Author Topic: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight  (Read 2129 times)

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Offline happyg

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Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« on: October 16, 2013, 12:08:52 PM »

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2013, 12:11:00 PM »
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The stakes are too high not to draw the line today. We can't continue to kick the can down the road forever. God bless Sen. Cruz and his fellow line drawers.

Hear, hear!

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Offline sinkspur

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2013, 12:15:44 PM »
No fight?  Boehner got the sequester enacted, the only time in modern history that government spending has actually been CUT!!

Limbaugh thinks that, somehow, the GOP was going to get Obama to agree to defund or delay his prime achievement.

If, instead, there had been no shutdown, the disaster that is Obamacare would be front and center and we could be capitalizing on it with ads and hearings and a "countdown clock" and all kinds of things pointing out its failures.

You lost, David.  Now, help the Republicans regain some respect after your boy Teddy's slash-and-burn tactics failed.
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2013, 12:16:01 PM »
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The Cruz-ers aren't guaranteeing short-term victory, but by fighting fiercely and drawing attention to Obama's excesses and recklessness, they are increasing their chances to stop him eventually.

 :amen:  :amen: and  :amen:!

This is the entire argument in a nutshell! Well done David Limbaugh!

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2013, 12:19:16 PM »
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You lost, David.  Now, help the Republicans regain some respect after your boy Teddy's slash-and-burn tactics failed.

That's an odd statement by a *fellow republican*.......you need to turn on Rush, he is talking about all the liberal/moderate republicans like yourself.

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Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2013, 12:26:20 PM »
Government spending has NOT been cut even under the sequester!

All that has happened is that the rate of increase has been very slightly diminished!

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2013, 12:34:03 PM »
That's an odd statement by a *fellow republican*.......you need to turn on Rush, he is talking about all the liberal/moderate republicans like yourself.

Oh, so now I'm a "moderate" or even a "liberal" because I opposed Teddy's tactics?

Listen here.  Cruz led this party down a rat hole with his insistence on leading the House off the defunding cliff.  It's just as much my party as his, and I am not going to support somebody who has no chance of success.  He had no chance of prevailing on defunding or even delaying Obamacare, and he knew it.

Rush was just as wrong as Cruz about this shutdown. 

Did it work?

What did the GOP get out of shutting down the government? 

I can tell you what Teddy got:  $250K in donations the last two weeks.

Which, after all, is what this was about in the first place.

Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2013, 12:36:42 PM »
Government spending has NOT been cut even under the sequester!

All that has happened is that the rate of increase has been very slightly diminished!

No.  It's an actual cut:

http://www.factcheck.org/2013/03/underselling-the-sequester-cuts/
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Offline Scottftlc

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2013, 12:45:56 PM »

If, instead, there had been no shutdown, the disaster that is Obamacare would be front and center and we could be capitalizing on it with ads and hearings and a "countdown clock" and all kinds of things pointing out its failures.


Obamacare will not be harmed in the slightest by computer "glitches", failed systems or even many people seeing increased premiums.  It was not enacted as a technocrats solution to something...it was enacted as an overall governing philosophy.  That philosophy will not be harmed by technocratic failures, those failures will simply result in "perfecting solutions" and fixes.  The philosophy of univeral healthcare "coverage" will stand unharmed and unshaken by any campaign, or any cute little marketing gimics - we will just be pointing fingers while others take the mantle of "fixers".  Good intentions will always defeat technical problems in the court of public opinion.  The fight Cruz took on might have a been loser - but the fight you are suggesting here is just as much a complete losing proposition.

The only thing being "accomplished" today is more band-aids on the stock market, keeping it together as long as possible because when it goes - and eventually enough debt and enough entitlement spending will do it in - every single pension, public and private, in the United States goes with it.
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You can't open your mind, boys, to every conceivable point of view

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Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2013, 01:00:15 PM »
I repeat!

Government spending has NOT been cut even under the sequester!

All that has happened is that the rate of increase has been very slightly diminished!

Offline sinkspur

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2013, 01:01:54 PM »
I repeat!

Government spending has NOT been cut even under the sequester!

All that has happened is that the rate of increase has been very slightly diminished!

YOU ARE WRONG!!
Roy Moore's "spiritual warfare" is driving past a junior high without stopping.

Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2013, 01:04:59 PM »
Apparently there is someone posting here that cannot even read and properly interpret the evidence HE posts as evidence for his arguments nor does he have even the most remote idea as to how baseline budgeting works!

