Author Topic: I'd like your input on an article I found.  (Read 2749 times)

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Liberal_Spy

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I'd like your input on an article I found.
« on: October 14, 2013, 11:25:05 AM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mansur-gidfar/this-is-the-supreme-court_b_4086269.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

Again I'm not going to take a stance here. Pick apart the article and tell me your opinions.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2013, 11:46:31 AM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mansur-gidfar/this-is-the-supreme-court_b_4086269.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

Again I'm not going to take a stance here. Pick apart the article and tell me your opinions.


Why are you so interested in our opinions?....are you writing a thesis or are you a writer for some lib publication?....be honest!

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Offline GourmetDan

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2013, 11:47:50 AM »
Why are you so interested in our opinions?....are you writing a thesis or are you a writer for some lib publication?....be honest!

I think the time for 'being honest' has long passed...


"The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left." - Ecclesiastes 10:2

"April Fools Day is the one day of the year that people critically evaluate news articles before accepting them as true." - Unknown

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2013, 11:53:17 AM »
Why are you so interested in our opinions?....are you writing a thesis or are you a writer for some lib publication?....be honest!

I'm interested in your opinions because finding common ground between left and right is (in my opinion) the only way to stop the government from completely destroying our freedoms. I think the horrible, giant schism between the left and right is intentional and perpetuated by the government to keep people more worried about screaming at each other than focusing on the real problem. I like to post things and put ideas out there for you guys to comment on, and then I can go through the posts and connect all the dots in the places we agree and have common ground. I thought my non-hostile presence might make some conservatives realize I and people like me are really not that bad.

Offline Olivia

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2013, 12:00:32 PM »
I had to almost read the entire article before it became obvious the writer is targeting conservative donors.
No mention of George Soros, the Saudis or any of the other "outside" millions that flow into our democrat's coffers.
I suppose these donors must be powerful, though.  Pulling the strings of Ted Cruz to shut down the government would have been no easy feat.  :silly:

Just another conservative bashing article from some over imaginative author as far as I'm concerned.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2013, 12:01:26 PM by Olivia »
Truthfully, the most important thing in life is knowing what the most important things in life are, and prioritizing them accordingly.   Melchor Lim

Offline AbaraXas

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2013, 12:01:52 PM »
Blatantly wrong on its surface, historically, and on principle. (I'll go through all when I have time). This one thing though, really jumps out to me. The author complains:

Quote
Elected officials increasingly feel accountable to a vanishingly small percentage of the population....

What he doesn't get is this is exactly how a representative democracy (ie Republic) is supposed to work. Representatives are supposed to represent their constituents who elected them, not a political party.  That has been one of the problems up until now, following the party instead of what is right.  The House of Representatives is doing its exactly defined job, both to the letter of the law as well as the spirit behind it. All bills of revenue are supposed to originate in the House with the Senate only given the power to offer amendments and vote on it.

The reasoning for this, as outlined in the Federalist Papers, is completely rational- it keeps the power of the purse strings of the government closest to the people and provides one last 'check' for actions of the government. The House is re-elected every two years, so they are most accountable to the people. If the people don't like the direction that the government is going on something, they have a two year reset button (versus 4 years for the President or 6 years for the Senate) via financing.

The President likes to throw around 'he was re-elected' but so was the House.

Another factual error in all this is that this has anything to do with the Citizen's United case. It is commonplace on both sides to blame things like this when stuff doesn't go your way, but in reality, it has the least impact on the House of whom, are elected closest to the people. It also doesn't explain that there have been 16 shutdowns prior to Citizen's United.

One other factual issue in this that is over-looked is the Senate's roadblock of almost all the bills that are coming from the House. One man, Harry Reid is taking unprecedented, unilateral action over the past few years, but especially during this shut-down and tabling almost every bill that comes from the House. The result of this is the bills never come up for a vote. There is no chance for the Senate to give their official say as to the spending bills. The House has passed over 30 compromise bills and the Senate has been allowed to vote on 2 of those. 

Not only on these spending bills, Reid has done this to every budget passed by the House in the past 7 years. He won't allow a single budget to come to vote so instead of having a budget to work from, they have to constantly pass CRs and raise the debt ceiling. 

