Author Topic: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone  (Read 776 times)

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Offline rangerrebew

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Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« on: July 02, 2014, 01:33:03 PM »
Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone

 
Jul 2, 1:15 PM (ET)

By SONIA PEREZ D.
 

SAN JOSE LAS FLORES, Guatemala (AP) — Gilberto Ramos wanted to leave his chilly mountain village for the United States to earn money to treat his mother's epilepsy.

His mother begged him not to go. "The better treatment would have been if he stayed," Cipriana Juarez Diaz said in a tearful interview with The Associated Press on Tuesday. When he wouldn't relent, she draped him with a white rosary for safe passage.

A month later, his decaying body was found in the Texas desert. Now, the boy has become a symbol for the perils faced by a record flood of unaccompanied children from Central America who are crossing illegally into the U.S.

Authorities said Monday that Gilberto was 11, which would have made him one of the youngest known children to die crossing the desert. But his parents said Tuesday that Gilberto was 15.

 
The parents explained that they had taken several years to register his birth because of the remoteness of their village in Guatemala's northern mountains. When they did, they had forgotten Gilberto's actual birth date, so they listed the same date as his younger brother.

The boy was shirtless, having likely suffered heat stroke, but still wearing the rosary.

"He was a good son," Juarez said. "May God give me the strength to endure."

Teenage boys seeking work have long been part of the stream of young men heading north from Central America to escape poverty and gang violence.

But the number of unaccompanied immigrant children picked up along the U.S. border has been rising for three years.


Migrants tell of hearing that children traveling alone and parents traveling with young kids would be released by U.S. authorities and allowed to continue to their destination. Gilberto, too, had heard in Guatemala that if he got in, he would be allowed to stay, his family said.

He was born and grew up in San Jose Las Flores in a modest wood and sheet-metal home in the Cuchumatanes mountains of Huehuetenango province along the Mexico border. At 6,600 feet above sea level, the exuberant beauty of deep-green hills and canyons, shrouded with clouds and floral bursts of purple and yellow, is a stark contrast to the extreme poverty.

There is no running or potable water and only a latrine in the family home. In the kitchen, there is food, tortillas or wheat atole, an oatmeal-like drink, but never enough.

The cluster of homes where Gilberto lived is accessible only by foot, a difficult walk of nearly a mile (about 1 ½bd} kilometers) along a rocky and often muddy mile-long path through the canyons. Gilberto took that path each way to school, where he went as far as third grade before dropping out.

"He had to work to help the family," said his teacher, Francisco Hernandez, who remembered that Gilberto loved to draw.


 
More than half of 50 schoolchildren attending now raised their hands Tuesday when asked if they had family in the U.S., shouting, "I have eight," "seven," "three!" While many migrating minors say they are fleeing violence, the biggest threat in San Jose Las Flores is poverty. There are both mining jobs and drug traffickers in the border state, but neither touch the remote village where Gilberto grew up.

"Here most of the people are farmers. They grow beans, rice, potatoes," said Raul Cifuentes, president of the town's development committee. "But they don't have a way to import or export, so they stay poor."

Gilberto and his father, Francisco Ramos, hired themselves out to harvest and clean corn. Things improved when the oldest son, Esbin Ramos, reached Chicago and started working in a restaurant. He sends $100 to $120 a month when he can afford it, allowing the family to build a two-room home out of cement block to replace their wooden shack and paint it bright red and green. Gilberto slept on a piece of foam on the floor.

Short, quiet and humble, he stayed close to home. But he grew despairing and bored, Esbin Ramos said. Meanwhile, their mother got sicker. The older brother suggested Gilberto come to Chicago, where he could return to school and work at night and on weekends.

Gilberto set out May 17 with a change of clothes and a backpack along the same path as his brother, walking the rugged road to the center of town and then hitching a ride to Chiantla to meet up with the smuggler, known as a coyote. He left his cowboy boots behind because he didn't want them to get ruined, his father said.




 
(AP) A pair of boots and a hat belonging to Francisco Ramos Juarez, a Guatemalan boy...
Full Image
 
 
The trip cost $5,400, and the family had borrowed $2,600 of that, paying $2,000 the first week of the journey and another $600 the week before he died. They still owe the debt.

