Author Topic: Biden to announce up to $4 trillion infrastructure plan with massive tax hikes  (Read 4068 times)

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Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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The Constitution is for limiting government, not making requirements of the citizens.
That is not exactly true.

The Constitution originated as a way to form a government, which is not limiting government.

And in forming that new government the document specifically stated the limitations for the government.

And yes, there are indeed obligations of a citizen of that government if that government is to exist at all.
“no punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin” ~  George Washington

Online Right_in_Virginia

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   Why do you ping the Admin on crap you don't like @Right_in_Virginia
   It never worked for me.

 :facepalm2: 

I pinged @Cyber Liberty because I was responding to HIS post.

@corbe

Updated to add:  Pity you missed the answer @txradioguy   ---  seeing this may have helped prevent you from making a total fool of yourself.








« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 08:23:15 PM by Right_in_Virginia »
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Offline thackney

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That is not exactly true.

The Constitution originated as a way to form a government, which is not limiting government.

And in forming that new government the document specifically stated the limitations for the government.

And yes, there are indeed obligations of a citizen of that government if that government is to exist at all.

Would you please point to a sentence in the Constitution that makes a requirement of any type of the citizens?
Life is fragile, handle with prayer

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

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Would you please point to a sentence in the Constitution that makes a requirement of any type of the citizens?
Do you have common sense enough to realize that there is no government if one does not exercise the right to vote of its citizens?

How would you believe the government can exist if no one votes?

And I guess if you believe there is never a requirement from citizens, then the draft is unlawful and we should just sit still and be conquered by anybody who wishes to overcome us too.

Of course there are obligations.  The Constitution is founded on a moral foundation.  Morality demands one acts.

« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 05:41:12 PM by IsailedawayfromFR »
“no punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin” ~  George Washington

Offline txradioguy

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   Why do you ping the Admin on crap you don't like @Right_in_Virginia
   It never worked for me.

@corbe she thinks she's got some kind of special "in" with management.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline txradioguy

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The Constitution is for limiting government, not making requirements of the citizens.

Exactly!
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline txradioguy

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There is no Constitution if no one votes.

It is malarky to consider otherwise.

Then you are contradicting yourself.

Quote
It is most certainly not principled to refrain from your constitutional duty to vote, which is what is being done.

 :whistle:
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline bigheadfred

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Only got one asset. It is on this here chair.
She asked me name my foe then. I said the need within some men to fight and kill their brothers without thought of Love or God. Ken Hensley

Offline corbe

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    She is the exact reason I got out of Retail as soon as I got into it.  She can be persistent and persuasive, at times, though the latter moments are few and far between, @txradioguy

    Here's the kicker~If I don't ping her she'll accuse me of talking behind her back, if I do ping her she'll belittle me in a PM for pinging her to my private hellhole, so I'm screwed either way. :shrug:

   @Right_in_Virginia
« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 07:40:58 PM by corbe »
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Online Right_in_Virginia

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@corbe she thinks she's got some kind of special "in" with management.

Who are you talking about here, you effing coward? 

@txradioguy
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Online Right_in_Virginia

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    She is the exact reason I got out of Retail as soon as I got into it.  She can be persistent and persuasive, at times, though the latter moments are few and far between, @txradioguy

What the hell part of "I pinged @Cyber Liberty because I was responding to HIS post" did you miss @corbe?

What part confuses you, still?



« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 08:25:56 PM by Right_in_Virginia »
"Remember this day forever." -- President Donald J. Trump, January 6, 2021

Offline corbe

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No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline corbe

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  Sister, it's Easter weekend,  Can't we try and live in peace like Jesus suggested?
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline roamer_1

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We win by voting the corrupt bastards out, of course.

That was always what we had to do, since before Reagan.

Time we got to work and did the job.

That's right. Throw ALL the bastards out. Burn that 'Big Tent' DOWN.

Offline roamer_1

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@roamer_1

You're looking for someone with solid Conservative principals and policies...others are looking for a bully.

@txradioguy

I think that's right.
I am looking for  that across the board though - I hold no faith in princes.

The ONLY thing that will beat the liberals is hard-core Conservatism at every level - not mere Republican-ism, not rah-rah messiah-ism. ALL of that is just bullcrap.

If the right cannot field a majority - a clear majority - of Conservatives, and cannot tear the reins of power away from the Republican Moderate wing  - And begin to write actual LAW supporting Conservative values, and reversing the liberal infection, nothing else one may do will matter a whit. Because the liberals will continue to win the day, as they have done for all of the last thirty years (except arguably, a brief respite in the 94 Congress)

That is the ONLY way forward. That is why I was/am a BIG supporter of the TEA party and don't support 'Tumpy and Our Gang' in the least... Because the TEA Party actually moved the ball.

Offline corbe

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   Whoa there @roamer_1 that big tent allows us space for the adorables and the gays.  It's political suicide to disclude (sic) them?     /s
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline roamer_1

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@roamer_1  must be over the target.
He's taking a lot of flak.

He stands on a principle against big government, smaller in scope, size, and what it spends, and I had thought that all of us desired this.

Whether D or R behind their name, there has not been a President in recent memory who has done any thing about the national debt.
Some said they tried, some said they wanted to, but at the end of the day, it just hasn't happened.
The Republican presidents in my life time, Nixon, Ford, Reagan, GHWB, W, and Trump, all said they would, and none did.
Before you blame the democrats alone, I will kindly remind you that each President  ever elected has the right to veto any bill they disapprove of.

We've got to elect Senators, Congressmen, and Presidents who make this a priority, or it won't change.

Let's say for argument sake that the difference is that the Democrats run the thing up twice as fast.
It's like saying you'd rather drown in fifty feet of water, rather than one hundred.