If you want to look at where the real problem is in all this, it is Harry Reid. (even more so than President Obama). 
Never delude yourself into thinking you're "influencing" or making a difference on the internet. It is an ephemeral pleasure.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2013, 12:02:19 PM »
Being here a few days and reading threads and posts I would think you would pretty much know what our opinions would be..most of us are conservatives and are involved in *group think*....we are like lemmings who will follow our grand leader {Palin, Cruz, Lee} off the cliff..../s


...I still think you are not being honest and are up to something....and would appreciate honesty....just not buying it!!!

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Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2013, 12:03:47 PM »
I had to almost read the entire article before it became obvious the writer is targeting conservative donors.
No mention of George Soros, the Saudis or any of the other "outside" millions that flow into our democrat's coffers.


I agree with what you are saying here. I personally think none of our politicians should be influenced by millionaires and rich special interests. They are there to serve the interests of the people that voted for them to be there. I think people running for office should have an equal chance to exposure, and shouldn't have to rely on multi-million dollar smear campaigns designed to manipulate voters. If you are honest, and your message is good, you shouldn't need to do things like that.

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2013, 12:07:09 PM »
...I still think you are not being honest and are up to something....and would appreciate honesty....just not buying it!!!

I really don't know what to say. There is no ulterior motive to me posting here other than trying to spark conversation. What do you believe my motives are/might be/could be?

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2013, 12:09:47 PM »
I have friends who are Obama supporters, but we just don't discus politics anymore.  There  is a huge schism between left and right,  So far you've been more. polite than some who claim to be Republicans, what I've seen so far is you've been taught to look at surface reasons for why we're in a mess instead of looking to what has caused it.    I think you could learn here, but you have to be willing to learn and grow intellectually.  Liberals think of themselves as being intellectually superior to conservatives, but that's another fallacy perpetuated by the media.  Speaking of media do you approve... as a  vet.. and a citizen .. of how they ignored what really took place in DC yesterday?
“The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.” G Washington July 2, 1776

Offline AbaraXas

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2013, 12:12:10 PM »
A bit of a nerdy way of looking at it too.

Between 1976 until 2009 there were 16 government shutdowns- averaging one every two years (although they did come every two years, just an average).

Between 2010 until now, there has been only one (1 in 3 years).

So the pattern is fewer since Citizens United.
Never delude yourself into thinking you're "influencing" or making a difference on the internet. It is an ephemeral pleasure.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2013, 12:12:12 PM »
I really don't know what to say. There is no ulterior motive to me posting here other than trying to spark conversation. What do you believe my motives are/might be/could be?

One motive is that you are writing something for some Lib publication or a thesis for some degree.....I just don't think a person would go to all this trouble without an ulterior motive..as you said.

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Offline andy58-in-nh

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2013, 12:12:47 PM »
Why should corporations and conservative organizations be able to contribute to political candidates?
Here's what they are up against:

MAIN FUNDERS OF THE LEFT
 
  • Ford Foundation
  • Open Society Institute
  • Schumann Center for Media and Democracy
  • Tides Foundation and Tides Center
  • Pew Charitable Trusts
  • John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation
  • Carnegie Corporation of New York
  • Council on Foundations
  • Aetna Foundation
  • Allstate Foundation
  • American Express Foundation
  • AT&T Foundation
  • Bank of America Foundation
  • Ben and Jerry's Foundation
  • Carnegie Corporation of New York
  • ChevronTexaco Foundation (Chevron Global Fund)
  • Fannie Mae Foundation
  • Freddie Mac Foundation
  • Harper's Magazine Foundation
  • Ms. Foundation for Women (MFW)
  • New York Times Company Foundation
  • PBS Foundation
  • Playboy Foundation
  • Rockefeller Financial Services (RFS)
  • Sara Lee Foundation
  • Verizon Foundation
  • W.K. Kellogg Foundation
PRIVATE:

