Author Topic: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot  (Read 1236 times)

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Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« on: November 17, 2013, 05:10:10 PM »
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/2013/11/eyewitness-captures-polaroid-of-moment-jfk-was-shot.html

JFK -- NOVEMBER 16, 2013 AT 1:21 PM ET
Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
BY: ELISABETH PONSOT
 
"I saw a man killed right in front of my eyes."

׮


Nearly 50 years after the assassination of President John F. Kennedy, we hear from Mary Ann Moorman, an eyewitness to the infamous scene at Dealey Plaza, who shared her story with documentary filmmaker Alan Govenar.

Govenar's film is currently on display at an exhibit at the International Center of Photography in New York City.

The exhibit showcases dozens of photographs, many taken by ordinary people who -- like Moorman -- were witness to extraordinary moments of the assassination and its aftermath.


Unidentified Photographer, ca. 1963. International Center of Photography, Museum Purchase, 2013. View more photographs from the exhibit.

Brian Wallis, chief curator, pored over thousands of photographs for the exhibit.

"One of the things that struck me and has always struck me about the Kennedy assassination was that it was like a national wound that everyone felt and carried with them through their life," he said.

"To me, photography was a way to manage that grief and that trauma -- a way to try to get a handle on what really happened."


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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2013, 06:56:51 PM »
The cable network REELZ aired a documentary a few weeks ago about the theory that the fatal shot came from the AR-15 held by a USSS agent. One of the photos taken that day does show an agent  in the car behind JFK standing up holding such a weapon. He apparently was preparing to return fire. The theory is that he accidentally disengaged the safety, the gun (loaded with hollow point bullets) discharged and that was the projectile that tore off half of Kennedy's head

The USSS wouldn't acknowledge that any of the agents in the presidential detail carried rifles. A ballistics expert, now deceased, concluded that the "magic bullet" - fully jacketed - came from Oswald's gun but the hollow point, which exploded upon impact with the back of JFK's head, came from another weapon.

A small town newspaper in my area has posted a pdf of their Nov. 23, 1963, edition and I noticed the following from the UPI story: "Pandemonium seized the crowd. Secret Service men unlimbered automatic rifles and pistols but no more shots were fired. City police went charging up a grassy knoll ..."

Of course, the theory - like just about every other one - has its detractors, but I guess we'll never tire of speculating about this assassination.
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Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2013, 10:26:24 PM »


Of course, the theory - like just about every other one - has its detractors, but I guess we'll never tire of speculating about this assassination.


Larry Sabato ( just completed exhaustive research with his law class and wrote a book about his death) actually spoke about this on Fox earlier today, he said one reason the speculation never stops is the government did keep things hidden from us  - he said to this day the CIA still holds a lot of secrets re the assassination.
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Offline sinkspur

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2013, 10:38:54 PM »
The only actual EVIDENCE points to one man and only one man:  Lee Harvey Oswald.

All the conspiracy theories seem to have a book or other financial motive behind them.
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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2013, 11:47:50 PM »
The only actual EVIDENCE points to one man and only one man:  Lee Harvey Oswald.

Only because people like you choose to ignore evidence to the contrary!

Explain to me how one projectile goes through Kennedy, then Conally smashing three ribs and his wrist, and remains intact having lost only three grains from it's original weight  while the second round, supposedly fired from the same junk weapon only a couple of seconds later and from the same lot of ammunition, hits the Kennedy's head and explodes leaving his brain filled with bullet fragments.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2013, 11:50:44 PM by Bigun »

Offline Lando Lincoln

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2013, 12:06:27 AM »
The only actual EVIDENCE points to one man and only one man:  Lee Harvey Oswald.

All the conspiracy theories seem to have a book or other financial motive behind them.

It is amazing sink, that people like you and me who accept that LHO was the lone gunman are treated like kooks.
For the progressive, there is very little to love about the United States. Washington, Jefferson, Madison? A bunch of rotten slaveholders, hypocrites, and cowards even when their hearts were in the right places. The Declaration of Independence? A manifesto for the propertied classes. The Constitution? An artifact of sexism and white supremacy. The sacrifices in the great wars of the 20th century? Feeding the poor and the disenfranchised into the meat-grinder of imperialism. The gifts of Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Morgan, Astor? Blood money from self-aggrandizing robber barons. Nat Rev

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2013, 08:39:20 AM »
It is amazing sink, that people like you and me who accept that LHO was the lone gunman are treated like kooks.

I'm not treating anyone like a kook! I'm just asking for someone to explain the actual physical evidence!

Offline Lando Lincoln

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2013, 12:29:57 PM »
I'm not treating anyone like a kook! I'm just asking for someone to explain the actual physical evidence!


