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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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« Reply #75 on: March 16, 2014, 11:03:43 PM »
Interesting. 

We need to agree to disagree.

Thanks.
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline katzenjammer

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« Reply #76 on: March 16, 2014, 11:03:53 PM »
Too many want to go along to get along, which has been happening for too long! It's past time that someone takes a stand, and that we stand behind whoever has the guts to speak out. The politics of the past have gotten us into this mess today. All those involved need to be gone.

Exactly!!  And calling them "moderates" just perpetrates the problem.  If we can't call a Spade, a Spade, then we deserve what we get from them.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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« Reply #77 on: March 16, 2014, 11:05:43 PM »
That stupid graphic is utter HORSESHIT!!  Get it through your head: McConnell & the GOPe are NOT "Moderates" -- they are statists.  They thrive on Big Government!!  They WANT more and more Big Government -- their actions speak much louder than their mealy mouth words.  SMH


 :thumbsup:
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline katzenjammer

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« Reply #78 on: March 16, 2014, 11:05:59 PM »
and thank you, too, for that riveting personal attack.

Why is it a personal attack??  Are "you," your graphic??  Or do you self identify as a Big Government statist??

Absent either of those, I can't see how you think it is a "personal" attack??
« Last Edit: March 16, 2014, 11:07:11 PM by katzenjammer »

Offline Oceander

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« Reply #79 on: March 16, 2014, 11:06:37 PM »
We need to agree to disagree.

Thanks.

fair enough; I realize that not everyone will agree with me, and that's not necessarily an irrational thing to do - I will be the first to acknowledge that I may be mistaken about things; as a subjective matter, I think the odds of that are significantly less than 50%, but I cannot in good faith say that those risks don't exist at all.

:beer:

Offline Oceander

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« Reply #80 on: March 16, 2014, 11:08:30 PM »
Why are you your graphic??  Or do you self identify as a Big Government statist??

Absent any of those, I can't see how you think it is a "personal" attack??

because the way that both the McConnell types and the Cruz types are behaving is stupid and inane; it's a self-defeating, politically suicidal slap fight, and my graphic is intended to get my point across in a most viceral, discomfiting way.  If you find it offensive, then it's at least achieved part of its purpose.


And telling someone to "Get it through your head" is an attack on that person's intellect and understanding - which is to say, an attack on the person - and not an attack on the ideas expressed by that person.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2014, 11:10:19 PM by Oceander »

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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« Reply #81 on: March 16, 2014, 11:09:02 PM »
fair enough; I realize that not everyone will agree with me, and that's not necessarily an irrational thing to do - I will be the first to acknowledge that I may be mistaken about things; as a subjective matter, I think the odds of that are significantly less than 50%, but I cannot in good faith say that those risks don't exist at all.

:beer:

Ok   :pondering:
« Last Edit: March 16, 2014, 11:10:05 PM by Right_in_Virginia »
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline Oceander

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« Reply #82 on: March 16, 2014, 11:12:05 PM »
Ok   :pondering:

Because I believe that you're in good faith, even if we vehemently disagree, and I believe that at the end of the day you will step into the voting booth and vote for the republican, even if you have to superglue your political nose closed in order to do so.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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« Reply #83 on: March 16, 2014, 11:13:14 PM »
Because I believe that you're in good faith, even if we vehemently disagree, and I believe that at the end of the day you will step into the voting booth and vote for the republican, even if you have to superglue your political nose closed in order to do so.

So good faith is voting for a republican because he/she is a republican?
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline Oceander

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« Reply #84 on: March 16, 2014, 11:14:06 PM »
So good faith is voting for a republican because he/she is a republican?

is good faith voting for the democrat?

Offline alicewonders

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« Reply #85 on: March 16, 2014, 11:14:07 PM »
I'm still convinced that Cruz' antics served a huge purpose in keeping hope alive in many homes across America.  Somebody was out there speaking and fighting against the insanity.
It's damned well appreciated.  And it bears out in elections. 

If he ends up like Spartacus....so be it.   There's a lot of positions in a GOP administration for a person with that intensity.  It'll drive the Left nuts.

 goopo    :beer:
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We told you Trump would win - bigly!

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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« Reply #86 on: March 16, 2014, 11:17:15 PM »
is good faith voting for the democrat?

You didn't answer my question. 
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline katzenjammer

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« Reply #87 on: March 16, 2014, 11:19:08 PM »
because the way that both the McConnell types and the Cruz types are behaving is stupid and inane; it's a self-defeating, politically suicidal slap fight, and my graphic is intended to get my point across in a most viceral, discomfiting way.  If you find it offensive, then it's at least achieved part of its purpose.


And telling someone to "Get it through your head" is an attack on that person's intellect and understanding - which is to say, an attack on the person - and not an attack on the ideas expressed by that person.

You are missing my point. 

I understand your point: you don't like the intra-party fighting.  To that I say, "It is, what it is.  Not a whole heck of a lot that I can do about that."