  • A.J. Muste Memorial Institute (AJMMI)
  • Agape Foundation
  • Ahmanson Foundation
  • Alan B. Slifka Foundation
  • Alliance for Global Justice (AGJ)
  • Andrew W. Mellon Foundation
  • Annie E. Casey Foundation
  • Arca Foundation
  • Barack H. Obama Foundation (BHOF)
  • Bauman Family Foundation
  • Beldon Fund
  • Berghof Foundation for Conflict Studies (BFCS)
  • Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation
  • Bill, Hillary & Chelsea Clinton Foundation (BHCCF)
  • Blue Moon Fund
  • Bullitt Foundation
  • Caipirinha Foundation
  • CarEth Foundation
  • Century Foundation (CF)
  • Changemakers
  • Charitable Foundation: Institute for Economics and Peace (CF-IEP)
  • Charles Stewart Mott Foundation (CSMF)
  • Chino Cienega Foundation (CCF)
  • Choices in Community Giving (CCG)
  • Civil Justice Foundation
  • Colombe Foundation
  • Columbia Foundation
  • Compton Foundation
  • Connect US Fund (CUSF)
  • Council on Foundations
  • Cypress Fund for Peace and Security (CFPS)
  • David and Katherine Moore Family Foundation (DKMMF)
  • David and Lucile Packard Foundation
  • Democracy Alliance (DA)
  • Diana, Princess of Wales Memorial Fund (DPWMF)
  • Educational Foundation of America
  • Energy Foundation (EF)
  • Flora Family Foundation
  • Ford Foundation
  • Foundation for Child Development (FCD)
  • Foundation For Deep Ecology
  • Four Freedoms Fund (FFF)
  • Geraldine R. Dodge Foundation
  • German Marshall Fund of the United States (GMF)
  • Glaser Progress Foundation (GPF)
  • Global Resource Action Center for the Environment (GRACE)
  • GrantMakers Without Borders (GWB)
  • Grassroots International (GRI)
  • Harold K. Hochschild Foundation (HKHF)
  • Harry Frank Guggenheim Foundation (HFGF)
  • Heinz Endowments
  • Heinz Family Foundation
  • Helen W. Buckner Charitable Residuary Trust
  • Hunt Alternatives Fund (HAF)
  • Iara Lee and George Gund III Foundation
  • Interfaith Funders
  • International Endowment for Democracy (IED)
  • J.M. Kaplan Fund
  • Janelia Foundation (JF)
  • JEHT Foundation
  • Jenifer Altman Foundation
  • Jessie Smith Noyes Foundation
  • Jewish Funds for Justice (JFSJ)
  • John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation
  • Joint Victory Campaign 2004
  • Joseph Rowntree Charitable Trust (JRCT)
  • Joyce Foundation
  • Kenbe Foundation (KF)
  • Lear Family Foundation
  • Liberty Hill Foundation
  • Lippincott Foundation (LF)
  • Living Cities (LC)
  • Livingry Foundation (LF)
  • Lydia B. Stokes Foundation (LBSF)
  • Merck Family Fund (MFF)
  • Mertz Gilmore Foundation
  • Minneapolis Foundation
  • Morris and Gwendolyn Cafritz Foundation
  • Nathan Cummings Foundation
  • National Committee for Responsive Philanthropy (NCRP)
  • Neighborhood Funders Group
  • New Cycle Foundation (NCF)
  • New World Foundation
  • New-Land Foundation
  • Nuclear Age Peace Foundation (NAPF)
  • Open Society Institute
  • Park Foundation
  • Peace and Security Funders Group (PSFG)
  • Peace Development Fund
  • Peace, Conflict, and Development Program Initiative (PCDPI)
  • People's Rights Fund (PRF)
  • Pew Charitable Trusts
  • Phelps Stokes Fund
  • Piper Fund
  • Planethood Foundation (PF)
  • Ploughshares Fund (PF)
  • Progress Unity Fund
  • Prospect Hill Foundation
  • Proteus Fund
  • Public Welfare Foundation
  • Rational Games, Inc. (RGI)
  • Righteous Persons Foundation
  • Robert Wood Johnson Foundation
  • Rockefeller Brothers Fund
  • Rockefeller Family Fund
  • Rockefeller Foundation
  • Rosenberg Fund for Children
  • Saga Foundation (SF)
  • Samuel Rubin Foundation
  • Sandler Family Supporting Foundation (SF)
  • Scherman Foundation
  • Schooner Foundation
  • Schumann Center for Media and Democracy
  • Secure World Foundation (SWF)
  • Shefa Fund
  • Simons Foundation
  • Stanley Foundation
  • Steiner-King Foundation (SKF)
  • Stern Family Fund
  • Steven and Michele Kirsch Foundation
  • Stewart R. Mott Foundation
  • Streisand Foundation
  • Summit Charitable Foundation
  • Sunlight Foundation
  • Surdna Foundation
  • Three Rivers Community Foundation
  • Threshold Foundation (TF)
  • Tides Foundation and Tides Center
  • Town Creek Foundation
  • Turner Foundation
  • United Nations Foundation
  • Vanguard Public Foundation
  • Vira I. Heinz Endowment
  • Wallace Global Fund (WGF)
  • Wellspring Advisors
  • Wieboldt Foundation
  • William and Flora Hewlett Foundation
  • Woods Fund of Chicago
  • Working Assets (WA)
  • Z. Smith Reynolds Foundation
  • Zakat Foundation of America (ZFA)
PARTIAL LIST OF GROUPS RECEIVING FINANCIAL SUPPORT FROM LEFT-WING FUNDERS:

