Never Trumpers Illustrate Why Loyalty Is An Important Political Virtue

[roamer_1]

Yes, he is.

No, he is not. By the very definition, a Conservative supports ALL the principles of Conservatism. That is what a Conservative IS. There is no question that Tumpy fails that test in spades.

That's possible.   But not "we", the Americans.   People like the NT a-holes can't be counted as losers when they never got in the game to play in the first place.   Those people signed up to be parasitic fish snatching what scraps they can from the Rodents they're riding on, even as they pretend to be with the eagles.  They're not respected by anyone, never have been and will never be.

Yet Y'all keep on voting them in there. Every _single_time. I am rubbin that raw on purpose, because it is true - and nothing will ever change until y'all come back to orthodoxy and quit being satisfied with nothing, quit voting for RINOs, and quit voting for lesser evil in fear of democrats.

That is why y'all are losing, and precisely why I am no longer a Republican.

The only adulation those people get is from each other.

ROTFLMAO!!! John Friggin McAin't was laid with state honors fit for a king.

It says everything about HIS leadership.

He was not willing to compromise the pledges he made to his VOTERS to make his enemies, the Rodents and RINOs, happy.

Right. He FAILED. Eat that, because it is true. And if he were half a man he would admit it. Either he was ignorant going in, and failed in his planning, or his leadership skills are left wanting - It is only one or the other. Hard truth for some, but true all the same. He did NOT deliver.

He is not a Bush.   Give them man a hundred points for each Bush he wasn't.

He is not a McStain or a Romeny.  Give the man a million points for each of those.

Yet there he was, hand in hand with the moderate wing leadership, against Conservative cause. Snuggled up with MurderTurtle IS snuggled up with Bush and McCain't. Same thing. Same wing.

So he starts out on the positive side with 2,000,300 points in leadership.

And failed spectacularly ANYWAY.

It wasn't his job to compromise with the Republicans on HIS team.  Because it was HIS team.   He won the elections of 2016 and 2020.  It was the Republicans job to get on HIS program and push that agenda upstream.

LOL! You have a funny idea of how leadership works. Never really did that, have you? I have. And you're wrong.

It was THEIR job to FOLLOW.   Their TREASONS do not cast shade on his leadership, their yipping and yapping and the petulant braying of their foolish supporters merely show what tiny people THEY are.

Again, you are stone dead wrong on that.

Trump is a great American.  One of the greatest.

I think you're wrong on that too - I think the history books will not be kind to Tumpy.

You are the one defending the Rodents and the RINOs.

Never in a million years.

The Americans are not.

Politics is not a game you understand or play well.

Yeah you're right. I am not interested in pumping up empty suits and justifying lies. I have no patience for fair-thee-well coalitions and dueling propaganda.

Statesmanship and principles are what I am cut for. Truth will always out.
 

[Sled Dog]

No, he is not. By the very definition, a Conservative supports ALL the principles of Conservatism. That is what a Conservative IS. There is no question that Tumpy fails that test in spades.

That's an idiotic definition.

You just said there are not a single  conservative in the United States.

Certainly the Never Trumping A-holes, with their devotion to harming the United States to stop Trump, aren't conservatives.

Yet Y'all keep on voting them in there. Every _single_time. I am rubbin that raw on purpose, because it is true - and nothing will ever change until y'all come back to orthodoxy and quit being satisfied with nothing, quit voting for RINOs, and quit voting for lesser evil in fear of democrats.

You have no idea what the Americans are thinking right now, or what we are going to be doing.

What we won't be doing is voting for RINOs.   Not in the primaries, not in the general elections.  If I didn't live where I lived I would vote for a Rodent in the general election if a RINO was on the other side of the ballot.   And I'm pretty sure most of the 75 MAGA are feeling the same.

You wouldn't know anything about this, but we Americans were angry in 2016 at how the RINOs were.

You certainly don't know anything now about how the Americans are just flaming furious about how the NT RINOs did nothing to challenge this fraudulent usurpation by that Senile Kootch.

That is why y'all are losing, and precisely why I am no longer a Republican.

You've elected to be openly ineffective instead of quietly so.

And...?

ROTFLMAO!!! John Friggin McAin't was laid with state honors fit for a king.

Umm....is that a Weekend At Bernie's reference or a dig at his devotion to Bill Clinton?

The objective fact is that McStain was a traitor.  He started out as a traitor, he died as a traitor.   And in-between he got no respect from me or any other veteran.

[skeeter]

Then again, maybe the NT's need to figure out why their boy Jeb! didn't succeed in getting the nomination without voters, as he promised.

Because the Americans were fed up with the Bush Clan, the Romeny Squishes and the McStain TRAITORS and chose instead the one candidate on the debate stages that reflected THEIR values and THEIR commitment to the United States.

The Americans, for the first time since 1984, selected the AMERICAN candidate they needed.

