Author Topic: 2 police officers threatened and assaulted Army officer during an illegal stop, lawsuit claims: Vide  (Read 6300 times)

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Offline skeeter

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Probably true... But a slow roll for a mile and a half without so much as a waive out the window to let em know you seen em... That ain't how it's done. I think that feller was baiting em.
It takes about 3 minutes to travel a mile & a half at 35 MPH. Down an unlit road towards a lighted gas stop? I don't think the drivers motives were too difficult to grasp. I'd want to get a good look at the car and the guys pulling me over as well. Not much time for a phone call. Dunno if I'd think to wave at em in the meantime either.

Offline sneakypete

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The police departments do tend to try to recruit former combat arms soldiers to become law enforcement.  Surprisingly they don't (for the most part) like to recruit former Military Police to become a LEO. 

They do that because they know that most of your 11 Bravo's (Infantry) are familiar with a host of weapons...they are disciplined and are cool under pressure and fire.  Especially so since 9/11.

I tried getting on with the city PD as well as the county sheriff here in their Public Information Office's....but they are not hiring at this point.  I'd even be willing to haul my old ass through the police academy if it meant getting the job I wanted.

@txradioguy

I briefly considered becoming a cop right after getting out of the army,but after taking a hard look at myself,I decided I was just not capable of doing the job like it needed to be done.

For example,I am fairly certain the bosses would frown on my bringing a child rapist to lockup by tying him to the rear bumper and dragging him to the station,and I wouldn't have been able to swear to anyone that I wouldn't do that.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline sneakypete

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Probably true... But a slow roll for a mile and a half without so much as a waive out the window to let em know you seen em... That ain't how it's done. I think that feller was baiting em.

@roamer_1

Well,not speeding up and trying to get away should have been a good first tip the guy wasn't going to run.

Probably would have been a good idea for him to have turned on his 4-way flashers,too,although the idea about calling 9-11 and telling the dispatcher what you were doing just can't be beat.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline roamer_1

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It takes about 3 minutes to travel a mile & a half at 35 MPH. Down an unlit road towards a lighted gas stop? I don't think the drivers motives were too difficult to grasp. I'd want to get a good look at the car and the guys pulling me over as well. Not much time for a phone call. Dunno if I'd think to wave at em in the meantime either.

Look... That's what folks do when they're dumping their junk. Go ask a cop. He'll tell ya.

So from the cops' point of view that's a good reason to be suspicious. So they are going to start the deal with an advantage. I don't blame them for that at all.

And then noncompliance - leaving one hand in the window... Not exiting the car - All of that is just baiting them into escalation. and they OUGHT TO escalate. If I did that crap with my jacket (well, at least back in the day) I would have got it a hundred times worse than that. That guy did every damn thing he could not to comply.

Offline skeeter

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Look... That's what folks do when they're dumping their junk. Go ask a cop. He'll tell ya.

So from the cops' point of view that's a good reason to be suspicious. So they are going to start the deal with an advantage. I don't blame them for that at all.

And then noncompliance - leaving one hand in the window... Not exiting the car - All of that is just baiting them into escalation. and they OUGHT TO escalate. If I did that crap with my jacket (well, at least back in the day) I would have got it a hundred times worse than that. That guy did every damn thing he could not to comply.
I've said all I care to about this. Cops are in a tough situation these days, I'll grant you. It's a shame they now feel the need to resort to the threat of lethal force, rightly or wrongly, in this allegedly free society, so quickly.

Until recently it wasn't this way.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 12:55:16 am by skeeter »

Offline roamer_1

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@roamer_1

Well,not speeding up and trying to get away should have been a good first tip the guy wasn't going to run.


@sneakypete
I don't think that is true. Slow roll turns into high speed chase too. You have to get it out of your head that this guy is a stand up guy - They don't know that. You think about YOU walking up on a blind car with the guy acting froggy.

Quote
Probably would have been a good idea for him to have turned on his 4-way flashers,too,although the idea about calling 9-11 and telling the dispatcher what you were doing just can't be beat.