            21st Century Democrats (21CD)
            AARP
            ActBlue (AB)
            Advancement Project (AP)
            Air America Radio (AAR)
            Alliance for Climate Protection (ACP)
            Alliance For Justice (AFJ)
            Alliance of Californians for Community Empowerment (ACCE)
            Amal (AM)
            America Coming Together (ACT)
            America Votes (AV)
            American Association for Justice (AAJ)
            American Constitution Society for Law and Policy (ACSLP)
            American Family Voices (AFV)
            American Federation of Labor - Congress of Industrial Organizations (AFL-CIO)
            American Federation of State, County, and Municipal Employees (AFSCME)
            American Federation of Teachers (AFT)
            American Institute for Social Justice (AISJ)
            American Muslim Alliance (AMA)
            American Task Force on Palestine (ATFP)
            Americans Against Escalation in Iraq (AAEI)
            Americans for a Conservative Direction (ACD)
            Americans for Democratic Action (ADA)
            Americans United (for Separation of Church and State) (AU)
            Americans United For Change (AUFC)
            AmeriCorps
            Apollo Alliance (AA)
            Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN)
            Atlas Project (AP)
            Avaaz.org
            Backbone Campaign (BC)
            Ballot Initiative Strategy Center (BISC)
            Battleground Texas (BT)
            Birthright Unplugged (BU)
            Black Alliance for Just Immigration (BAJI)
            Blue Green Alliance (BGA)
            Blueprint North Carolina (BNC)
            Brennan Center for Justice (BCJ)
            Brookings Institution (BI)
            Business Forward (BF)
            Campaign for a New American Policy on Iran (CNAPI)
            Campaign for America's Future (CAF)
            Campaign for Better Health Care (CBHC)
            Campaign to End Obesity (CEO)
            Campus Progress (CP)
            Carter Center (CC)
            Catalist
            Catholic Campaign for Human Development (CCHD)
            Catholic Democrats (CD)
            Catholic Health Association (CHA)
            Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good (CACG)
            Center for American Progress (CAP)
            Center for Climate Strategies (CCS)
            Center for Economic and Policy Research (CEPR)
            Center for Independent Media (CIM)
            Center for Progressive Leadership (CPL)
            Center for Responsible Lending (CRL)
            Center on Budget and Policy Priorities (CBPP)
            Center on Wisconsin Strategy (COWS)
            Change America Now (CAN)
            Change to Win (CTW)
            Chicago Climate Exchange (CCX)
            Choice USA
            Citizen Action (CA)
            Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington (CREW)
            Civis Analytics (CA)
            Coalition for Humane Immigrant Rights of Los Angeles (CHIRLA)
            Color of Change (COC)
            Committees of Correspondence for Democracy and Socialism (CCDS)
            Common Cause (CC)
            Common Purpose Project (CPP)
            Communist Party USA (CPUSA)
            Congressional Black Caucus (CBC)
            Congressional Progressive Caucus (CPC)
            Copenhagen Climate Council (CCC)
            Council for American Job Growth (CAJG)
            Democracia USA (D-USA)
            Democracy 21 (D21)
            Democracy Alliance (DA)
            Democracy For America (DFA)
            Democracy Initiative (DI)
            Democracy Matters (DM)
            Democratic Grassroots Action Institute & Network (DGAIN)
            Democratic Party (DP)
            Drum Major Institute for Public Policy (DMI)
            Earth Action Network (EAN)
            Earth Day Network (EDN)
            EMERGE USA
            EMILY's List (EL)
            Energy Action Coalition (EAC)
            European Union (EU)
            Fair Immigration Reform Movement (FIRM)
            Fair Vote (FV)
            Faith in Public Life (FPL)
            Families USA (F-USA)
            Fatah (al-Fatah) (AF)
            Free Gaza Movement (FGM)
            Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF)
            Freedom Socialist Party (FSP)
            Friends of Democracy (FOD)
            FWD.us
            General Investment Management (GIM)
            Gisha: Center for the Legal Protection of Freedom of Movement (GCLPFM)
            Global Centre for the Responsibility to Protect (GCRP)
            Grassroots Campaigns (GC)
            Green Party of the United States (GPUSA)
            Green-Rainbow Party of Massachusetts (GRPM)
            Hamas
            Health Care for America Now (HCAN)
            Healthcare-NOW (H-NOW)
            Hezbollah (Hizbollah)
            Hizb Waed (HW)
            Hizb-ut-Tahrir (HUT)
            Huffington Post (HP)
            Human Rights Watch (HRW)
            Human Service Employees Registration and Voter Education Fund (Human SERVE)
            Illinois Coalition for Immigrant and Refugee Rights (ICIRR)
            Immigration Policy Center (IPC)
            In Defense of Freedom (IDF)