They didn't select a Squish, they didn't select a shrubbery, they didn't select a traitor, a rapist, a drunkard, a muslim or a senile old fool.    They didn't select anyone a Never Trumping traitor could ever approve of.

And in the process, their candidates successful run for his second term garnered more votes than any president ever in American history.

And we are still here.    And the NT jerks are never going to be happy ever again.  And hopefully over the next few years, they won't be in public office any more, either.

That Cheney broad isn't the only one going to be tossed out on it's well padded behind in 2022.

Trump lied - he promised but failed to deliver X = Trump's fault
Trump failed to stop congress from doing X, which is their constitutional prerogative = Trump's fault
Trump isn't a good leader because he couldn't prevent those in his own party from sabotaging his efforts to do/not do X = Trump's fault
Sure Trump did X Y & Z but the rats undid it all = Trump's fault

Its an unwinnable debate. The only way to win is to not play.

[roamer_1]

That's an idiotic definition.

It's the only definition there is (as Conservatism touches politics). I know folks want to move the goalposts and make Conservatism serve their purposes (ever-hyphenating the true thing), But in fact, WORDS MEAN THINGS.

A Conservative IS in the style and substance of the (now extinct) right wing of the Republican Party - In the fashion of Goldwater and Reagan Conservatism. That is what it IS.

You just said there are not a single  conservative in the United States.

There's more than a handful, right here on this board.

Certainly the Never Trumping A-holes, with their devotion to harming the United States to stop Trump, aren't conservatives.

Certainly - But that does not make Tumpy a Conservative.

You have no idea what the Americans are thinking right now, or what we are going to be doing.

What we won't be doing is voting for RINOs.   Not in the primaries, not in the general elections.  If I didn't live where I lived I would vote for a Rodent in the general election if a RINO was on the other side of the ballot.   And I'm pretty sure most of the 75 MAGA are feeling the same.

You wouldn't know anything about this, but we Americans were angry in 2016 at how the RINOs were.

You certainly don't know anything now about how the Americans are just flaming furious about how the NT RINOs did nothing to challenge this fraudulent usurpation by that Senile Kootch.

YAWN. Would that it were so. If it were so, I would not have left the Republicans... But if history holds true (and it likely will) you will gain a couple successes, and dance around the maypole, but in reality, Republicans are far too fearful of democrats to finally endure the pain of cleaning their own damn house and actually voting FOR what they believe in.

Magic Eightball says: Not gonna happen.

You've elected to be openly ineffective instead of quietly so.

To the contrary. I have elected to quit being ineffective and ONLY support that which I believe in. And I am far more effective now, with my own hands, seeing those fruits of my labor, than I ever was all those years active in Republican circles.

If the Republican party ever decides to move itself back to the right of center, I might consider voting for the Big Rhinestone 'R' again... but never again with any trust whatsoever.

Umm....is that a Weekend At Bernie's reference or a dig at his devotion to Bill Clinton?

I have no friggin clue what you are going on about.

The objective fact is that McStain was a traitor.  He started out as a traitor, he died as a traitor.   And in-between he got no respect from me or any other veteran.

No, the objective FACT is that y'all kept voting for him and putting him back in there - I sure as hell didn't vote for him - But not many here can make that claim, I bet. Never voted for the Romulan either... But many of y'all did.

[roamer_1]

Trump lied - he promised but failed to deliver X = Trump's fault
Trump failed to stop congress from doing X, which is their constitutional prerogative = Trump's fault
Trump isn't a good leader because he couldn't prevent those in his own party from sabotaging his efforts to do/not do X = Trump's fault
Sure Trump did X Y & Z but the rats undid it all = Trump's fault

Its an unwinnable debate. The only way to win is to not play.

Yes, it IS unwinnable, Because it is true.

If I contract to deliver a product and that product is not satisfactory, or I don't land on my marks, those invested in the contract do not give a single crap why. I can whine about my help not falling in line, I can whine about the weather stopping needful deliveries, I can whine all I want - There are always excuses. But there are seldom reasons.

It used to be that Republicans instinctively knew the buck stops right at the top.

If I don't deliver, It's my company, and it's MY FAULT. No way around it. And it's been mine to admit, many times in my life - all of which then become studies in how to do better next time. If you need better help, get better help. If you need better supply lines, get better supply lines. What you DON'T do is the same damn thing again.

[libertybele]

Yes, it IS unwinnable, Because it is true.

If I contract to deliver a product and that product is not satisfactory, or I don't land on my marks, those invested in the contract do not give a single crap why. I can whine about my help not falling in line, I can whine about the weather stopping needful deliveries, I can whine all I want - There are always excuses. But there are seldom reasons.

It used to be that Republicans instinctively knew the buck stops right at the top.

If I don't deliver, It's my company, and it's MY FAULT. No way around it. And it's been mine to admit, many times in my life - all of which then become studies in how to do better next time. If you need better help, get better help. If you need better supply lines, get better supply lines. What you DON'T do is the same damn thing again.

