Author Topic: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'  (Read 1271 times)

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SPQR

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North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« on: November 04, 2013, 04:14:53 PM »
 South Korea's spy agency said Monday that North Korea was using Russian technology to develop electromagnetic pulse weapons aimed at paralysing military electronic equipment south of the border.

The National Intelligence Service (NIS) said in a report to parliament that the North had purchased Russian electromagnetic pulse (EMP) weaponry to develop its own versions.

EMP weapons are used to damage to electronic equipment. At higher energy levels, an EMP event can cause more widespread damage including to aircraft structures and other objects.

The spy agency also said the North's leader Kim Jong-Un sees cyberattacks as an all-purpose weapon along with nuclear weapons and missiles, according to lawmakers briefed by the NIS.

The North is trying to hack into smartphones and lure South Koreans into becoming informants, it said.

It has collected information on where South Korea stores chemical substances and oil reserves as well as details about subways, tunnels and train networks in major cities, it said.

The spy agency also said North Korean spies were operating in China and Japan to distribute pro-Pyongyang propaganda.

North Korea is believed to run an elite cyber warfare unit of 3,000 personnel.

A South Korean lawmaker, citing government data, said last month that the North had staged thousands of cyberattacks against the South in recent years, causing financial losses of around $805 million.

In addition to military institutions, the North's recent high-profile cyberattacks have targeted commercial banks, government agencies, TV broadcasters and media websites.

North Korea has denied any involvement in cyberattacks and accused Seoul of fabricating them to fan cross-border tension.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jAAZpqNPp5Zuf36cavG_ja_X0nZQ?docId=2b830034-5010-4248-9ebe-349be12346df

Offline Oceander

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #1 on: November 04, 2013, 08:14:45 PM »
We shall see.

Offline Atomic Cow

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #2 on: November 04, 2013, 08:18:08 PM »
Geez, not this again.

This same crap has been around for the last 10+ years.  First it was North Korea, then Iran, and now back to North Korea.

They're always written by people who don't have a clue about how nuclear weapons work and what it would take to generate an EMP which could actually cripple the United States.
"...And these atomic bombs which science burst upon the world that night were strange, even to the men who used them."  H. G. Wells, The World Set Free, 1914

"The one pervading evil of democracy is the tyranny of the majority, or rather of that party, not always the majority, that succeeds, by force or fraud, in carrying elections." -Lord Acton

Offline Chieftain

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #3 on: November 04, 2013, 08:25:11 PM »
Sounds like great agitprop to me.

A good EMP weapon is not difficult to build.  Most nuclear devices produce an electromagnetic pulse.  The problem is putting the weapon in a position where the pulse can do maximum damage over the target, from what I have read on the subject, that means detonating the device between 200 and 300 miles in altitude.  At that height the EMP produces what is known as the "Compton Effect" where gamma radiation interacts with air molecules to essentially redirect the pulse and fire it straight down.

The Norks have not yet demonstrated the ability to do anything like that.  Hell, I'm going to work on building a nuclear fission reactor in my garage...and I have just as much ability to do it as the Norks do.


Offline Oceander

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #4 on: November 04, 2013, 08:30:13 PM »
Sounds like great agitprop to me.

A good EMP weapon is not difficult to build.  Most nuclear devices produce an electromagnetic pulse.  The problem is putting the weapon in a position where the pulse can do maximum damage over the target, from what I have read on the subject, that means detonating the device between 200 and 300 miles in altitude.  At that height the EMP produces what is known as the "Compton Effect" where gamma radiation interacts with air molecules to essentially redirect the pulse and fire it straight down.

The Norks have not yet demonstrated the ability to do anything like that.  Hell, I'm going to work on building a nuclear fission reactor in my garage...and I have just as much ability to do it as the Norks do.



EMPs can be produced using non-nuclear means as well.  They're just not the WMD the Norks apparently want to pretend they are.

Offline Chieftain

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #5 on: November 04, 2013, 08:33:18 PM »
EMPs can be produced using non-nuclear means as well.  They're just not the WMD the Norks apparently want to pretend they are.

Yes they can.  You still need to get the thing high enough in the air to do anything with it, and the Norks still don't have anywhere near a reliable launch vehicle.


Offline Atomic Cow

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2013, 08:37:01 PM »
The only thing capable of generating a large EMP, that is deliverable via strategic missile, is a high yield nuke.

Only the US, Russia, China, the UK, France, and Israel have this ability and no one is sure how large Israel's biggest bomb actually is.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 08:37:22 PM by Atomic Cow »
"...And these atomic bombs which science burst upon the world that night were strange, even to the men who used them."  H. G. Wells, The World Set Free, 1914

"The one pervading evil of democracy is the tyranny of the majority, or rather of that party, not always the majority, that succeeds, by force or fraud, in carrying elections." -Lord Acton

Offline Oceander

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2013, 08:47:58 PM »
Yes they can.  You still need to get the thing high enough in the air to do anything with it, and the Norks still don't have anywhere near a reliable launch vehicle.



The only thing capable of generating a large EMP, that is deliverable via strategic missile, is a high yield nuke.

Only the US, Russia, China, the UK, France, and Israel have this ability and no one is sure how large Israel's biggest bomb actually is.


Yup, and yup.  As I said, they're not the WMDs the Norks would like to pretend they are.

SPQR

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2013, 08:50:51 PM »
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 09:01:14 PM by SPQR »

SPQR

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2013, 09:17:13 PM »
EMPs can be produced using non-nuclear means as well. 

