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Offline Rapunzel

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« on: January 07, 2014, 04:32:28 PM »

Offline collins

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« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2014, 06:31:24 PM »
LOL, okay, so Christine is still funny to me right now, but that'll stop if Fatty gets anywhere close to capturing the GOP nomination in 2016. He is such a tool, first the Muslims, now the Mexicans? I'd guessed a double-cheeseburger platter with works would be his real "inspiration".

Offline MBB1984

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« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2014, 06:44:01 PM »
Most criminals think fellow law breakers are an inspiration.  If Christie is the face of the GOP, we need to put the GOP out of its misery.

Offline olde north church

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« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2014, 06:58:50 PM »
Let's get real, it's going to boil down, as usual to the least worse and more Conservatives and Republicans staying at home.
Why?  Well, because I'm a bastard, that's why.

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2014, 10:58:25 PM »
He's the ONLY Republican today that can do an outreach like this effectively.

Or are some of our members not able to grasp the concept?    :whistle:
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline Fishrrman

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« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2014, 11:07:41 PM »
Let's get real, it's going to boil down, as usual to the least worse and more Conservatives and Republicans staying at home.

I won't be voting for Chris Christie for president. I will not change my mind. This is for the record. I won't be eatin' any crow on it!

No way!

D.C. Patriot, are you "able to grasp the concept?"  ;)
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 11:08:34 PM by Fishrrman »

Offline Oceander

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« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2014, 11:16:38 PM »
I won't be voting for Chris Christie for president. I will not change my mind. This is for the record. I won't be eatin' any crow on it!

No way!

D.C. Patriot, are you "able to grasp the concept?"  ;)

Then the rest of the GOP had better start dealing with illegal immigrants in a more practical, Reaganesque, way, or by default the choices will be Christie or a demoncrat.

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2014, 11:42:42 PM »
I won't be voting for Chris Christie for president. I will not change my mind. This is for the record. I won't be eatin' any crow on it!

No way!

D.C. Patriot, are you "able to grasp the concept?"  ;)

First, let me say that I respect your opinion.  If you don't want to vote against your personal principles, so be it. 

Lord knows that's a lot more important to the country than another four years of this Marxist crap under Hillary Clinton.

....do I need a sarcasm tag?   :laugh:

"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline MBB1984

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« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2014, 08:29:00 AM »
He's the ONLY Republican today that can do an outreach like this effectively.

Or are some of our members not able to grasp the concept?    :whistle:

Christie is appalling for many reasons.  First, he is ego maniacal.  He tried to upstage Romney throughout the last election including the convention speech.  He embraced Obama to serve his own self interest at a crucial and pivotal time.  The GOP does not need a narcissist as it nominee.  Second, Christie has a very questionable past.  He was investigated by the department of Justice for excessive spending while a US attorney.  He was a lobbyist for a securities group during the Madoff era.  Romney backed away from Christie in large part due to his baggage.  He is ripe for scandal.  The baggage will be on full exhibit if he is the nominee.  Third, Christie is a left wing Republican.  He is against the Second Amendment, pro amnesty, and liberal on social issues.  He seems to have no real Conservative ideological core.  What Conservative tendencies he may have could easily be discarded to soothe his self interest and  massive ego.   Fourth, Christie is a bully and has  a mob boss mentality.  He wouldn't let Romney raise cash in Jersey until he gave permission.  He will seek to crush Conservative opposition within the GOP if he is the nominee.  He will be the GOP version of Stalin.

Christie reminds me of a less intelligent though much fatter version of Richard Nixon.  He will be at least equally bad as Nixon.  For these and other reasons, I will not vote for Christie under any circumstances.

Offline jmyrlefuller

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« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2014, 09:16:46 AM »
He's the ONLY Republican today that can do an outreach like this effectively.

Or are some of our members not able to grasp the concept?    :whistle:
I am familiar with the concept of selling out.