Esbin Ramos said Tuesday that he didn't know much about how Gilberto reached the Mexican border city of Reynosa. Esbin went the whole way in the back of a semitrailer. He said Gilberto told him he arrived by bus.

"I'm OK, just the deposit money," Gilberto told his father as he was about to cross into Texas.

Then Gilberto and the coyote disappeared. His parents tried to call the coyote. Four days passed, then five, then six. By the eighth day, Esbin Ramos was worried. He called the Guatemalan consulate in Houston and officials in Guatemala seeking help, he said.

Then he got a call from a woman McAllen, Texas, from what agency he doesn't know, telling him his brother was dead. They had found the body June 15, authorities said, and Esbin's phone number on the inside of Gilberto's belt buckle, a tactic many migrants use to hide information from drug traffickers who are looking to extort money from their families.

The Guatemalan consulate in the United States notified the family on Tuesday that Gilberto's body would be returned soon, whenever there is an available flight. His father is already preparing his grave site in the local cemetery.

His bedridden mother stumbled to her feet Tuesday to pray at the altar adorned with wildflowers, arranged where he slept. There are no photos placed there because the family sent most of them to the U.S. to identify the body.

"The coyote told me that he was going to take him to a safe place and I believed him," Francisco Ramos said. "But that was the fate of my son."

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20140702/lt-immigration-overload-dead-child-a1e4c7df5d.html
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 01:33:52 PM by rangerrebew »
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Offline mountaineer

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2014, 01:46:12 PM »
 8888crybaby
The skeptic is never for real. There he stands, cocktail in hand, left arm draped languorously on one end of the mantelpiece, telling you that he can't be sure of anything, not even of his own existence. I'll give you my secret method of demolishing universal skepticism in four words. Whisper to him: "Your fly is open." If he thinks knowledge is so all-fired impossible, why does he always look? — James Sire (from, The Universe Next Door)

Offline Chieftain

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2014, 02:38:29 PM »
It was exactly this kind of teary eyed bullshit that got us sucked into Somalia, led directly to the Blackhawk Down incident, and helped reduce Somalia to the anarchistic pirate run disaster that it is today.

How long will it be until we discover the Democratic operatives who recruited these kids??  This did not happen spontaneously, and it has completely overwhelmed the borders and the Border Patrol.  Homeland Security was hiring people in January to deal with this issue specifically, so someone knew they were all coming and when, and we still have not heard a peep about how this all came to be.  Just why did this kid's parents send him off on his own to try and sneak into this Country??  Who convinced them that this was a good idea?? 

There is a lot more to this than just the immediate crisis in front of us.  The crisis is looking more and more like a Classic, textbook example of a Cloward-Pliven strategery to overwhelm a system.  It has worked masterfully and now most of our Border Patrol agents are baby sitting, changing diapers and handing out bottled water to all the kiddies.

And isn't this a marvelous diversion for someone??  The borders have not been this vulnerable in years....

 :smokin:

« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 02:38:50 PM by Chieftain »

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2014, 02:48:47 PM »
 :beer: Thank you, Chief. Put far more bluntly and elegantly than any damned useless polietician out there could dream of doing.

The sob storys are coming thick and fast now, and - well - they'll work. The vast majority of Americans are quite simply good hearted people.
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Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2014, 05:38:05 PM »
The sob storys are coming thick and fast now, and - well - they'll work. The vast majority of Americans are quite simply good hearted people.

Are the bleeding hearts the same as good hearted?  Are they also naïve as hell?
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 05:38:28 PM by rangerrebew »
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. Abraham Lincoln

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Offline GourmetDan

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2014, 05:43:05 PM »
The crisis is looking more and more like a Classic, textbook example of a Cloward-Pliven strategery to overwhelm a system.

Shouldn't be any doubt that the government of the U.S. is bent on destroying the country...


"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left." - Ecclesiastes 10:2

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2014, 05:44:50 PM »
Are the bleeding hearts the same as good hearted?  Are they also naïve as hell?

You - personally - would have picked up this kid if you saw him walking down the road while you were driving. Got him a meal, tried to find out where his family were, maybe decided to call the cops or CPS if you thought it were needed. That is good hearted.

Bleeding hearts are different. "Someone has to do something!" they say while wringing their hands. The someone is never them.
The fastest way to a man's heart? Inch to the right of the breastbone, between the fourth and fifth rib.