            Independent Progressive Politics Network (IPPN)
            Industrial Areas Foundation (IAF)
            Institute for America`s Future (IAF)
            Institute for New Economic Thinking (INET)
            Institute for Policy Studies (IPS)
            International Coalition for the Responsibility to Protect (ICRP)
            International Criminal Court (ICC)
            International Crisis Group (ICG)
            Islamic Truth Group (ITG)
            Islamic Unity Movement (IUM)
            Israel Policy Forum (IPF)
            J Street
            Jamaat-e-Islami (JI)
            Jews For a Just Peace (JFJP)
            Justice At Stake (JAS)
            Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights (LCCHR)
            League of Conservation Voters (LCV)
            League of Women Voters (LWV)
            League of Young Voters (LYV)
            Leave My Child Alone (LMCA)
            Living Cities (LC)
            Media Fund (MF)
            Media Matters for America (MMFA)
            Meyer, Suozzi, English and Klein, PC
            Mi Familia Vota Education Fund (MFVEF)
            Midwest Academy (MA)
            MoveOn (MO)
            Moving Ideas Network (MIN)
            Music For America (MFA)
            Muslim Brotherhood (MB)
            Muslim Public Affairs Council (MPAC)
            Muslim World League (MWL)
            NARAL Pro-Choice America (National Abortion Rights Action League) (NARAL)
            National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP)
            National Association of Latino Elected and Appointed Officials Educational Fund (NALEO EF)
            National Coalition on Health Care (NCHC)
            National Committee for Responsive Philanthropy (NCRP)
            National Committee for Voting Integrity (NCVI)
            National Council of La Raza (NCLR)
            National Education Association (NEA)
            National Immigrant Solidarity Network (NISN)
            National Korean American Service and Education Consortium (NAKASEC)
            National Priorities Project (NPP)
            National Security Archive (NSA)
            National Women's Political Caucus (NWPC)
            Natural Resources Defense Council (NRDC)
            NDN (formerly the New Democrat Network)
            Netroots
            New America Foundation (NAF)
            New Organizing Institute (NOI)
            New Party (NP)
            New Policy Institute (NPI)
            New Politics Institute (NPI)
            New Progressive Coalition (NPC)
            No Labels (NL)
            One Nation Working Together (ONWT)
            Organizing For Action (OFA)
            Organizing For America (OFA)
            Out of Iraq Congressional Caucus (OICC)
            Palestinian Authority (PA)
            Peace Action Network (PAN)
            Peace and Freedom Party (PFP)
            People for the American Way (PFAW)
            People Improving Communities Through Organizing (PICO)
            Physicians for a National Health Program (PNHP)
            Planned Parenthood Federation of America (PPFA)
            Political Research Associates (PRA)
            Presidential Climate Action Project (PCAP)
            Priorities USA (P-USA)
            Progressive America Rising (PAR)
            Progressive Change Campaign Committee (PCCC)
            Progressive Democrats of America (PDA)
            Progressive Los Angeles Network (PLAN)
            Progressive Majority (PM)
            Progressive Policy Institute (PPI)
            Progressive States Network (PSN)
            Progressives For Obama (PFO)
            ProgressNow (PN)
            Project Vote (PV)
            Public Campaign (PC)
            Public Citizen (PC)
            PunkVoter.com (PV)
            R.E.M. (REM)
            Rebuild and Renew America Now (aka Unity `09) (RRAN)
            Rebuilding Alliance (RA)
            Reform Immigration for America (RI4A)
            Res Publica (RP)
            Respect — The Unity Coalition (R-TUC)
            Rock the Vote (RTV)
            Salsa Labs (SL)
            Scientists and Engineers for Change (SEC)
            Scientists for Global Responsibility (SGR)
            Secretary of State Project (SOSP)
            September 11th Advocates (9/11 A)
            Service Employees International Union (SEIU)
            Shadow Party (SP)
            Sierra Club (SC)
            State Voices (SV)
            Swedish International Development Corporation Agency (SIDA)
            Techrocks (TR)
            The Organizing Group (TOG)
            Think Progress (TP)
            Thunder Road Group (TRG)
            U.S. Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation (USCEIO)
            U.S. Civil Rights Commission (USCRC)
            U.S. Climate Action Network (USCAN)
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Liberalism isn't really about making the world a better place. It's about reassuring the elites that they are good people for wanting to rule over it.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2013, 12:14:17 PM »
I really don't know what to say. There is no ulterior motive to me posting here other than trying to spark conversation. What do you believe my motives are/might be/could be?

