensions HIGH!

[rangerrebew]

Another Major Incident Between Russia And The U.S.! Tensions HIGH!
Single H

Russian Sukhoi Su-27 fighter - file pic

Not since the Cold War “ended” have tensions between Russia and the United States been so high!

A few weeks back, Russian planes buzzed American ships exercising in the Baltic Sea. That caused quite a stir and many are worried that Russia is intentionally trying to antagonize America into a conflict.

Then this week, this happened.

Via BBC:

    Russia says it was right to confront a US Air Force reconnaissance plane over the Baltic Sea on Friday.
    The Pentagon said a Russian jet fighter acted in an “unsafe and unprofessional manner”, and performed a barrel roll over its plane.

    Russia said that the American jet had turned off its transponder signal, which helps others identify it.

    It is the second incident in the Baltic this month in which the US has accused Russian planes of flying aggressively.

    “All flights of Russian planes are conducted in accordance with international regulations on the use of airspace,” a statement by the Russian defence ministry said. “The US Air Force has two solutions: either not to fly near our borders or to turn the transponder on for identification.”

    US jets “regularly” try to approach Russia’s borders with transponders switched off, the statement said. Over the past 18 months, Russia has been repeatedly accused of the same practice over the Baltic and near UK waters.

This is not OK. Russia is trying to bait us into conflict. What will be done about it?

Nothing, probably. Russia is our “friend” right?

Ha. They are run by the same thugs who wanted to nuke us in the 1980s. The Cold War never truly ended, it just moved into another phase.

We have to be vigilant!

Read more: http://www.thepoliticalinsider.com/russia-threatens-ameican-plane/#ixzz47UBgtKtV

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

I don't necessarily see Russia as an enemy any more. Why should we? If Putin wants to police the world, let him.

Putin stands up to radical Islam and bombs Isis. If they want to use Russian blood to accomplish this, let them.

[Rivergirl]

Tension????   Don't see it at all.  Obie busy on the golf course and/or planning his next getaway from D.C. and the moocher.

[TomSea]

I don't necessarily see Russia as an enemy any more. Why should we? If Putin wants to police the world, let him.

Putin stands up to radical Islam and bombs Isis. If they want to use Russian blood to accomplish this, let them.

Putin bombs ISIS? Thanks for the monday morning joke.

Why is ISIS still running around and controlling parts of Syria?

Assad did more to grow ISIS than anyone.

http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/how-syrias-assad-gave-rise-one-most-senior-leaders-412885798

Assad pesecuted Christians.

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/2884/assad-slaughtering-syrian-christians

Stats show ISIS wasn't that hard hit by the Russians,

ISIS accused of bombing that airliner, if that was so, Russia would have really gone after ISIS. As it stands, more civilians have been killed by Russia.

Really taking it to ISIS, aren't they?

[mirraflake]

I don't necessarily see Russia as an enemy any more. Why should we? If Putin wants to police the world, let him.

Putin stands up to radical Islam and bombs Isis. If they want to use Russian blood to accomplish this, let them.

We are going to start shooting with China first if anything. China is really cracking down on freedom, religion and democracy.

[Relic]

We are going to start shooting with China first if anything. China is really cracking down on freedom, religion and democracy.

Interesting, so is the U.S.

[TomSea]

Interesting, so is the U.S.

So you actually compare the two? Really?

Oh well, you can't be a Jehovah's Witness in Russia, so might as well add them to this mix. The last I saw one could do that in the US.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

We are going to start shooting with China first if anything. China is really cracking down on freedom, religion and democracy.

Why does US blood have to be spilt to keep people free in the world, don't they bear at least some responsibility?

[MACVSOG68]

I don't necessarily see Russia as an enemy any more. Why should we? If Putin wants to police the world, let him.

Putin stands up to radical Islam and bombs Isis. If they want to use Russian blood to accomplish this, let them.

Whether we think it is for better or worse, Russia is not a friend and certainly isn't policing the world to rid it of terrorism.  Both Russia and China are reacting to the weaknesses of the US and are looking to carve out their piece of the globe.  Our economic influence is waning, and our military is stretched way too far.  Americans are war-weary, and more interested in internal issues than confronting either Russia or China.  The more we let it go as this administration has done, the worse it gets in terms of shifting the balance of power politically, economically and militarily.  And the harder it's going to be for the next president to reset that balance.

[TomSea]

We are going to start shooting with China first if anything. China is really cracking down on freedom, religion and democracy.

Is there really a change? A lot of people wanted us to boycott the Beijing Olympics because of China's human rights policies.

China building those artificial islands and such, is what could lead to war.

[Fishrrman]

Relic wrote (in reply to mirraflake, who commented that "China is really cracking down on freedom, religion and democracy"):
"Interesting, so is the U.S."

Possibly the finest retort I've read here in quite a while!

Good 'on ya!

[Fishrrman]

MAC wrote above:
"Our economic influence is waning, and our military is stretched way too far.  Americans are war-weary, and more interested in internal issues than confronting either Russia or China."

America is going the way that Britain went in the fifties.

We're walking down the same road.

Towards irrelevance...

[geronl]

I don't necessarily see Russia as an enemy any more. Why should we? If Putin wants to police the world, let him.

Putin is not policing the world, he is bullying it. His aircraft and ships regularly make such moves against not just the US but other nations. Putin also has made it clear that he considers former USSR states to be part of Russia.

[TomSea]

MAC wrote above:
"Our economic influence is waning, and our military is stretched way too far.  Americans are war-weary, and more interested in internal issues than confronting either Russia or China."

America is going the way that Britain went in the fifties.

We're walking down the same road.

Towards irrelevance...