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Offline raml

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2014, 07:56:56 PM »
All this does is make me mad at his parents and at Obama for causing this all to happen I will never have a bleeding heart but I am good hearted but not to law breakers whatever their age and I am hearing this from a lot of good hearted women and men across this nation we are done with all this law breaking by the illegals coming into this country with the rogue government we have bringing them in.

Offline Fishrrman

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2014, 08:16:50 PM »
Too bad this wasn't there to prevent Gilberto's entry:


"If it could just save the life of one child, it would be worth it !!!"

Offline Chieftain

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2014, 09:08:20 PM »
Are the bleeding hearts the same as good hearted?  Are they also naïve as hell?

Think about what Pelousy had to say down there last weekend, and you tell me if she is naive or deliberately helping carry out a long-term strategy.  This whole thing has given Obama an opening to try and use that cellphone and pen again, and at this point I think most Americans with half a brain in their heads knows what is really going on here.

And it is not just the Border Patrol who is overwhelmed here.  I heard today that a significant portion of US Air Marshals have been diverted to play escort to these kids! 
« Last Edit: July 02, 2014, 09:10:29 PM by Chieftain »

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2014, 09:19:26 PM »
Too bad this wasn't there to prevent Gilberto's entry:


"If it could just save the life of one child, it would be worth it !!!"



Too bad it wouldn't have done a damned thing if it was.  Tunneling under something as flimsy as that could probably be accomplished in a matter of a few days.

Offline mountaineer

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #11 on: July 03, 2014, 08:36:58 AM »
I heard today that a significant portion of US Air Marshals have been diverted to play escort to these kids!
Just in time for the latest Islamonazi threats to attack airlines bound for the U.S.
The skeptic is never for real. There he stands, cocktail in hand, left arm draped languorously on one end of the mantelpiece, telling you that he can't be sure of anything, not even of his own existence. I'll give you my secret method of demolishing universal skepticism in four words. Whisper to him: "Your fly is open." If he thinks knowledge is so all-fired impossible, why does he always look? — James Sire (from, The Universe Next Door)

Offline GourmetDan

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2014, 09:16:45 AM »
Think about what Pelousy had to say down there last weekend, and you tell me if she is naive or deliberately helping carry out a long-term strategy.

Pelousy is doing just what our masters want done.

Along with the rest of our government... at all levels...

"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left." - Ecclesiastes 10:2

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2014, 09:20:45 AM »
Shouldn't be any doubt that the government of the U.S. is bent on destroying the country...

You misspelled "Democrats".   :smokin:
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

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Offline GourmetDan

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2014, 09:21:33 AM »
You misspelled "Democrats".

Tis not just the Demonrats, my friend.  It would be a mistake to accept that division...


« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 09:21:52 AM by GourmetDan »
"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left." - Ecclesiastes 10:2

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Offline musiclady

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2014, 09:38:04 AM »

Too bad it wouldn't have done a damned thing if it was.  Tunneling under something as flimsy as that could probably be accomplished in a matter of a few days.

It would have stopped an 11 year old boy.

Just because a fence wouldn't stop everyone, doesn't mean it wouldn't stop anyone.

Doing nothing is not an option.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2014, 10:59:19 AM »
It would have stopped an 11 year old boy.

Just because a fence wouldn't stop everyone, doesn't mean it wouldn't stop anyone.

Doing nothing is not an option.

Agreed. Doing nothing is not an option.

Yet the fence wouldn't have stopped him. He didn't wander up to it on his own, he was being actively smuggled by coyotes. I would suggest using the same technique as was used whenever four footed coyotes become a menace. Kill them on sight. Not the victims, who pay through the nose (and through other parts - picking crops is not lucrative, drug dealing and prostitution is) but the smugglers themselves. You just deport the victims.

How many tunnels did the Israeli's uncover while looking for the three missing teens? It was in the dozens, and they were not specifically looking for tunnels.
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Offline Oceander

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #17 on: July 03, 2014, 11:36:39 AM »
It would have stopped an 11 year old boy.

Just because a fence wouldn't stop everyone, doesn't mean it wouldn't stop anyone.

Doing nothing is not an option.

Not if those tunnels were already dug it wouldn't.  Go ask the Israelis and Egyptians about how "hard" it is to tunnel under border walls - including massive steel plate and concrete fortifications that go yards underground.

