Author Topic: Republicans to the Rescue?  (Read 412 times)

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Offline happyg

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Republicans to the Rescue?
« on: February 04, 2014, 12:52:01 PM »
By : Thomas Sowell

Some supporters of President Obama may be worried about how he and the Democrats are going to fare politically, as the problems of ObamaCare continue to escalate, and it looks like the Republicans have a chance to win a majority in the Senate.

But Democrats may not need to worry so much. Republicans may once again come to the rescue of the Democrats, by discrediting themselves and snatching defeat from the very jaws of victory.

The latest bright idea among Republicans inside the Beltway is a new version of amnesty that is virtually certain to lose votes among the Republican base and is unlikely to gain many votes among the Hispanics that the Republican leadership is courting.

One of the enduring political mysteries is how the Republicans can be so successful in winning governorships and control of state legislatures, while failing to make much headway in Washington. Maybe there are just too many clever GOP consultants inside the Beltway.

When it comes to national elections, just what principles do the Republicans stand for? It is hard to think of any, other than their hoping to win elections by converting themselves into Democrats lite. But voters who want what the Democrats offer can vote for the real thing, rather than Johnny-come-lately imitations.

Listening to discussions of immigration laws and proposals to reform them is like listening to something out of “Alice in Wonderland.”

Immigration laws are the only laws that are discussed in terms of how to help people who break them. One of the big problems that those who are pushing “comprehensive immigration reform” want solved is how to help people who came here illegally and are now “living in the shadows” as a result.

What about embezzlers or burglars who are “living in the shadows” in fear that someone will discover their crimes? Why not “reform” the laws against embezzlement or burglary, so that such people can also come out of the shadows?

Almost everyone seems to think that we need to solve the problem of the children of illegal immigrants, because these children are here “through no fault of their own.” Do people who say that have any idea how many millions of children are living in dire poverty in India, Africa or other places “through no fault of their own,” and would be better off living in the United States?

Do all children have some inherent right to live in America if they have done nothing wrong? If not, then why should the children of illegal immigrants have such a right?

More fundamentally, why do the American people not have a right to the protection that immigration laws provide people in other countries around the world — including Mexico, where illegal immigrants from other countries get no such special treatment as Mexico and its American supporters are demanding for illegal immigrants in the United States?

The very phrase “comprehensive” immigration reform is part of the bad faith that has surrounded immigration issues for decades. What “comprehensive” reform means is that border control and amnesty should be voted on together in Congress.

Why? Because that would be politically convenient for members of Congress, who like to be on both sides of issues, so as to minimize the backlash from the voting public. But what “comprehensive” immigration reform has always meant in practice is amnesty up front and a promise to control the border later — promises that have never been kept.

The new Republican proposal is to have some border control criteria whose fulfillment will automatically serve as a “trigger” to let the legalizing of illegal immigrants proceed. But why set up some automatic triggering device to signal that the borders are secure, when the Obama administration is virtually guaranteed to game the system, so that amnesty can proceed?

What in the world is wrong with Congress taking up border security first, as a separate issue, and later taking responsibility in a Congressional vote on whether the border has become secure? Congress at least should come out of the shadows.

The Republican plan for granting legalization up front, while withholding citizenship, is too clever by half. It is like saying that you can slide halfway down a slippery slope.

Republicans may yet rescue the Democrats, while demoralizing their own supporters and utterly failing the country.
http://www.rightwingnews.com/column-2/republicans-to-the-rescue/

Offline massadvj

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2014, 01:12:07 PM »
Immigration laws are the only laws that are discussed in terms of how to help people who break them.

Not entirely true.  Marijuana laws also fall into this category.

I usually agree with Sowell, but on this issue I have a slight disagreement.  I doubt Sowell's mentor Milton Friedman would agree with him, either.  Friedman understood that open borders are an insurance policy against socialism and that closed borders are an attempt to preserve socialism by keeping beneficiaries out.  Therefore, we should not be discouraging open borders.

What we should be discouraging is socialism, and most of the "pathway to citizenship" proposals are objectionable on the basis that they expand the welfare state.  But an open border with Mexico, whereby guest workers can come and go freely, would benefit us so long as the guest workers were not given access to government handouts.  In other words, it's the handouts that are the problem, not the immigrants themselves.  The immigrants are simply acting in their best economic interest, which is precisely what we should all do.     
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Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2014, 02:48:12 PM »
In other words, it's the handouts that are the problem, not the immigrants themselves.  The immigrants are simply acting in their best economic interest, which is precisely what we should all do. 

