Recruits’ Ineligibility Tests the Military More Than Two-Thirds of American Youth Wouldn’t Qualify for Service, Pentagon Says

[EC]

That must be the new Army.
I can't see the benefit of sending someone to Basic, handing them E-5, then sending them off to OCS.
Talk about a serious lack of leadership skills.

I dunno. Mustangs tend to be the best officers over all, assuming they have some time in grade to settle in and learn the actual job. They don't take crap but know the crap that goes on. Straight from boot though - no benefit, agreed.

If my failing memory is correct, an E-5 is roughly equivalent to Staff Sergeant? Bit of a high rank to get straight from boot, but I guess possible if they are totally perfect, with the usual honorary bump on getting the admission letter.

[Ford289HiPo]

When I served in the US army a trainee could complete Basic, Advanced Individual Training, and then go to OCS or Warrant Officer school. At OCS they got E5 pay, which is sergeant. Warrant officers flew helicopters.

An option was "Instant NCO School" from which a graduate achieved sergeant (E5), and the top 10% achieved staff sergeant (E6). While attending this school, you were paid E4 pay.

I think it is still about the same.

I have a bit of a bone with this. When I went through the Q-Course, we had guys who also started but were brand new to the Army. Basic/AIT/Jump School/Q-Course = Instant NCO.
They were some of the worst leaders I ever saw. Whining cry-baby's who thought they knew it all and weren't afraid to tell you that, but when it came time to perform, they sucked.
They had no leadership skills, no tact, and they didn't know their way around the Army system. Yet, there they were, and they were expected to be the experts.

With officers, it is expected that the NCO's take that new Lt. under wing and train him/her. How can that happen when the NCO doesn't know his fourth-point-of-contact from a hole in the ground?

Another bone I have is the comment Dex made above. Why was someone fresh out of Basic, who was receiving E-5 pay by virtue of OCS, be promoted to Sergeant and permitted to train troops? Again, a leadership issue.

[Ford289HiPo]

If my failing memory is correct, an E-5 is roughly equivalent to Staff Sergeant?

E-5 is a Buck Sergeant in the Army, and a Staff Sergeant in the Air Force.

[EC]

I have a bit of a bone with this. When I went through the Q-Course, we had guys who also started but were brand new to the Army. Basic/AIT/Jump School/Q-Course = Instant NCO.
They were some of the worst leaders I ever saw. Whining cry-baby's who thought they knew it all and weren't afraid to tell you that, but when it came time to perform, they sucked.
They had no leadership skills, no tact, and they didn't know their way around the Army system. Yet, there they were, and they were expected to be the experts.

With officers, it is expected that the NCO's take that new Lt. under wing and train him/her. How can that happen when the NCO doesn't know his fourth-point-of-contact from a hole in the ground?

Another bone I have is the comment Dex made above. Why was someone fresh out of Basic, who was receiving E-5 pay by virtue of OCS, be promoted to Sergeant and permitted to train troops? Again, a leadership issue.

 

Thanks - my memory were rusty indeed. We have slightly different ranks, but that were inexcusable. Apologies.

The thought of an NCO that knows not ass from elbow is frightening. Larval officers need cooking and coddling to become decent human beings and officers. They are nice enough people, the pups. Eager, friendly and they need the cynicism of some guy who has seen it a million times to slam their feet back on the earth.

When I mustanged - I had had 5 years in varying ranks (got demoted a couple times. One time were fair enough, one time were totally worth it and is probably still liable for prosecution!). Came out of OTS and I had the toughest hardass you can imagine as "nominally" under me. I say nominally because he were finishing school and the graduate thesis before I got the nod.

Said it befoe and will say it again - recruits are fine, but you need cadre.

[Sarge]

Crazry small world we have here, but I know the 23 year old David.  With an effort like that to join, I think he'll go far in the US Army.

- Sarge