Another motive is that you are fascinated with Citizens United and the Koch Bros...I have noticed that in your posts and when you came into chat...

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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2013, 12:15:33 PM »
Thank you andy.... :thud:

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Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2013, 12:16:24 PM »
Speaking of media do you approve... as a  vet.. and a citizen .. of how they ignored what really took place in DC yesterday?

I'm always disappointed with the lack of coverage and attention the main stream media gives to rallies and events that might make the government look bad.

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2013, 12:18:39 PM »
Why should corporations and conservative organizations be able to contribute to political candidates?
Here's what they are up against:

MAIN FUNDERS OF THE LEFT


Would you support removing the big funding from both political parties? Everybody keeps saying "Citizens United is okay because the left does it too. They have tons of money they get from special interests and rich members of the left wing", but what I propose is not letting ANY of these guys pump their millions into politics, regardless of their political affiliation.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2013, 12:19:57 PM by Liberal_Spy »

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2013, 12:21:35 PM »
Another motive is that you are fascinated with Citizens United and the Koch Bros...I have noticed that in your posts and when you came into chat...

I have a huge problem with how much money corrupts and influences politics on both sides of the fence.

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2013, 12:24:54 PM »
One motive is that you are writing something for some Lib publication or a thesis for some degree.....I just don't think a person would go to all this trouble without an ulterior motive..as you said.

Would it make a difference to you if either of those things were true? Hypothetically, would you care?

Offline Rapunzel

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2013, 12:24:56 PM »
I agree with what you are saying here. I personally think none of our politicians should be influenced by millionaires and rich special interests. They are there to serve the interests of the people that voted for them to be there. I think people running for office should have an equal chance to exposure, and shouldn't have to rely on multi-million dollar smear campaigns designed to manipulate voters. If you are honest, and your message is good, you shouldn't need to do things like that.


