Author Topic: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators  (Read 3892 times)

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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2014, 12:18:25 pm »
Do those mailers attack the GOP?  Because that is what Cruz is doing.  "Well ya know, It is remarkable in the 13 months I've been in the Senate, it has become apparent to me the single thing that Republican politicians hate, and fear the most, and that is when they are forced to tell the truth."  Senator Cruz on his failure to filibuster the debt ceiling hike.

Rules for Radicals
Rule 4 “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.”

Cruz has picked his enemy and it ain't the rats.

I'm guessing from the selective manner that you rebuilt my quote that we're in agreement about the portion of it that didn't make it to your response.

There are two lines of thoughts prevalent in politics. Once says that the elected officials are beholden to the political party that they belong to, and the other one argues that they are beholden to the people who elected them to represent their interests in DC.

I'm with the later, and while I fully understand the idea of party unity, I expect the individuals who I sent to DC to represent me, to speak up and make noise if they believe that things are happening which are not in my best interest.

Insofar as whether or not those mailers attack the GOP...

I am a fairly well-informed political junkie in recovery, and I pay close attention to what's going on in all levels of government.

The GOP, and the GOP media support infrastructure have been attacking Cruz mercilessly for quite sometime. If I were one of the people of Texas who sent Cruz to DC, I'd have some rather serious doubts about putting a check in the mail to support the GOP.

To a great degree, the TEA Party movement was instrumental in helping the GOP regain the House, and once those TEA Party delegates got to DC, the GOP establishment demanded that they walk away from the principles which got them to DC, and "play ball" nicely with the establishment's play book.

THAT was never going to work.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, i have others." - Groucho Marx

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2014, 12:22:43 pm »
You guys would laugh if you heard Cornyn's political ads in Texas. He paints himself as a Chuck Norris or Batman like figure fighting Obama at every turn.
 
To paraphrase his theme, it goes something like...
 
Texas is the land of manly men and good Christian people.
Obama has gone too and we hate him together.
You have to vote for Cornyn to defend Texas from Obama.
 
If you didn't know any better, one would think Cornyn is Cruz by just listening to his ads. It seems that Cornyn is running on Cruz's record and behavior, while simultaneously stabbing him in the back. There is nothing a politician will not do to win.
You cannot "COEXIST" with people who want to kill you.
If they kill their own with no conscience, there is nothing to stop them from killing you.
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Offline aligncare

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2014, 01:31:18 pm »
Thanks for that perspective, 240. Politicians are a hoot!

Offline alicewonders

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2014, 02:11:44 pm »
You guys would laugh if you heard Cornyn's political ads in Texas. He paints himself as a Chuck Norris or Batman like figure fighting Obama at every turn.
 
To paraphrase his theme, it goes something like...
 
Texas is the land of manly men and good Christian people.
Obama has gone too and we hate him together.
You have to vote for Cornyn to defend Texas from Obama.
 
If you didn't know any better, one would think Cornyn is Cruz by just listening to his ads. It seems that Cornyn is running on Cruz's record and behavior, while simultaneously stabbing him in the back. There is nothing a politician will not do to win.

We have the same thing here in Kentucky with Mitch McConnell - his ads are all "I'll stand up to Obama!"  He is absolutely dispicable. 
Don't tread on me.   8888madkitty

We told you Trump would win - bigly!

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #29 on: February 14, 2014, 02:24:30 pm »
You guys would laugh if you heard Cornyn's political ads in Texas. He paints himself as a Chuck Norris or Batman like figure fighting Obama at every turn.
 
To paraphrase his theme, it goes something like...
 
Texas is the land of manly men and good Christian people.
Obama has gone too and we hate him together.
You have to vote for Cornyn to defend Texas from Obama.
 
If you didn't know any better, one would think Cornyn is Cruz by just listening to his ads. It seems that Cornyn is running on Cruz's record and behavior, while simultaneously stabbing him in the back. There is nothing a politician will not do to win.

Yep! But WE know better don't we will be voting for Dwayne Stovall!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline massadvj

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2014, 03:13:38 pm »
It's not about battles and losing battles.  It's more like taking a battering ram and knocking down the palace gates.  You just keep at it until something gives.  Stay relentless and don't give up.  And don't be afraid to go after every keeper of the palace gates, either, regardless of who they are.

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2014, 03:22:00 pm »
It's not about battles and losing battles.  It's more like taking a battering ram and knocking down the palace gates.  You just keep at it until something gives.  Stay relentless and don't give up.  And don't be afraid to go after every keeper of the palace gates, either, regardless of who they are.

 :thumbsup2: :thumbsup2: :thumbsup2:
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline evadR

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2014, 04:26:37 pm »
".. by forcing an uncomfortable and avoidable vote on increasing the federal government’s debt limit."

awww, poor babies. Made them uncomfortable.