My point is simple: You are mischaracterizing the GOPe (or what ever you want to call them) as "moderates," and you do it relentlessly here.  It is like a disinformation campaign.  I addressed this view of "moderation" here yesterday:

Quote
I would caution on this, don't let them dictate the terms of the debate.  What we are talking about here are not "moderates."  The better terms are Big Government Wing of the GOP, Statists, Neo-Statists (if you prefer Levin's nod to his GOP roots), Establishment Class, etc.  Leaving aside all of the "social or moral" issues (which I personally would like to see removed from government as much as possible), an honest and objective assessment of the performance of the GOP (when in control) over the past 100 years, certainly doesn't give one the impression of "moderation." 

Almost $18 Trillion in Debt (not even touching on the weight on the Trillions of unfunded liabilities), a FedGov:
- that spends $3.n Trillion per year (again, not counting the accrual for a couple Trillion in unfunded liabilities),
- that must borrow an obscene amount each day (regardless of the staggering amount of tax dollars sucked out of the private economy and private citizens),
- that now has more extra-Constitutional agencies (that takes two hands to count), and
- trots out a daily set of abuses of power (from the completely unleashed regulatory arms) that fills this forum (and others like it) with pages and pages of threads each day. 
No, this isn't the result of one party's abuses and disregard of the Constitution with another party "moderating" things.  It is the result of both parties being corrupted with (albeit different flavors of) statism, and a complete disregard for the constraints and guidance of the Constitution.

(I don't need to list all of the extra-Constitional Federal Agencies created, massive entitlement programs created or expanded, or any of the other completely un-Constitional measures established by the GOP.  Anyone paying attention over the past N years is well aware of them.  But just a peek at recent history should be representative: did you ever imagine that a GOP-controlled House would vote to not merely raise the Debt Limit, but "suspend" it, 3 times in a row now.  "Suspend" it, like it just doesn't exist.  A "blank check" delivered into the hands of the most abusive & corrupt regime ever to occupy DC.  No, these aren't "moderates.")

So no, it isn't a matter of making nice with the "moderates" so that we can all "win," link arms, and set about fixing things.  It is about removing the festering brood of statists, root and branch, from within the only party that can be salvaged at this point in time.  That's what this "debate" is all about.

If that is your view of "moderation," then perhaps we do have to agree to disagree.  (And I didn't intend "get it through your head" as an attack on your intellect or understanding, if anything it was an "attack" on your apparent stubbornness!!) 
« Last Edit: March 16, 2014, 11:21:40 PM by katzenjammer »

Offline Rapunzel

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« Reply #88 on: March 17, 2014, 12:11:15 AM »
because the way that both the McConnell types and the Cruz types are behaving is stupid and inane; it's a self-defeating, politically suicidal slap fight, and my graphic is intended to get my point across in a most viceral, discomfiting way.  If you find it offensive, then it's at least achieved part of its purpose.


And telling someone to "Get it through your head" is an attack on that person's intellect and understanding - which is to say, an attack on the person - and not an attack on the ideas expressed by that person.

Frankly that is your opinion and you are desperate of late to shut down any debate whatsoever and this graphic is one more example of it and frankly I find that graphic a personal attack against my beliefs.... or is that the desired effect to drive all the conservatives from this board by out mocking or outshouting them.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2014, 12:12:40 AM by Rapunzel »

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #89 on: March 17, 2014, 12:49:23 AM »
Frankly that is your opinion and you are desperate of late to shut down any debate whatsoever and this graphic is one more example of it and frankly I find that graphic a personal attack against my beliefs.... or is that the desired effect to drive all the conservatives from this board by out mocking or outshouting them.

Rap...that's what a good lawyer will do.  Hypnotize you with paragraphs!!  LOL!

We're all family here.  Tomorrow's another day!   :laugh:
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Offline Rapunzel

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« Reply #90 on: March 17, 2014, 12:55:55 AM »
Rap...that's what a good lawyer will do.  Hypnotize you with paragraphs!!  LOL!

We're all family here.  Tomorrow's another day!   :laugh:

When people start posting dozens of paragraphs about personal opinion in reply to a comment I zone out... that is a lecture not a discussion...... if you have somethng to back up an alternative opinion then post the link and the article or swrite an opinion piece and post it in the opinion section for people to read or not read... and disagreeing with someone isn't a personal attack, that is getting thrown around way too much of late... we are going to have disagreements until the primaries are over - so people can either take the heat of the discussion or not.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2014, 12:56:54 AM by Rapunzel »

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #91 on: March 17, 2014, 01:07:59 AM »
When people start posting dozens of paragraphs about personal opinion in reply to a comment I zone out... that is a lecture not a discussion...... if you have somethng to back up an alternative opinion then post the link and the article or swrite an opinion piece and post it in the opinion section for people to read or not read... and disagreeing with someone isn't a personal attack, that is getting thrown around way too much of late... we are going to have disagreements until the primaries are over - so people can either take the heat of the discussion or not.

Amen, sister!   :beer:
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

 I think the worst time to have a heart attack would be during a game of charades.

Offline xyno

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« Reply #92 on: March 17, 2014, 10:12:10 AM »
Too many are taking themselves too seriously, it seems to me.  Now, that is not to take sides or diminish the import of our screwed-up circumstances.  But really - furor and personal jibes because of a cartoon that essentially captures an element of the ongoing bickering?

Color me perplexed.


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