(Photo credit: AP via Politico)

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2014, 09:25:54 AM »
I am familiar with the concept of selling out.


(Photo credit: AP via Politico)

He was trying to do everything he could to ensure that Obama would be forced to act swiftly in getting FEMA and other assistance for the New Jersey Shore economy.

If you were the Governor of New Jersey at that time, you'd kiss Obama's a$$ too.....in Nordstom's front window.
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline MBB1984

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« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2014, 09:41:15 AM »
He was trying to do everything he could to ensure that Obama would be forced to act swiftly in getting FEMA and other assistance for the New Jersey Shore economy.

If you were the Governor of New Jersey at that time, you'd kiss Obama's a$$ too.....in Nordstom's front window.

I believe Christie could have accomplished those objectives without the passionate embrace and Obama love.   Christie did not want Romney to win as it would delay his run.  Christie also wanted a strong victory in Jersey to propel him as a front runner in the 2016 race.  Bottom line, Christie did what he does best:  Benefit himself by any means necessary. 

Offline Relic

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« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2014, 09:52:24 AM »
First, let me say that I respect your opinion.  If you don't want to vote against your personal principles, so be it. 

Lord knows that's a lot more important to the country than another four years of this Marxist crap under Hillary Clinton.

....do I need a sarcasm tag?   :laugh:

I see that you've determined that snark, sarcasm and derision are essential ways to advance your view.

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #13 on: January 08, 2014, 09:59:19 AM »
I see that you've determined that snark, sarcasm and derision are essential ways to advance your view.

I agree with you....on this topic.

It's cultivated by communicating with 'brick walls' for over a decade.....on the topic of dealing with "illegal immigrants".

I've been proven correct on virtually EVERY detail on how the issue was going to be handled and manipulated....since 1998.
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #14 on: January 08, 2014, 10:01:36 AM »
I see that you've determined that snark, sarcasm and derision are essential ways to advance your view.

How else to respond to a fellow Conservative who thinks it's wiser to sit on your a$$ and stay home rather than cast a vote against the greater evil among us?

That worked really well in 2012 didn't it?
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline Relic

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« Reply #15 on: January 08, 2014, 10:14:47 AM »
How else to respond to a fellow Conservative who thinks it's wiser to sit on your a$$ and stay home rather than cast a vote against the greater evil among us?

That worked really well in 2012 didn't it?

People are people. Conservative, libertarian, liberal, doesn't matter, if someone has their mind made up, moving them off that is unlikely. It's extremely unlikely to be productive to attack and deride.

Realistically, all you can do is make your case, and let whoever reads it decide. You may move some lurkers, but those who have decided that Christie is unpalatable, are unlikely to reconsider.

Or you can take the sinkspur approach, and hammer everyone who disagrees with you. Not productive, but it seems to make him feel better.

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2014, 10:24:57 AM »


Or you can take the sinkspur approach, and hammer everyone who disagrees with you. Not productive, but it seems to make him feel better.



...or it could be a case of Sinkspur doing exactly what your strategy is......standing up for your principles regardless of the outcome and despite whose feelings get hurt. 
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline Relic

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« Reply #17 on: January 08, 2014, 10:29:05 AM »
...or it could be a case of Sinkspur doing exactly what your strategy is......standing up for your principles regardless of the outcome and despite whose feelings get hurt.

Bullspit. There is standing up, and there is attacking, name calling, and just being plain old nasty.

I agree with sinkspur often. I disagree with his name calling style just as often. You have waded into those waters in this thread. If it makes you feel good, go for it. I'm not easily offended, but I do know that being disagreeable is rarely the path to reaching an agreement.

Offline DCPatriot

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« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2014, 10:35:58 AM »
Bullspit. There is standing up, and there is attacking, name calling, and just being plain old nasty.

I agree with sinkspur often. I disagree with his name calling style just as often. You have waded into those waters in this thread. If it makes you feel good, go for it. I'm not easily offended, but I do know that being disagreeable is rarely the path to reaching an agreement.