That's all right. I guess I never had that problem. I ain't afraid of the dark. It's my advantage. So all I would have been looking for is somewhere to pull off safely... A turnout or something.

Offline sneakypete

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I've said all I care to about this. Cops are in a tough situation these days, I'll grant you. It's a shame they now feel the need to resort to the threat of lethal force, rightly or wrongly, in this allegedly free society, so quickly.

Until recently it wasn't this way.

@skeeter


I couldn't agree more. The typical citizen,and I include ME in that mix,has no interest in harming cops or causing them any trouble whatsoever.

What we DO want though,it to be treated with the same respect they demand,and get,from us.

They can always get "ugly" if the situation demands,but it is awful damn hard to back up and return to "civil" if you made a mistake in judgement.  It's just the nature of things.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2021, 01:00:12 am by sneakypete »
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline Sled Dog

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@sneakypete
I don't think that is true. Slow roll turns into high speed chase too. You have to get it out of your head that this guy is a stand up guy - They don't know that. You think about YOU walking up on a blind car with the guy acting froggy.


That's all right. I guess I never had that problem. I ain't afraid of the dark. It's my advantage. So all I would have been looking for is somewhere to pull off safely... A turnout or something.

I'm not a cop.   So I don't have to think about doing that.

But a cop...walking up to a vehicle he's pulled over for a minor infraction....that's his JOB DESCRIPTION as a revenue collector for the state, county or city that employs him.   

And the officer had his gun pulled out as soon as he had two feet on the pavement.   

The GOP is not the party leadership.  The GOP is the party MEMBERSHIP.   The members need to kick the leaders out if they leaders are going the wrong way.  No coddling allowed.

Offline roamer_1

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I'm not a cop.   So I don't have to think about doing that.

Yeah, but HE does.

Quote
But a cop...walking up to a vehicle he's pulled over for a minor infraction....that's his JOB DESCRIPTION as a revenue collector for the state, county or city that employs him.   

And the officer had his gun pulled out as soon as he had two feet on the pavement.

Really?? So you think he has to walk up to the window just like that, not knowing if it is a good citizen or a banger or crack zombie inside?

That seems completely unrealistic to me.

Offline skeeter

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@skeeter


I couldn't agree more. The typical citizen,and I include ME in that mix,has no interest in harming cops or causing them any trouble whatsoever.

What we DO want though,it to be treated with the same respect they demand,and get,from us.
Exactly. I get the behavior of the police is a reaction to increased barbarity of the criminal element but we need to be very careful allowing increased callous and brutal behavior by law enforcement towards the public in general. That is/will lead to diminishing the bond of trust between them and us. Once thats gone its all over.

Offline skeeter

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I'm not a cop.   So I don't have to think about doing that.

But a cop...walking up to a vehicle he's pulled over for a minor infraction....that's his JOB DESCRIPTION as a revenue collector for the state, county or city that employs him.   

And the officer had his gun pulled out as soon as he had two feet on the pavement.
Even then he could've holstered his weapon and re-assumed a less confrontational attitude once he realized the man was no threat. Instead he continued to escalate. & lost his job because of it.

Offline roamer_1

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Exactly. I get the behavior of the police is a reaction to increased barbarity of the criminal element but we need to be very careful allowing increased callous and brutal behavior by law enforcement towards the public in general. That is/will lead to diminishing the bond of trust between them and us. Once thats gone its all over.

This incident ISN'T that. Back in my day the cop would have done likewise. Even back then, noncompliance brought escalation.


Offline skeeter

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This incident ISN'T that. Back in my day the cop would have done likewise. Even back then, noncompliance brought escalation.
I'm no youngster either and I do not recall the police going straight to 'do what I say or I'll shoot' nearly as often as they do now.

Offline roamer_1

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Even then he could've holstered his weapon and re-assumed a less confrontational attitude once he realized the man was no threat. Instead he continued to escalate.

Actually the cop de-escalated once he got to the window and could see. The pistol went away, and out came the bear juice.
That is de-escalation. compliance is still going to have to happen. Or force. You choose.