Exactly.........  cut off the benefits for all non-citizens. Stop the anchor baby program.  Return to a bracero work program.
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Online Bigun

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2014, 02:50:28 PM »
In other words, it's the handouts that are the problem, not the immigrants themselves.  The immigrants are simply acting in their best economic interest, which is precisely what we should all do. 

Exactly.........  cut off the benefits for all non-citizens. Stop the anchor baby program.  Return to a bracero work program.

Yep!  :beer:
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Online EC

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2014, 04:42:28 PM »
But an open border with Mexico, whereby guest workers can come and go freely, would benefit us so long as the guest workers were not given access to government handouts.  In other words, it's the handouts that are the problem, not the immigrants themselves.  The immigrants are simply acting in their best economic interest, which is precisely what we should all do.   

Would the guest worker program work both ways? Mexico is pretty short on engineers - and there are a lot of older engineers who can't get work in the USA.
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Offline xfreeper

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2014, 05:06:12 PM »
In other words, it's the handouts that are the problem, not the immigrants themselves.  The immigrants are simply acting in their best economic interest, which is precisely what we should all do. 

Exactly.........  cut off the benefits for all non-citizens. Stop the anchor baby program.  Return to a bracero work program.

We put out the red carpet for illegals offering every means of support, licenses, education, health care and protection from any kind of prosecution. They don't really need jobs. We provide everything they need. Than we say we can't round up the hoards of invaders so we have to give them amnesty. Take away all the perks and they will leave on their own. Then round up the politicians who created this disaster and hang them

Online EC

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2014, 05:13:37 PM »
Then round up the politicians who created this disaster and hang them

I never pegged you as a Green! Nice job on recycling and keeping the environment clean.  :tongue2:
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Offline xfreeper

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2014, 05:29:59 PM »
Oh yeah. Always happy to help

Offline massadvj

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2014, 06:22:51 PM »
Would the guest worker program work both ways? Mexico is pretty short on engineers - and there are a lot of older engineers who can't get work in the USA.

Whether there is reciprocity or not, our side should be open to anyone who wants to invest capital (including their personal labor) in this country.  Open borders and expanded trade are almost always preferable to trade restriction.  Countries that attempt to lock their economic advantages in usually end up shooting themselves in the foot, as has been demonstrated by the historical record.
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Offline xfreeper

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2014, 06:28:02 PM »
open borders and expanded trade are two different issues. A country that wants to protect it's borders shouldn't be labeled trade restrictive

Online EC

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2014, 06:28:41 PM »
Whether there is reciprocity or not, our side should be open to anyone who wants to invest capital (including their personal labor) in this country.  Open borders and expanded trade are almost always preferable to trade restriction.  Countries that attempt to lock their economic advantages in usually end up shooting themselves in the foot, as has been demonstrated by the historical record.

Oh, I agree with your base point. The entire country is, or at least was, testament to that. Just thinking that if it was a bilateral agreement, Mexico could kickstart it's own economy by using the experience of people who are simply too old or expensive to hire by US firms. That would also reduce the amount of illegals running the border as conditions got better in Mexico.
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Offline Oceander

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Re: Republicans to the Rescue?
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2014, 09:28:58 PM »
Would the guest worker program work both ways? Mexico is pretty short on engineers - and there are a lot of older engineers who can't get work in the USA.

That's a nonsensical statement because this is a matter of internal US policy, not a matter of international negotiation between the US and Mexico.  I'm sure that if Congress could it would unilaterally make it reciprocal; but they can't so they'll have to decide on the immigration policy that makes the most sense for the US - and that includes taking into account the costs of the sort of draconian solutions so many people so glibly favor.

That being said, Mexican immigration policy seems to work on a points system, and those who rack up enough points - and being a professional, like an engineer, racks up a lot of points - can get a visa to work in Mexico, at least on a temporary basis for up to 4 years.  If one is sufficiently concerned about those older American engineers, then perhaps one should be assisting them in applying for a visa to work in Mexico?


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