Somebody get a rope.

Vampires never can stand the light of day.
November 6, 2012, a day in infamy...the death of a republic as we know it.

Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2014, 04:28:17 pm »
It's not about battles and losing battles.  It's more like taking a battering ram and knocking down the palace gates.  You just keep at it until something gives.  Stay relentless and don't give up.  And don't be afraid to go after every keeper of the palace gates, either, regardless of who they are.

Yep.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, i have others." - Groucho Marx

Offline LambChop

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2014, 04:30:56 pm »
More clown car antics from the Senator with the biggest, floppiest shoes in Washington.

Cruz doesn't know what "pissin' in the ocean" means.

Oh, I bet he does.  He knew it would go nowhere.  Leaving him safe to "show off" for the camera's.  He can say he sticks to his principles.
He's in it for the money.  And his father is making a nice profit from it too going around being a $***stirrer.

Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #35 on: February 14, 2014, 04:34:47 pm »
".. by forcing an uncomfortable and avoidable vote on increasing the federal government’s debt limit."

awww, poor babies. Made them uncomfortable.

Somebody get a rope.

Vampires never can stand the light of day.

That's the money quote of the entire debacle.

EVERYONE in government KNOWS that the Federal debt is an uncontrollable runaway train that's headed straight into a trackless cliff end to its run.

They are clueless and powerless to stop it, and because of that, they want as little light shining on it as possible.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, i have others." - Groucho Marx

Offline Fishrrman

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #36 on: February 14, 2014, 05:20:45 pm »
Once-Ler wrote above:
[[ Cruz has picked his enemy and it ain't the rats. ]]

He's right on target.

The rats are the enemy that makes no bones about "being the enemy".

The Vichy Republicans are the enemy that tries to cloak their true nature behind a veil of deceit. They are the the worse of the two.

Go get 'em, Ted !!

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #37 on: February 14, 2014, 05:37:45 pm »
You guys would laugh if you heard Cornyn's political ads in Texas. He paints himself as a Chuck Norris or Batman like figure fighting Obama at every turn.
 
To paraphrase his theme, it goes something like...
 
Texas is the land of manly men and good Christian people.
Obama has gone too and we hate him together.
You have to vote for Cornyn to defend Texas from Obama.
 
If you didn't know any better, one would think Cornyn is Cruz by just listening to his ads. It seems that Cornyn is running on Cruz's record and behavior, while simultaneously stabbing him in the back. There is nothing a politician will not do to win.

How silly.  Cornyn is ten times the conservative Republican that Cruz is.  Cruz is a showboater, like Obama, who's biding his time in the Senate until 2016.  Taking the same path as Dear Leader.  No executive experience but lots of mouth.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2014, 05:50:25 pm »
Yep........ Ac and Bigun......... and frankly, I am sick of people supporting people simply for having an R behind their names when they are doing exactly what the Democrats are doing.. sick of giving people a freaking pass in this country because of the party they "claim" allegiance to.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #39 on: February 14, 2014, 05:50:30 pm »
Once-Ler wrote above:
[[ Cruz has picked his enemy and it ain't the rats. ]]

He's right on target.

The rats are the enemy that makes no bones about "being the enemy".

The Vichy Republicans are the enemy that tries to cloak their true nature behind a veil of deceit. They are the the worse of the two.

Go get 'em, Ted !!

I agree completely!  :beer:
« Last Edit: February 14, 2014, 05:51:07 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline evadR

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #40 on: February 15, 2014, 05:20:26 am »
Vichy Pubbies. I like it.
Best description I've heard yet.
November 6, 2012, a day in infamy...the death of a republic as we know it.

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #41 on: February 15, 2014, 10:04:00 am »
Exactly, Bigun. Both parties jettisoned constitutional principles of governance along time ago.

There are precious few politicians who care more about the future of the country than their team jersey. And from my perspective here in the Peoples Republic of New York City, Ted Cruz appears sincere in his efforts to do the right thing.

I thought de Blasio told you to get out.  Good thing he can't sign executive orders.

http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/gingrich-obamacare-shutdown/2013/10/13/id/530774
"Ted Cruz is a very aggressive articulator of a hard-line position that probably 20, 25 percent of the country agrees with," Gingrich said.

I think that 20-25% figure is way too high.  I base this on the fact that there are so few elected representatives in Congress that are acceptable to the far right.  But I'll concede to Newt.

From my perspective taking on a war with 75% to 80% of the political spectrum is suicidal no matter how valiant or principled.  Do you believe the rest of the country will be led by shame of how your only concern is the future of our country and not the party?  Sorry not working for me.  Of course you do have your claim to the Constitution on your side.  Ask the 1.2 million babies constitutionally aborted last year about the Constitution.  Constitution didn't save me from Obamacare.  The Constitution means nothing if the people are ignorant of it or apathetic about it.  The people have the power not the paper.