I agree and though, I certainly don't think David Cameron is an ideal leader and far from it, currently, he's probably a lot better than what the US, Canada and Germany just for a start have.  Isn't that curious to be a bit envious of who leads the UK for as long as they can hold out.  Somehow the Tories put it together enough.

[The_Reader_David]

Russia is not America's friend, largely because American policy under every administration since the fall of the Soviet Union has not been able to get out of the Cold War mind-set.  We have insisted on ignoring and indeed trampling on Russian's national interests, from Clinton's adventures in the Balkans, to supporting NATO expansion into the former Soviet Union, to fomenting "color revolutions" on Russia's borders, and most recently supporting the overthrow of a legitimately elected pro-Russian government in Ukraine, to say nothing of shows of force on Russia's borders that provoke reactions like this.

Preventing the spread of the inhuman ideology of Communism was worth American blood and treasure.  Preventing a Russian nationalist government from pursuing Russian national interests is not, particularly when a clear-eyed assessment of the threats to American interests posed by both salafist terrorism and Chinese national ambitions show there are many areas in which Russian and American national interests coincide.

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

MAC wrote above:
"Our economic influence is waning, and our military is stretched way too far.  Americans are war-weary, and more interested in internal issues than confronting either Russia or China."

America is going the way that Britain went in the fifties.

We're walking down the same road.

Towards irrelevance...

Certainly feels that way.

[MACVSOG68]

Russia is not America's friend, largely because American policy under every administration since the fall of the Soviet Union has not been able to get out of the Cold War mind-set.  We have insisted on ignoring and indeed trampling on Russian's national interests, from Clinton's adventures in the Balkans, to supporting NATO expansion into the former Soviet Union, to fomenting "color revolutions" on Russia's borders, and most recently supporting the overthrow of a legitimately elected pro-Russian government in Ukraine, to say nothing of shows of force on Russia's borders that provoke reactions like this.

Preventing the spread of the inhuman ideology of Communism was worth American blood and treasure.  Preventing a Russian nationalist government from pursuing Russian national interests is not, particularly when a clear-eyed assessment of the threats to American interests posed by both salafist terrorism and Chinese national ambitions show there are many areas in which Russian and American national interests coincide.

I agree with the fact that there is a terrorist issue in which the US and Russia have common interests.  The interests coincide; the goals do not.  Russia very clearly wants to place that part of the world either directly under its "union" or as client states.  The US wants to stop the growth of a terrorist state that can get its hands on nuclear weapons or other WMD.  Oil plays a role, but not that important.  The extent of US and European influence in the various color revolutions likely will never be known, but it is in Russian interests to blame them all on the US.  These "revolutions" however came from within, just as with the Ukraine.  The US certainly felt more comfortable with Kiev leaning to the West instead of its former master.  Generally though, it's in the US interests to actually keep revolutions to a minimum, as we've seen the ugly results from the Arab Spring.

But Russia is hardly a victim in all this.  It would be folly to suggest Putin doesn't have plans for extended influence or acquisition by legal or extra-legal means in the ME, Eastern Europe and Western Asia where the former Soviet Union dissolved.  The Eastern European states gained their freedom after the dissolution, and have every international right to protect themselves through political and military alliances.  Putin's moves now only reinforces the concerns they obviously have.

Neither Russia nor China are our enemies, but they are strategic opponents and are both working to divide the world up into their camps by encroaching, absorbing or otherwise cutting out the West from the current status quo.  It's a rough game and good guys don't win.

[Bill Cipher]

I agree with the fact that there is a terrorist issue in which the US and Russia have common interests.  The interests coincide; the goals do not.  Russia very clearly wants to place that part of the world either directly under its "union" or as client states.  The US wants to stop the growth of a terrorist state that can get its hands on nuclear weapons or other WMD.  Oil plays a role, but not that important.  The extent of US and European influence in the various color revolutions likely will never be known, but it is in Russian interests to blame them all on the US.  These "revolutions" however came from within, just as with the Ukraine.  The US certainly felt more comfortable with Kiev leaning to the West instead of its former master.  Generally though, it's in the US interests to actually keep revolutions to a minimum, as we've seen the ugly results from the Arab Spring.

But Russia is hardly a victim in all this.  It would be folly to suggest Putin doesn't have plans for extended influence or acquisition by legal or extra-legal means in the ME, Eastern Europe and Western Asia where the former Soviet Union dissolved.  The Eastern European states gained their freedom after the dissolution, and have every international right to protect themselves through political and military alliances.  Putin's moves now only reinforces the concerns they obviously have.

Neither Russia nor China are our enemies, but they are strategic opponents and are both working to divide the world up into their camps by encroaching, absorbing or otherwise cutting out the West from the current status quo.  It's a rough game and good guys don't win.

Generally agree, although it strikes me that Putin is aiming more for the old Russian empire than the Soviet Union. 

[MACVSOG68]

Generally agree, although it strikes me that Putin is aiming more for the old Russian empire than the Soviet Union.

You're right, it certainly won't be the Soviet Union as defined in the 1980s as too much has changed.  But we definitely need to understand his goals in first ensuring a continuation or increase in instability, second, removing American influence, and then consolidation.

[Bill Cipher]

You're right, it certainly won't be the Soviet Union as defined in the 1980s as too much has changed.  But we definitely need to understand his goals in first ensuring a continuation or increase in instability, second, removing American influence, and then consolidation.

Of course.  But we also need to understand what his ultimate goals are, which includes what version of Russian history he's trying to recapitulate. 

[MACVSOG68]

Of course.  But we also need to understand what his ultimate goals are, which includes what version of Russian history he's trying to recapitulate.

Whatever version of empire he envisions, and I'm not even sure he can define it yet, as to him it will be a work in progress, we should not fail to see and understand how he will achieve that ultimate goal:  instability, American pullback, consolidation.