It may not be you, but it is always someone.  The defenders of the evidence are always left to factually chase details while others just say... well yeah, but what about this...?  ... Oh really, well then... explain that... And then there is the "firsthand" knowledge of being half-way around the world several years after the event drinking adult beverages to dispute.  Tedious.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 01:24:57 PM by Lando Lincoln »
For the progressive, there is very little to love about the United States. Washington, Jefferson, Madison? A bunch of rotten slaveholders, hypocrites, and cowards even when their hearts were in the right places. The Declaration of Independence? A manifesto for the propertied classes. The Constitution? An artifact of sexism and white supremacy. The sacrifices in the great wars of the 20th century? Feeding the poor and the disenfranchised into the meat-grinder of imperialism. The gifts of Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Morgan, Astor? Blood money from self-aggrandizing robber barons. Nat Rev

Offline aligncare

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2013, 12:43:49 PM »
LHO was the lone gunman who shot and killed JFK. Physical and circumstantial evidence point to Oswald. Time we give it a rest – am tired of the conspiracies.
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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2013, 02:02:25 PM »
It may not be you, but it is always someone.  The defenders of the evidence are always left to factually chase details while others just say... well yeah, but what about this...?  ... Oh really, well then... explain that... And then there is the "firsthand" knowledge of being half-way around the world several years after the event drinking adult beverages to dispute.  Tedious.




What is tedious is diverting the conversation away from the simple question asked!

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2013, 02:03:21 PM »
LHO was the lone gunman who shot and killed JFK. Physical and circumstantial evidence point to Oswald. Time we give it a rest – am tired of the conspiracies.

You believe whatever you want to believe and everyone else will do the same.

Offline Lando Lincoln

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2013, 02:41:45 PM »
What is tedious is diverting the conversation away from the simple question asked!
That's a joke, right? ..."firsthand" knowledge of being half-way around the world several years after the event drinking adult beverages... is not tedious?

So...
No. No it is not.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 02:52:00 PM by Lando Lincoln »
For the progressive, there is very little to love about the United States. Washington, Jefferson, Madison? A bunch of rotten slaveholders, hypocrites, and cowards even when their hearts were in the right places. The Declaration of Independence? A manifesto for the propertied classes. The Constitution? An artifact of sexism and white supremacy. The sacrifices in the great wars of the 20th century? Feeding the poor and the disenfranchised into the meat-grinder of imperialism. The gifts of Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Morgan, Astor? Blood money from self-aggrandizing robber barons. Nat Rev

Offline Lando Lincoln

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2013, 02:42:07 PM »
You believe whatever you want to believe and everyone else will do the same.
And so it shall always be.

I believe I will move on.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 02:50:08 PM by Lando Lincoln »
For the progressive, there is very little to love about the United States. Washington, Jefferson, Madison? A bunch of rotten slaveholders, hypocrites, and cowards even when their hearts were in the right places. The Declaration of Independence? A manifesto for the propertied classes. The Constitution? An artifact of sexism and white supremacy. The sacrifices in the great wars of the 20th century? Feeding the poor and the disenfranchised into the meat-grinder of imperialism. The gifts of Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Morgan, Astor? Blood money from self-aggrandizing robber barons. Nat Rev

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #13 on: November 23, 2013, 03:00:20 PM »
And so it shall always be.

I believe I will move on.

I note that the question I asked remains unanswered.

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #14 on: November 23, 2013, 03:22:01 PM »
I note that the question I asked remains unanswered.

Even the experts I watched for an hour last night trying to figure this out cannot determine why one bullet exploded in to a million fragments and the other is virtually unscathed.  Nor can any of the professional coroners figure out why the brain is missing.  They "presume" it was taken by the SS and given to RFK - perhaps to hide the fact he suffered from Addisons Disease - which was a much more serious disease in those days than it is today with advancement in modern medicine. 

They did point out the investigation was very shoddy by today's standards... they said today the entire scene would have been immediately locked down and no one allowed in or out - and a CSI-like investigation would have been performed, nothing like that took place in 1963 so a lot of evidence was not gathered and everyone at Parkland Hospital pretty much did what the SS told them to do so evidence was lost there, too...
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Offline Cincinnatus

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #15 on: November 23, 2013, 03:36:13 PM »
Even the experts I watched for an hour last night trying to figure this out cannot determine why one bullet exploded in to a million fragments and the other is virtually unscathed. As a hollow point would do.

the brain is missing.  They "presume" it was taken by the SS and given to RFK - perhaps to hide the fact he suffered from Addisons Disease And his meth use.

Sorry, Rapunzel, I know you liked the guy but it's a fact he was a heavy user of methamphetamines.
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Offline Lando Lincoln

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #16 on: November 23, 2013, 03:39:06 PM »
I note that the question I asked remains unanswered.

Yep. Tedious.
For the progressive, there is very little to love about the United States. Washington, Jefferson, Madison? A bunch of rotten slaveholders, hypocrites, and cowards even when their hearts were in the right places. The Declaration of Independence? A manifesto for the propertied classes. The Constitution? An artifact of sexism and white supremacy. The sacrifices in the great wars of the 20th century? Feeding the poor and the disenfranchised into the meat-grinder of imperialism. The gifts of Carnegie, Rockefeller, Vanderbilt, Morgan, Astor? Blood money from self-aggrandizing robber barons. Nat Rev

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #17 on: November 23, 2013, 03:39:58 PM »
Quote
Even the experts I watched for an hour last night trying to figure this out cannot determine why one bullet exploded in to a million fragments and the other is virtually unscathed.