I believe you think our country would be much better off if our government was way more conservative.  I think it would be too.  I believe you think our country would be better off if our government was way more conservative tomorrow.  I do not, because the voters are not conservative and the representatives would be voted out in the next election.   

The people have spoken and 75% to 80% of the country believes it has the right to decide for themselves.  They will not be bullied and they are unpersuaded by besmirchment or attention antics like government shutdowns.  The shutdown is a perfect illustration of why you need to convince the voters first.  Had Cruz agreed to the first extension and made his grand stand at the recent debt limit increase he might have had a shot of stopping Obamacare.  After the cancellations and website failure.  Sen Cruz wanted to skip persuading the people and just lead them where they don't want to go for the own good.

But Cruz shot his load too soon.  Fortunately Obamacare looks like such a grand failure that the GOP will have good fortune in Nov.  I like to picture this scene...The GOPe returns fire on the Club for Growth http://www.primarymycongressman.com/ and the Senate Conservative Fund http://www.senateconservatives.com/site/post/2481/replace-the-speaker.  McConnell wins, Cornyn wins, Graham wins in fact the whole GOPe win their primaries.   That would be a good time to pass amnesty...I mean before Obama makes them legal by executive order and takes all the credit. Then the GOP takes the Senate despite the efforts of real conservatives.  I'm getting a patriotic feeling. :patriot:   

From my perspective as a party before all else GOPe-er it would be more pragmatic to jettison the weight of the far right ideologues and focus on converting DINO voters into RINOs.  Each rat voter converted to GOP counts as two votes.  One taken away from the rats, and one added to the GOP.  A disaffected far right voter returning to the GOP only adds one vote to the GOP total.  It more trouble than it is worth.

When asked why he agreed to a shutdown he didn't believe in Boehner said a leader without followers is simply a man taking a walk.  I submit it doesn't matter if Sen Cruz is correct if a majority of the people don't support him no matter how forcefully he speaks the words his followers want to hear. 


Offline aligncare

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #42 on: February 15, 2014, 12:29:06 pm »

From my perspective taking on a war with 75% to 80% of the political spectrum is suicidal no matter how valiant or principled.


I realize getting fiscal and monetary sanity from two similar parties – both irresponsible spenders and taxers – is difficult. It will take time. But a long and difficult journey begins with the first step. I'm hopeful enough disaffected Democrats and country club Republicans will come along.

I stand (and walk) with Ted Cruz.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2014, 06:14:53 pm by aligncare »

Online Bigun

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #43 on: February 15, 2014, 02:05:27 pm »
I realize getting fiscal and monetary sanity from two similar parties, both are irresponsible spenders and taxers, is difficult. It will take time. But a long and difficult journey begins with the first step. I'm hopeful enough disaffected Democrats and country club Republicans will come along.

I stand (and walk) with Ted Cruz.

I'm right there with you on all points! We didn't get where we are overnight and neither will we get to where we need to be overnight! But we WILL get there if we get behind folks like Ted Cruz, Mike Lee, and Ran Paul and keep our shoulders to the wheel!
« Last Edit: February 15, 2014, 02:06:31 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #44 on: February 15, 2014, 04:52:56 pm »
 :amen: Bigun and Aligncare.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #45 on: February 15, 2014, 05:13:46 pm »
Once-Ler wrote above:
[[ Cruz has picked his enemy and it ain't the rats. ]]

He's right on target.

The rats are the enemy that makes no bones about "being the enemy".

The Vichy Republicans are the enemy that tries to cloak their true nature behind a veil of deceit. They are the the worse of the two.

Go get 'em, Ted !!

I like Cruz, as Lincoln once said about U.S. Grant, "he fights".

I can't support him for POTUS because he is ineligible to hold the office under Article II, Section 1 of the US Constitution.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, i have others." - Groucho Marx

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #46 on: February 15, 2014, 06:18:14 pm »
http://washingtonexaminer.com/angry-at-ted-cruz-republicans-should-remember-what-he-represents/article/2544006

Angry at Ted Cruz, Republicans should remember what he represents
By Byron York | FEBRUARY 13, 2014 AT 10:46 PM

Republicans have a good chance to win control of the Senate this November. Democrats are on the defensive over Obamacare, the president is unpopular, and history suggests second-term mid-terms are nearly always unlucky for the White House.

Given that, why is there so much division, backbiting, and bad blood among some Senate Republicans? Last seen during the government shutdown fiasco, the GOP malady returned this week with a debt ceiling mini-fiasco, and it threatens to revisit the Senate any number of times before Election Day.