Yet in post after post you blame Citizens United and s VERY constitutional ruling and as Olivia noted ignore the really big money which comes from Soros and the hundreds of smaller groups he funds ... including every major university journalism school. He funds moveon.org, media matters, Think Progress, Tides, Emiie's List..and many more.  You ignore the billions that pours into the Democrats from Hollywood plus the movie an television shows which push their liberal agendas... you ignore the millions they receive from hundreds of environmental groups, you ignore unions and the billions they take out of union dues and billions from our taxes and then turn around and use to 're elect the people they know will keep sending them even more of our tax dollars. 

Let me ask you a question... not that you will answer of course... do you know who started and funds the SOS project.
“The time is now near at hand which must probably determine, whether Americans are to be, Freemen, or Slaves.” G Washington July 2, 1776

Online truth_seeker

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #20 on: October 14, 2013, 12:27:50 PM »
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mansur-gidfar/this-is-the-supreme-court_b_4086269.html?utm_hp_ref=politics

Again I'm not going to take a stance here. Pick apart the article and tell me your opinions.

Plainly and simply: The article suggests that Citizens United is wrong, and that privaate political free speech funding is wrong, but fails to mention the VAST sums collected, sometimes without consent, from liberal, public employee organizations.

From the lowest elected positions for school board, city council, planning commissions and up, government employee unions are HUGE sources of campaign money.

Do a little honest research and you'll confirm that. If they can pool their huge resources, so can others.

So it is your turn, to convince us that 500 or 500,000 government employees should be able to donate millions to democrats, but not businessmen and women.
#NeverHillary

Offline AbaraXas

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #21 on: October 14, 2013, 12:28:13 PM »
Would you support removing the big funding from both political parties? Everybody keeps saying "Citizens United is okay because the left does it too. They have tons of money they get from special interests and rich members of the left wing", but what I propose is not letting ANY of these guys pump their millions into politics, regardless of their political affiliation.

Let me give you a different way to look at things. You would agree that you have the right to petition the government with your grievances and have the freedom of political speech, correct? What if you and your neighbor feel passionately on an issue, should you have the right to ban together to petition?  What about you and ten other people, or a hundred, or a thousand?

All of these groups (on both sides) are just citizens rallying together in cooperation (corporation) around a cause. Be it the NRA, NARAL, Move On, National Right to Life, etc. They are groups of citizens coming together.

People will, always complain when a group they don't like gets so large they influence in a direction one doesn't like, but the solution isn't to restrict freedom of association. Usually these complaints come from politicians who don't like their power challenged.

Yes, there are many problems that should be addressed. Foreign money influencing elections, money coming from other questionable sources, money not going where the donors want but not having a choice (see Union dues for example).
Never delude yourself into thinking you're "influencing" or making a difference on the internet. It is an ephemeral pleasure.

Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2013, 12:31:27 PM »

Let me ask you a question... not that you will answer of course... do you know who started and funds the SOS project.

I know it was co-founded by Becky Bond, Michael Kieschnick and James Rucker.

Offline mystery-ak

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2013, 12:32:19 PM »
Would it make a difference to you if either of those things were true? Hypothetically, would you care?

Probably not..but to be determined....I would of course appreciate you finally being honest with me.....hypothetically of course!

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Liberal_Spy

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Re: I'd like your input on an article I found.
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2013, 12:32:45 PM »
Plainly and simply: The article suggests that Citizens United is wrong, and that privaate political free speech funding is wrong, but fails to mention the VAST sums collected, sometimes without consent, from liberal, public employee organizations.

From the lowest elected positions for school board, city council, planning commissions and up, government employee unions are HUGE sources of campaign money.

Do a little honest research and you'll confirm that. If they can pool their huge resources, so can others.

So it is your turn, to convince us that 500 or 500,000 government employees should be able to donate millions to democrats, but not businessmen and women.

I've mentioned numerous times that I support the removal of all big money investments into political parties.


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