Did they consider the possibility that they were not, in fact, fired from the same weapon and not similar in metallurgy or ballistic characteristics?

And there is a distinct possibility that the reason the brain went missing was that someone realized that the metal fragments therein (clearly visible on X rays and testified to by the autopsy doctors)  could have been recovered and subjected to metallurgical analysis.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2013, 03:42:00 PM by Bigun »

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #18 on: November 23, 2013, 03:40:27 PM »
Even the experts I watched for an hour last night trying to figure this out cannot determine why one bullet exploded in to a million fragments and the other is virtually unscathed. As a hollow point would do.

the brain is missing.  They "presume" it was taken by the SS and given to RFK - perhaps to hide the fact he suffered from Addisons Disease And his meth use.

Sorry, Rapunzel, I know you liked the guy but it's a fact he was a heavy user of methamphetamines.

I look at thing in the terms of 1963 not 2013.  In 1963 everyone thought it was perfectly fine for a woman to smoke and drink while pregnant and people took methamphetamines for weight loss and found the energy boost was a nice side-effect... only later did they figure out how bad it was to do these things.
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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #19 on: November 23, 2013, 03:59:42 PM »
He also had an incredibly bad back that had him in constant pain, so he was prescribed pain killers to deal with that for any time he needed to stand for more than 20 minutes.

Did he get hooked? Almost certainly.
His fault? Definitely not.

As far as the bullets go - I am no expert, yet I have seen fully jacketed rounds explode into shrapnel on contact with target. All it takes is one tiny air cavity during manufacturing. You usually find it with cheaper rounds.
Or, of course, LHO could have spent 5 minutes with a nail file. A few scrapes and you have a dum dum round.
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Offline Cincinnatus

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2013, 04:07:50 PM »
I look at thing in the terms of 1963 not 2013...only later did they figure out how bad it was to do these things.

The potential dangers with methamphetamine were well known by the time Kennedy started using it. Meth impairs judgement, leads to grandiose feelings of euphoria (which then crash into depression), causes wild mood swings, and in Kennedy's case contributed to his
satyriasis. All of those are wonderful qualities to have in a President, aren't they? 

The stuff may have been legal in the 60s but its adverse effects became such an object of concern it was made illegal less than a decade after Kennedy's death.
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Offline olde north church

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2013, 04:13:23 PM »
Even the experts I watched for an hour last night trying to figure this out cannot determine why one bullet exploded in to a million fragments and the other is virtually unscathed. As a hollow point would do.

the brain is missing.  They "presume" it was taken by the SS and given to RFK - perhaps to hide the fact he suffered from Addisons Disease And his meth use.

Sorry, Rapunzel, I know you liked the guy but it's a fact he was a heavy user of methamphetamines.

Wouldn't Addison's show in above the kidneys as well?  Adrenals
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Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #22 on: November 23, 2013, 05:18:59 PM »
Wouldn't Addison's show in above the kidneys as well?  Adrenals


Yes, both Addisions and Cushings involve the Adrenal glands.  The Adrenals sit above the kidneys.  It is actually much easier to manage Cushings than Addisions, but the treatment is such that you walk a fine line between managing and turning the person (or animal - I have a dog with Cushings) into being Addison instead.  Addisions is much more difficult to manage and more debilitating. 
“The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.” G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #23 on: November 23, 2013, 05:25:16 PM »
I look at thing in the terms of 1963 not 2013...only later did they figure out how bad it was to do these things.

The potential dangers with methamphetamine were well known by the time Kennedy started using it. Meth impairs judgement, leads to grandiose feelings of euphoria (which then crash into depression), causes wild mood swings, and in Kennedy's case contributed to his
satyriasis. All of those are wonderful qualities to have in a President, aren't they? 

The stuff may have been legal in the 60s but its adverse effects became such an object of concern it was made illegal less than a decade after Kennedy's death.

From everything I've read it is why the "cocktail" doctor feelgood administered to him contained other drugs in addition to the methamphetamines.  Remember Jackie ended up on them for a while until JFK found out and told the doctor to cease and desist giving her the injections.  She took them for energy.  I knew people who took amphetamines by prescription for weight loss back in those days.. wasn't anything I needed as I was always thin and had plenty of energy without drugs - plus I have been anti-drugs, tobacco and alcohol my entire life... but I have known plenty of people who have done it all...

Anyway, I judge Kennedy by what i knew at the time not what was revealed over the last 50 years... I don't think we've ever had a president who was perfect.....  even Reagan who I loved was not a perfect man and likely was suffering from the Alzheimers toward the end of his second term.
“The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.” G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline happyg

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Re: Eyewitness captures Polaroid of moment JFK was shot
« Reply #24 on: November 23, 2013, 06:38:21 PM »
What do you guys think of these videos?

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glPyZAj_wqc&amp;feature=player_embedded" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glPyZAj_wqc&amp;feature=player_embedded</a>


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