There is at least one common thread in the shutdown and debt ceiling incidents, and that is Sen. Ted Cruz. For whatever reason, the Texas freshman has at times goaded his party to dysfunction, embarrassment, and defeat. (Not quite singlehandedly; others, like Sens. Mike Lee and Rand Paul, have also been done their bit.)

Many in the GOP believe Cruz is just out for himself. But even if that's true, they have to remember that he represents more than just Ted Cruz. There are a lot of Republicans -- it's not clear how many, but a significant portion of the party's base -- that cheers Cruz on when he battles with Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. They want to see a Republican throw a wrench in the Washington spending machine, even if it creates chaos and damages the GOP's standing with independent voters. And it is that conviction that is really behind the party's problems; it is why Republicans would not enjoy smooth sailing even if Cruz were to retire tomorrow.

What was remarkable about the brief debt limit fight is how small the stakes were. Republicans, burned by recent failures, did not propose to add some huge fiscal reform -- a restructuring of entitlements, for example -- to a measure to raise the debt limit. Instead, they discussed more modest measures, like reworking the cost-of-living adjustment for veterans that was part of the recent bipartisan budget deal.

When the week began, Senate Republicans expected the House to attach something small to the debt limit bill that would be sent to the Senate. They were taken off guard Tuesday morning when House Speaker John Boehner announced that wouldn't happen -- that the House, relying on mostly Democratic votes, would instead pass a bill to raise the debt limit with no strings attached.

Senate Republicans met in their weekly lunch a few hours after Boehner's announcement. The short version of events is that McConnell urged colleagues to allow a vote on the House debt limit bill. If the GOP did not object, it could be passed with a simple 51-vote majority, and since there are 55 Democrats in the Senate who would vote for it, every Republican could vote against it and it would still pass. Problem solved; there would be no more default talk, and Republicans could go back to slamming Democrats over Obamacare.

Then Cruz stood up and said there was no way in the world he would stand by and allow a debt ceiling increase to be passed with just 51 votes. Cruz insisted on a 60-vote threshold, which the rules allowed him to do. That meant at least five Republicans would have to join Democrats for the debt limit to be raised.

It would be an understatement to say that many of Cruz's GOP colleagues were righteously ticked off at him. Nobody wanted to vote to raise the debt limit, but many believed strongly that a losing fight over spending would damage the party. Besides, Cruz didn't even have a plan for what to do had his Republican colleagues improbably decided to go along with him.

So after some testy exchanges at the lunch, and a lot of negotiating in the afternoon, McConnell and other leaders decided to vote for the debt limit increase. Then several other Republicans, mostly those in unthreatened seats, agreed to vote along with them to provide cover. The bill passed with 12 Republicans joining all 55 Democrats.

Cruz, of course, voted no and accused lawmakers who voted yes of "not listening to the American people." He even suggested those who are up for re-election — a group that very prominently includes McConnell himself — might soon pay a heavy price. "Sometimes, come November, the people remember," Cruz said.

In the end, the gambit accomplished nothing for Senate Republicans. Some GOP lawmakers who already disliked Cruz now dislike him even more. But the episode did remind the Republican leadership, as if it needs any reminding, that there are conservatives around the country who are deeply frustrated by the GOP and want it to show some fight.

To them, Cruz represents that fight. Maybe they've been misled. Maybe they're living in a fantasy land. But that's what they believe. Republican leaders have to keep them in mind as November approaches.
�The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.� G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #47 on: February 16, 2014, 04:34:06 am »
And you have known going in that you were going to loose all of them haven't you Sink! Go cower in the corner while the rest of us try to save what's left of our country!

 :thumbsup:

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #48 on: February 16, 2014, 04:47:04 am »
I've never found it useful to fight battles I knew, going in, that I was going to lose.

Like the American Revolution?

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: Ted Cruz's debt ceiling filibuster puts heat on Cornyn, other GOP senators
« Reply #49 on: February 16, 2014, 10:19:44 am »
I like Cruz, as Lincoln once said about U.S. Grant, "he fights".

Gen. Lee thought Pickett was a fighter too.  Don Quixote was a fighter.

I like Cruz's goals.  I'll grant he is intelligent, but he's not intellectual.  He is incredibly lacking in self-awareness.  Often assuming to speak for the American people.  He has no conception how he appears to moderate voters and a growing number of right of center Republicans much less Democrats.  He is a lousy spokesman for the GOP.  Definitely not universally respected. http://www.cnn.com/2014/02/14/politics/gop-cruz-control/index.html?hpt=po_c1  ...and it doesn't appear he can think further than 16 day into the future. 

That being said if the primary voters picked him in 2014 I'd vote for him.  He'd be worlds better than any rat.  But the GOP primary voters will never nominate him for President.  He doesn't unify the party.

The GOPe, or what I like to call the grown ups, will not let him embarrass the party further.  In 2 weeks the first tea party challenge to take down Cornyn will fail.