Offline musiclady

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2014, 12:02:54 PM »
Not if those tunnels were already dug it wouldn't.  Go ask the Israelis and Egyptians about how "hard" it is to tunnel under border walls - including massive steel plate and concrete fortifications that go yards underground.

Fences are only one part of the entire solution, which even if carried out to the full extent, is clearly not perfect.

That doesn't mean that scoffing at the building of a fence is an appropriate response.

Again.........multiple measures must be used, one of which is a fence.

The Berlin Wall kept a lot of people from being free, didn't it?  You can't say that barriers never work.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

May 3, 2016 - the day the Republican party left ME.  I am now without a Party, and quite possibly without a country.  May God have mercy!

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #19 on: July 03, 2014, 12:09:01 PM »
Passive barriers never work. You require active ones. Sensors and enough people with appropriate equipment to respond to them. Intelligence networks to monitor and predict patterns of movement - that means paid informants and a dedicated staff trained in that sort of analysis.
The fastest way to a man's heart? Inch to the right of the breastbone, between the fourth and fifth rib.

Every time I start to feel boring, I remember there is a monthly magazine devoted to elevators.

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Offline musiclady

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #20 on: July 03, 2014, 12:15:03 PM »
Passive barriers never work. You require active ones. Sensors and enough people with appropriate equipment to respond to them. Intelligence networks to monitor and predict patterns of movement - that means paid informants and a dedicated staff trained in that sort of analysis.

Passive barriers DO work when used in conjunction with active barriers.

The fence is one of the deterrents.  Sensors, equipment, intelligence, border patrol in addition to fencing.

It will never be flawless, but it will help stem the tide of illegals.

Of course, this administration wants to overwhelm the system, so they've created this mess deliberately.
Character still matters.  It always matters.

May 3, 2016 - the day the Republican party left ME.  I am now without a Party, and quite possibly without a country.  May God have mercy!

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #21 on: July 03, 2014, 12:35:22 PM »
Of course, this administration wants to overwhelm the system, so they've created this mess deliberately.

Money quote of the thread, right there.

In the UK we have a pretty effective passive barrier. 18 to 200 miles of a rather nasty sea that is in the top three busiest shipping lanes in the world. The only way in is by ferry, private boat, the Channel tunnel or air. All of which have active defenses - navy, customs and immigration, active sensors - heck, they have sensors that can look through the sides of trucks to see if anyone is hiding inside. Yet the buggers still get in. It's frighteningly easy.

A few years ago, we were driving back from the usual trip to Italy for the summer. Stopped to refuel outside Calais (fuel was a lot cheaper in France than in the UK). Picked up a hitchhiker heading for Canterbury, a charming French girl. We went straight through the check points, not a single problem, despite her having no ticket, no passport and minimal English. That were before 9/11 - I think in '97, but still. Makes you think.
The fastest way to a man's heart? Inch to the right of the breastbone, between the fourth and fifth rib.

Every time I start to feel boring, I remember there is a monthly magazine devoted to elevators.

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Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #22 on: July 03, 2014, 05:31:12 PM »
You - personally - would have picked up this kid if you saw him walking down the road while you were driving. Got him a meal, tried to find out where his family were, maybe decided to call the cops or CPS if you thought it were needed. That is good hearted.

Bleeding hearts are different. "Someone has to do something!" they say while wringing their hands. The someone is never them.

Excellent analysis! blij26
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. Abraham Lincoln

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power. Abraham Lincoln

Be sure you put your feet in the right place, then stand firm. Abraham Lincoln

Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Guatemalan boy left for better life, died alone
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2014, 05:35:11 PM »
Passive barriers never work. You require active ones. Sensors and enough people with appropriate equipment to respond to them. Intelligence networks to monitor and predict patterns of movement - that means paid informants and a dedicated staff trained in that sort of analysis.

You know those drone pilots?  They could be active on the border.  And the US could put in active sensors like they have around area 51 - IF THEY WANTED TO.  That fence is for show only, a monument to useful idiots.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2014, 05:35:39 PM by rangerrebew »
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves. Abraham Lincoln

Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power. Abraham Lincoln

Be sure you put your feet in the right place, then stand firm. Abraham Lincoln


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