The huge irony that I see here?

Sinkspur and I have been butting heads on illegal immigrants for years.   It's one of the very few issues we don't see eye to eye.

I keep telling him it's because he's in Texas....a state overrun by border jumpers for years.   Same thing with Rapunzel....who's in Arizona.  Their firsthand experience with them is totally different than my interaction with them.

Maryland however, is a huge sanctuary State.   There's not a Republican to be found in elective office anywhere....other than on the Eastern Shore or in the far reaches of the Western part of the State.

I've eaten at their dinner tables....played catch with their kids.   Perspective is everything I guess.    :laugh:
« Last Edit: January 08, 2014, 10:42:20 AM by DCPatriot »
"It aint what you don't know that kills you.  It's what you know that aint so!" ...Theodore Sturgeon

"Journalism is about covering the news.  With a pillow.  Until it stops moving."    - Iowahawk

Offline Relic

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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2014, 10:56:35 AM »
The huge irony that I see here?

Sinkspur and I have been butting heads on illegal immigrants for years.   It's one of the very few issues we don't see eye to eye.

I keep telling him it's because he's in Texas....a state overrun by border jumpers for years.   Same thing with Rapunzel....who's in Arizona.  Their firsthand experience with them is totally different than my interaction with them.

I've eaten at their dinner tables....played catch with their kids.   Perspective is everything I guess.    :laugh:

I'm talking style not substance here.

If you want to go back to substance in a format other than attack style, I can do that. There are two issues at hand, Christie's presidential prospects and immigration. You seem to be focused on immigration.

As for Christie, I find him lacking. I dislike his bullying, and extreme self interest. Christie may be better than a Democrat, but it's not a clear superiority. As was said up thread, and I agree, Christie is likely to jettison anything for self interest. Which means with enough media pressure, Christie could be coerced into governing like a liberal Democrat. If Christie is the nominee, I'll have a very, very difficult time deciding what to do.

As for immigration, that's a very confusing one. We have laws, and the laws are sufficient, if they were only enforced. Your view seems to be more emotion rather than calculation. Don't get me wrong, emotion should be part of the calculus, but it shouldn't be the sole determinant. We have millions of people who were lured here to provide cheap labor. Unfortunately, along with the hard workers came the criminals. I'm suspicious of amnesty because the last amnesty was such a sham. If I had my say, we would close the border first. Make it so Mexicans have to go through the same process as Indians, or Vietnamese, or Italians, or anyone else to enter the country. Put in place a real, verifiable work visa program. Those that have made a life here, give them the option to become American, or go home. Those that are criminal in their behavior, deport them. If they are to be deported, they can take their family, or leave them here, doesn't matter, but we don't need more criminals. That's how I would do it.

The urban blacks need someone to work so they can stay on welfare, may as well be Mexicans. It's going to be interesting when Mexicans become the dominant culture in the United States, and they will, because Mexicans won't have "white guilt". Urban blacks are going to get a real wake up when Mexicans are in charge.


Offline Oceander

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« Reply #20 on: January 08, 2014, 11:58:20 AM »
I'm talking style not substance here.

If you want to go back to substance in a format other than attack style, I can do that. There are two issues at hand, Christie's presidential prospects and immigration. You seem to be focused on immigration.

As for Christie, I find him lacking. I dislike his bullying, and extreme self interest. Christie may be better than a Democrat, but it's not a clear superiority. As was said up thread, and I agree, Christie is likely to jettison anything for self interest. Which means with enough media pressure, Christie could be coerced into governing like a liberal Democrat. If Christie is the nominee, I'll have a very, very difficult time deciding what to do.