Now, @roamer_1 is more principled than me, as I will vote the lesser of 2 evils more often than not, but he's not wrong in his assessment of the government being out of control, in my view.

Thank you for that @GrouchoTex and you are damn well right, except in that last bit - I can see you from here, and I always have. We can argue over the lesser evil thing some other time.  :beer:


Offline roamer_1

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No, I'm not nuts @roamer_1  And thank you for your answer.  What "vein" is Cotton in?

Cotton is a Conservative. One of a handful. He is on the weaker side of 'strong Conservative' but in the ballpark with an ACU rating in the high 80s - Fallen some, like Cruz, though not as far as Cruz.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Wait, what?  Are Briefers not permitted to point out the liberalism in someone's policy or other proposals?  @Cyber Liberty

That wasn't what he did.  He said Roamer's "Brethren" were Libs, implying birds of a feather and all.  You know better than to post this.  Maybe not...not my problem :shrug:
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Offline roamer_1

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We all do @GrouchoTex  I'm not quite sure what the constant arguing is about fiscal responsibility.  There is nothing unique or sacred about @roamer_1 's fiscal "principles" --- or any of them.  We all share them. 

I think where the split starts is some of the most conservative "principled" confuse substance with style and policies with labels.  Another split I see is the "principled" are content to do nothing but wait for the embodiment of all principles to appear center stage while others will try to move the needle by feet instead of waiting for a quantum leap.   If the socialists have taught us anything, it should be to keep moving, even if by inches.

So, IMO, this endless debate on principle is really one of strategy.  I've said before (and caught hell for it) that politics is a blood sport.  It takes  guts, willpower, elbows, shoulders and at times, fists.  "Bullies" in politics are the movers and shakers; they are the heroes who affect change and get things done -- on both sides of the proverbial aisle.

Politics also needs a desire to win.  Taking one's marbles home when a candidate isn't a purist is the surest way to lose this country, forever, to the Marxists; and this is where and when all "principles" will die.

You are entirely wrong in your assessment @Right_in_Virginia

The reason I will hold out is precisely right though. Because that is the whole of the Conservative Coalition in its formation - That we would stick together and vote for each other - Because none alone has the ability to move things in a Conservative direction. ALL of the factions together are unstoppable.

But that means servicing the agreement between them - None of them go under the bus. That is the 'purity' you speak of. That none go under the bus - That you serve all of the factions, and do none of them harm.

THAT is what causes the Conservative juggernaut to rise up out of the sea. THAT is what causes unstoppable movement to the right. That causes REAL law to be written. That causes REAL harm to the left.

And that has happened exactly three times in my lifetime. Reagan, the 94 Congress, and the TEA Party - All quenched by the way, by Moderate wing manipulations of populist movements. You cannot take on liberalism cozied up to Moderates (like Tumpy did).

The only threat to them (liberals on the left and moderate power on the right) IS Conservatism, raw and unleashed.

You NEED MORE of that 'purity', not less. And the last four years should be a lesson in that regard.

You don't win with popularity. You don't win because you throw poo at liberals. You WIN with Conservative LAW.

That is ALL.


« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 10:05:08 PM by roamer_1 »

Offline roamer_1

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It is most certainly not principled to refrain from your constitutional duty to vote, which is what is being done.

It is hiding your head in the sand.

We have Joe Biden as our President because of those like him, who cannot see any difference between a conservative with faults and a full blown communist destruction of America.

He gets the Courage Award alongside Mitt Romney.

No it is NOT the cause of voting to vote 'against' anything, which is what you propose.
All your vote IS, all your vote CAN BE, is an endorsement. And if you read the Founders, you will find that is what they designed. You are to vote your conscience. You are to endorse your conscience.

Vote FOR what's RIGHT. To do otherwise allows the lesser evil, which is what the Republicans have become.

Offline roamer_1

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So, like you, I vote for the lesser of the two evils, and will continue, hoping to vote for the one that may make the incremental change, and while there have been exceptions, it has been pretty disappointing at times. It is hard for me to place the blame on the "principled" because they are getting tired of Lucy pulling out the football every time. It is their right to vote, or not, and they have to live with the consequences of not voting unless they are sold on a candidate, just like you or I have to when we get it wrong.
 

Except in that the theory has proven deadly and wrong over time. The incremental change you are getting is a Republican party sliding further and further into incremental evil, not the other way around.

That is precisely why Conservatism is almost gone - Because lesser evil is getting more and more evil. That slippery slope will be our doom, as anyone should readily see.

The benefit of constantly throwing fiscal Conservatives under the bus, for instance, is a party that pays no mind to fiscal matters AT ALL. Is that the right direction?

If you think the federal behemoth spends way too much, don't you think you ought to first vote for bean-counters? That makes nothing but sense to me, as the other side certainly is not going to defend spending less and having more accountability.

What has been wrought is that now, NEITHER side cares a whit for fiscal Conservatism, and it is all but lost. It is completely off the table.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2021, 10:20:56 PM by roamer_1 »

Offline roamer_1

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Of course there are obligations.  The Constitution is founded on a moral foundation.  Morality demands one acts.

TRUE. But it does not demand one act against one's conscience. In fact, quite the opposite.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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No it is NOT the cause of voting to vote 'against' anything, which is what you propose.
All your vote IS, all your vote CAN BE, is an endorsement. And if you read the Founders, you will find that is what they designed. You are to vote your conscience. You are to endorse your conscience.

Vote FOR what's RIGHT. To do otherwise allows the lesser evil, which is what the Republicans have become.

To refuse to choose is a choice, in and of itself.  :shrug:
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