Offline andy58-in-nh

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2013, 01:12:16 PM »
No.  It's an actual cut:

http://www.factcheck.org/2013/03/underselling-the-sequester-cuts/

Not exactly. FactCheck is usually pretty fair, but what they did in this analysis was utilize Washington's favored budgeting assumptions (non-GAAP analysis), opting to count as "cuts" reductions in planned cuts from an inflated baseline. Federal spending will still be higher this year ($3.685T) than last year ($3.537T), and is projected to be even higher next year ($3.778T).

And the present assumptions going forward include current CBO projections for ObamaCare costs, which are laughably low. It ain't gonna be pretty...

« Last Edit: October 16, 2013, 01:13:42 PM by andy58-in-nh »
We are entering revolutionary times. The law is no longer equally applied. The media are the ministry of truth. The Democratic party is a revolutionary force. And it is all getting scary. -VDH

Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2013, 01:17:44 PM »
Federal spending will still be higher this year ($3.685T) than last year ($3.537T), and is projected to be even higher next year ($3.778T).

Thank you! Exactly right!

Offline andy58-in-nh

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2013, 01:23:33 PM »
Thank you! Exactly right!

Those of us who are experienced in private sector financial analysis and budgeting (in my case, that's 20+ years worth) can only shake our heads and roll our eyes at what passes for such analysis at the Federal level. 
We are entering revolutionary times. The law is no longer equally applied. The media are the ministry of truth. The Democratic party is a revolutionary force. And it is all getting scary. -VDH

Online Bigun

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2013, 01:28:37 PM »
Those of us who are experienced in private sector financial analysis and budgeting (in my case, that's 20+ years worth) can only shake our heads and roll our eyes at what passes for such analysis at the Federal level.

Ain't that the truth!

But it REALLY boils down to the very simple fact that (as you correctly pointed out) the government will STILL, even with the sequester in place, spend more this year than last and even more than that next year!
« Last Edit: October 16, 2013, 01:30:18 PM by Bigun »

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2013, 04:45:03 PM »
YOU ARE WRONG!!

Good God Sink go back to selling software, clearly accounting and finance is not your strong suit.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2013, 04:45:19 PM by Rapunzel »

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2013, 04:46:10 PM »
Those of us who are experienced in private sector financial analysis and budgeting (in my case, that's 20+ years worth) can only shake our heads and roll our eyes at what passes for such analysis at the Federal level.

You're right.  28 years on my end....

Online mountaineer

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2013, 04:49:05 PM »
Oh, I get it. Calling someone named Ted "Teddy" is supposed to put him in his place.
Another intellectual triumph!
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Offline evadR

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2013, 04:57:06 PM »
No.  It's an actual cut:

http://www.factcheck.org/2013/03/underselling-the-sequester-cuts/

Just a total fallacy.
The federal budget has NOT been cut by the Obama administration...EVER!
It hasn't been cut in the past, it isn't cut now and there are no plans to cut it in the future.
November 6, 2012, a day in infamy...the death of a republic as we know it.

Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2013, 05:02:31 PM »
Government spending has NOT been cut even under the sequester!

All that has happened is that the rate of increase has been very slightly diminished!

Not after today!!! :nono:
"Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim tribute to patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness -- these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. . . . reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principles."
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Online truth_seeker

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #21 on: October 16, 2013, 05:06:36 PM »
"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #22 on: October 16, 2013, 05:06:54 PM »
Apparently there is someone posting here that cannot even read and properly interpret the evidence HE posts as evidence for his arguments nor does he have even the most remote idea as to how baseline budgeting works!

The truth is liberals never bother with such things as facts.  Though a big liberal in his day, Daniel Patrick Moynahan, said "you are entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts."
"Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim tribute to patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness -- these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. . . . reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principles."
George Washington

"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become more corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters."
Benjamin Franklin

Offline rangerrebew

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #23 on: October 16, 2013, 05:09:35 PM »
Give Cruz a while longer in office, and I predict his sheen wears off, too.

Given enough time in office, the other politicians in the District of Corruption will put a hit on him and share the cost. :2gunz:
"Of all the dispositions and habits which lead to political prosperity, religion and morality are indispensable supports. In vain would that man claim tribute to patriotism who should labor to subvert these great pillars of human happiness -- these firmest props of the duties of men and citizens. . . . reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principles."
George Washington

"Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become more corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters."
Benjamin Franklin

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: Mainstream Republicans Show No Fight
« Reply #24 on: October 16, 2013, 05:09:40 PM »

Like it or not, a pragmatic person would listen to Rove about winning elections, not Limbaugh, Levin or Beck.
 

The Rove that got his ass kicked in 2008 and 2010 and 2012.  I don't think so.


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