As for immigration, that's a very confusing one. We have laws, and the laws are sufficient, if they were only enforced. Your view seems to be more emotion rather than calculation. Don't get me wrong, emotion should be part of the calculus, but it shouldn't be the sole determinant. We have millions of people who were lured here to provide cheap labor. Unfortunately, along with the hard workers came the criminals. I'm suspicious of amnesty because the last amnesty was such a sham. If I had my say, we would close the border first. Make it so Mexicans have to go through the same process as Indians, or Vietnamese, or Italians, or anyone else to enter the country. Put in place a real, verifiable work visa program. Those that have made a life here, give them the option to become American, or go home. Those that are criminal in their behavior, deport them. If they are to be deported, they can take their family, or leave them here, doesn't matter, but we don't need more criminals. That's how I would do it.

The urban blacks need someone to work so they can stay on welfare, may as well be Mexicans. It's going to be interesting when Mexicans become the dominant culture in the United States, and they will, because Mexicans won't have "white guilt". Urban blacks are going to get a real wake up when Mexicans are in charge.



I'm curious, just exactly how does one "close the border?"  I keep hearing that phrase over and over again, but I've never heard anyone actually explain in real terms how that would be accomplished and, more to the point, what the cost would be.

Offline happyg

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« Reply #21 on: January 08, 2014, 12:01:54 PM »
Quote
Ohio Secretary of State Jon Husted announced Wednesday that his office found 17 non-citizens illegally cast ballots in the 2012 presidential election -- and has referred the case for possible prosecution.

Those are the kinds of people Christie adores. They are nothing more than politics to him.

Offline Relic

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« Reply #22 on: January 08, 2014, 12:12:48 PM »
I'm curious, just exactly how does one "close the border?"  I keep hearing that phrase over and over again, but I've never heard anyone actually explain in real terms how that would be accomplished and, more to the point, what the cost would be.

I find it interesting that borders are closed throughout the world without difficulty. But when someone mentions closing the US - Mexico border, suddenly it's a herculean task.

Closing the border kind of looks like this:
A fence where practical.
Electronic monitoring.
A border patrol that is empowered. Meaning, if someone is caught illegally crossing, there is a mechanism for deportation. If there is a repeat offender, let them spend time in a US jail. If there is violent resistance, violent response is authorized.

Seriously, with all the money we waste on all manner of things, do you really think this is cost prohibitive? Don't you think lessening the burden on our societal systems, and law enforcement would offset the cost.

It seriously irritates me when people act like securing the border is more complex than curing cancer. Go try to sneak into Mexico via their southern border or try to sneak into Russia. Let me know how that works? Heck, even Iran can find Americans snooping around their borders and arrest them!

Offline EC

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« Reply #23 on: January 08, 2014, 12:24:40 PM »
I'm curious, just exactly how does one "close the border?"  I keep hearing that phrase over and over again, but I've never heard anyone actually explain in real terms how that would be accomplished and, more to the point, what the cost would be.

You don't because you can't.

Look, we're an island. Only ways into or out of the country is by air, boat or one railway tunnel. I suppose, technically, you can swim the Channel. It's only 18 miles and the busiest shipping lane you can imagine. We can't keep illegals out, despite strict airport controls, heat sensitive detectors for lorries coming in, a very tough and efficient coastguard and other barriers to entry.
So how is the USA going to prevent people coming in over dry land or a shallow river?

A fence? Costs a ton per mile, it's kind of hard to build a fence in the middle of a river and Mexico has these strange and esoteric bits of technology known as wire cutters, ladders and shovels.

Drones? They still need pilots, maintenance, fueling, someone to interpret what they see. Poor weather grounds them, sometimes forcibly.

Sensors? The second time a border patrol unit or Sherrif's deputy gets dispatched to chase a coyote, they'll start to ignore the sensors.

Local residents? While people have every right to defend what is theirs, granting open season on other people is not exactly what the Founding Fathers envisaged.

Boots on the ground? Sure, it's doable. Expensive as hell, and people will still get through.
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Offline mountaineer

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« Reply #24 on: January 08, 2014, 01:26:30 PM »
I'm so inspired by law breakers, too.   :whistle:
A day without sunshine is like, you know, night.


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