'How-to' for EMP weapon stunningly accessible


Here are the instructions on How to Build a EMP Gun

http://www.amazing1.com/products/electromagnetic-emp-pulse-gun-gen-ii-downloadable-instructions.html
http://www.amazing1.com/products/electromagnetic-emp-pulse-gun-gen-ii-paper-instructions.html

Just to download the entire blueprints cost about $20 dollars. Fully assembled about $34,000. I just cannot believe that this stuff is on the Internet
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 09:18:52 PM by SPQR »

Offline Atomic Cow

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2013, 09:22:22 PM »
All credibility goes out when World Nut Daily is cited.

They've been predicted we'd be nuked every year since 2002 and it hasn't happened yet.
"...And these atomic bombs which science burst upon the world that night were strange, even to the men who used them."  H. G. Wells, The World Set Free, 1914

"The one pervading evil of democracy is the tyranny of the majority, or rather of that party, not always the majority, that succeeds, by force or fraud, in carrying elections." -Lord Acton

SPQR

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2013, 09:23:17 PM »
All credibility goes out when World Nut Daily is cited.

They've been predicted we'd be nuked every year since 2002 and it hasn't happened yet.

That is why I attached the products to the story the to prove the  World Net Daily story is factual.The attachments prove that it can be built by anyone with technical abilitaies and there are companies sell those bueprints. They even sell the complete EMP Gun Weapon for $34,000 assembled. Its just a matter of time a rogue nation or a terrorist group uses one of these weapons.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 09:32:32 PM by SPQR »

Offline AbaraXas

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2013, 09:32:00 PM »
That is why I attached the products to the story the  World Net Daily story is a factual.The attachments prove that it can be built buy anyone and there are companies sell those bueprints. They even sell the complete EMP Gun Weapon for $34,000 assembled.

Until I see it in action, I am going to have to take it with a grain of salt. The amount of power needed seems far larger than those blueprints seem to indicate. Browsing that site, they seem to deal with the kind of plans you would find for sale in the back of comic books. X-Ray glasses, anti-gravity devices, etc.

The thing is, NK wants us to believe they are capable of making such a device so I wouldn't be surprised if they float a story.  WND is bad about picking up any rumor without fact-checking, they just run with whatever. Their successful hit count is rather low. Like most internet sources, don't take anything at face value.

SPQR

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2013, 09:34:16 PM »
Until I see it in action, I am going to have to take it with a grain of salt. The amount of power needed seems far larger than those blueprints seem to indicate. Browsing that site, they seem to deal with the kind of plans you would find for sale in the back of comic books. X-Ray glasses, anti-gravity devices, etc.

The thing is, NK wants us to believe they are capable of making such a device so I wouldn't be surprised if they float a story.  WND is bad about picking up any rumor without fact-checking, they just run with whatever. Their successful hit count is rather low. Like most internet sources, don't take anything at face value.

Well, I believe it.  The company who is selling the$34,000 assembled product would  be selling the product if the product was field tested . I think it passed the field testing stage.  The company selling the product(information Unlimited) was founded in 1974 by Robert Iannini, whose work has paved the way in making high voltage accessible to everyone, our highly creative company holds many patents which have contributed to the electronics and high voltage fields, from bug zappers to stun guns, plasma drivers to power supplies, and many other HV devices.So it seems that they are well established.  So its not a fly by night company that spouted in the last couple years. According to Wired Magazine, Robert Iannini has been called the man behind the worlds most dangerous mail order kits.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/01/information_unlimited/
« Last Edit: November 04, 2013, 10:20:17 PM by SPQR »

Offline Oceander

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2013, 11:19:49 PM »
Just to toss some fuel on the fire, the paper by Lt. Col. Brunderman can be downloaded from the defense community website here: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf&AD=ADA393362

I'm of two minds on matters such as this - granting for the sake of discussion here that a suitable EMP device could actually be built along these lines - the information provides us with a two-edged sword:  yes, terrorists could use, or attempt to use, these sorts of weapons, but these sorts of weapons might also be incredibly valuable to a band of freedom fighters rebelling against an oppressive, technologically unmatched, government that is determined to squash them like bugs.

As but one example:  drones aren't just for foreign wars any more.  they will be making an appearance in domestic surveillance/spying and so-called "law enforcement," and democrat-run governments will inevitably turn them against their political opponents.  if/when a future democrat-party government starts using drones to track politically active conservatives, for example, a small, useable, emp may become a necessary tool of self-defense.

SPQR

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Re: North Korea developing 'electromagnetic pulse weapons'
« Reply #15 on: November 05, 2013, 12:24:06 AM »
Just to toss some fuel on the fire, the paper by Lt. Col. Brunderman can be downloaded from the defense community website here: http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf&AD=ADA393362

I'm of two minds on matters such as this - granting for the sake of discussion here that a suitable EMP device could actually be built along these lines - the information provides us with a two-edged sword:  yes, terrorists could use, or attempt to use, these sorts of weapons, but these sorts of weapons might also be incredibly valuable to a band of freedom fighters rebelling against an oppressive, technologically unmatched, government that is determined to squash them like bugs.

As but one example:  drones aren't just for foreign wars any more.  they will be making an appearance in domestic surveillance/spying and so-called "law enforcement," and democrat-run governments will inevitably turn them against their political opponents.  if/when a future democrat-party government starts using drones to track politically active conservatives, for example, a small, useable, emp may become a necessary tool of self-defense.


Thanks for mentioning that article. The days of detonating an A-Bomb in the atmosphere to produce an EMP effect to disrupt communications on a massive scale is over except when a country attacking another country. The technology to produce the same effect but on a smaller and focused area is reality. This is a massive problem because terrorist groups could cause massive damage with a mobile "EMP Gun". They can go from regional electrical grid to regional electrical grid and no one will know. Just imagine the panic if one of these things are used. You are also right that in could be a tool we can use.You can probably build one from parts at your local Radio Shack.

 :beer:
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 12:40:30 AM by SPQR »


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