Offline roamer_1

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I'm no youngster either and I do not recall the police going straight to 'do what I say or I'll shoot' nearly as often as they do now.

Yeah... I think they did... But maybe that was because I was on the other side of the tracks...

Offline sneakypete

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Yeah, but HE does.

Really?? So you think he has to walk up to the window just like that, not knowing if it is a good citizen or a banger or crack zombie inside?

That seems completely unrealistic to me.

@roamer_1

Yes,"just like that". If he or she can't do the job right,they should be looking for other work.
Anyone who isn't paranoid in 2021 just isn't thinking clearly!

Offline skeeter

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Actually the cop de-escalated once he got to the window and could see. The pistol went away, and out came the bear juice.
That is de-escalation. compliance is still going to have to happen. Or force. You choose.
After that brand of de-escalation not even the police union could save his job.

Offline roamer_1

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Exactly. I get the behavior of the police is a reaction to increased barbarity of the criminal element but we need to be very careful allowing increased callous and brutal behavior by law enforcement towards the public in general.

How the heck does that happen when the cop don't know what he is walking into?

I dunno why folks are so upset by that.. I have been amicable, and told the cop I was packing - Now, considering what I was, it was not unheard of for a cop to lay me up on the truck and disarm me himself, or stand off with his gun ready while I disarmed myself. and that was 80s/90s... And it didn't offend me even then. I knew he had to be comfortable and the sooner that happened, the better for me.

Offline LegalAmerican

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Look... That's what folks do when they're dumping their junk. Go ask a cop. He'll tell ya.

So from the cops' point of view that's a good reason to be suspicious. So they are going to start the deal with an advantage. I don't blame them for that at all.

And then noncompliance - leaving one hand in the window... Not exiting the car - All of that is just baiting them into escalation. and they OUGHT TO escalate. If I did that crap with my jacket (well, at least back in the day) I would have got it a hundred times worse than that. That guy did every damn thing he could not to comply.


CORRECT.  And OFFICER Tatum saw that too.  This young man needs to be thrown out of the army.  He is a bully.

Offline roamer_1

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After that brand of de-escalation not even the police union could save his job.

Wanna bet?

Offline roamer_1

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@roamer_1

Yes,"just like that". If he or she can't do the job right,they should be looking for other work.

@sneakypete
No, Not like that. That's how you wind up shot.

Offline roamer_1

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CORRECT.  And OFFICER Tatum saw that too.  This young man needs to be thrown out of the army.  He is a bully.

Sure looked to me like he was playin it.

Offline LegalAmerican

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Yeah, but HE does.

Really?? So you think he has to walk up to the window just like that, not knowing if it is a good citizen or a banger or crack zombie inside?

That seems completely unrealistic to me.


PRIOR Officer,  TATUM...explains the whole thing. BOTH SIDES.  Most of the men are NOT WATCHING THIS VIDEO. The two police NO NOT KNOW....who is behind the wheel.  The driver is acting strangely. Most police get shot, by these strange behaviors.  I support your posts on this Roamer. Everyone is talking in HINDSIGHT.  HIGH RISK STOP. 
------------------

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgBMnJyOiT0&t=3s


Offline LegalAmerican

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Sure looked to me like he was playin it.

Army did have gun on seat, or on him. Army guy set up his camera FIRST.  Army guy is wanting some kind of confrontation.  Acts, obtuse. 'What is going on'?   IDIOT. Won't comply, then is 'hard of hearing'. azzhole.

Offline roamer_1

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PRIOR Officer,  TATUM...explains the whole thing. BOTH SIDES.  Most of the men are NOT WATCHING THIS VIDEO. The two police NO NOT KNOW....who is behind the wheel.  The driver is acting strangely. Most police get shot, by these strange behaviors.  I support your posts on this Roamer. Everyone is talking in HINDSIGHT.  HIGH RISK STOP. 

I think that's right. I think the slow roll and the tinted windows turned it into a high risk situation. And his non-compliance escalated it from there... And I don't blame them at all.

Had he but complied, the whole show would have been over.