I understand your thoughts, but ultimately WE are the government (or it should be that way). Therefore, it IS our fault for not holding our elected officials responsible.

 Yes ... voting in the same people and doing the same thing and expecting different results is sheer lunacy.

[roamer_1]

I understand your thoughts, but ultimately WE are the government (or it should be that way). Therefore, it IS our fault for not holding our elected officials responsible.

 Yes ... voting in the same people and doing the same thing and expecting different results is sheer lunacy.

Well the offered contest was that it ain't Tumpy's fault, which is how my reply was shaped... But in the end you are right. In the end it is the Republican voter's fault for not offering real opposition to the Democrats, and finally the American People's fault, for allowing the whole communist thing in the first place.

The point being to stop blaming others for failure. Take the 'L' and learn from it, and do better next time... all this bravado is otherwise so much bullsh*t. 

[Sled Dog]

No, the objective FACT is that y'all kept voting for him and putting him back in there - I sure as hell didn't vote for him - But not many here can make that claim, I bet. Never voted for the Romulan either... But many of y'all did.

I've never lived in Arizona.

[txradioguy]

@roamer_1 what a lot of people...even Conservatives don't realize is that Conservatism isn't a political ideology...it's an actual belief system.

 

[roamer_1]

I've never lived in Arizona.

He ran for president.

[Sled Dog]

Yes, it IS unwinnable, Because it is true.

If I contract to deliver a product and that product is not satisfactory, or I don't land on my marks, those invested in the contract do not give a single crap why. I can whine about my help not falling in line, I can whine about the weather stopping needful deliveries, I can whine all I want - There are always excuses. But there are seldom reasons.

It used to be that Republicans instinctively knew the buck stops right at the top.

If I don't deliver, It's my company, and it's MY FAULT. No way around it. And it's been mine to admit, many times in my life - all of which then become studies in how to do better next time. If you need better help, get better help. If you need better supply lines, get better supply lines. What you DON'T do is the same damn thing again.

Republicans know when they're being shined on, too.

When the Rapist complained that he tried really really hard and couldn't find any way to avoid raising taxes...after being in the Oval Orifice for less than 40 days, everyone knew he lied his butt off to con the election.

When the Rapist took "full responsibility" for the murder of 85 Americans in Waco by his wife's friend, the Bull Dyke Baby Barbequing Jello Reno, and then he didn't resign, we all knew where the buck stopped.

When the World Trade Center was attacked, we found out why and knew the blame rested squarely on the sloped shoulders of the Rapist Gangsters that were no longer in office, and thus the buck didn't stop at Bushy's place.

Why should we blame the Final President for not accomplishing a task when the Enemies of the People held all the positions of power in the bodies that were responsible for writing the budgets in the first place?   I've already explained to you how the budgets are created, so your buck stops at your desk and you can no longer pretend ignorance about how the process works in actual practice.

So, no, the fiscal waste is not the fault of the Final President, no matter how much the Never Trumping losers like George Will and Davey French and similar trash want to pretend otherwise.  Why are you still reading them?

[Cyber Liberty]

Feet off the gas pedals, all y'all...

[Sled Dog]

He ran for president.

You said "you kept putting him back there".

Last time I checked, that foul traitor was never allowed to be president.  There was one of his illegal alien pals in the way.

[roamer_1]

@roamer_1 what a lot of people...even Conservatives don't realize is that Conservatism isn't a political ideology...it's an actual belief system.

That's right. Based in the likes of Burke and Kirk and authors and orators going back to the ancients. I am well versed in it all. But there is a distinction to make, which I normally do, in that all of Conservatism will not fit into a political box, and ergo, Conservatism as it touches politics is a mere subset, designed to keep government at bay, and out of the way of a Conservative way-of-life.

Right as always @txradioguy   

[bigheadfred]

@roamer_1 what a lot of people...even Conservatives don't realize is that Conservatism isn't a political ideology...it's an actual belief system.

Religion based.

[skeeter]

Yes, it IS unwinnable, Because it is true.

If I contract to deliver a product and that product is not satisfactory, or I don't land on my marks, those invested in the contract do not give a single crap why. I can whine about my help not falling in line, I can whine about the weather stopping needful deliveries, I can whine all I want - There are always excuses. But there are seldom reasons.

It used to be that Republicans instinctively knew the buck stops right at the top.

If I don't deliver, It's my company, and it's MY FAULT. No way around it. And it's been mine to admit, many times in my life - all of which then become studies in how to do better next time. If you need better help, get better help. If you need better supply lines, get better supply lines. What you DON'T do is the same damn thing again.

Sounds like you have good reasons to stop participating in elections. Good thing, too 'cause republicans do not need your vote. Or mine.

Go ahead and refuse to vote because no one meets your high standards. If every republican, or better yet conservative, stopped voting the ruling class will be tickled pink - they wouldn't have to pretend anymore. They'd have run of the table, or they would've had run of the table sooner than today.

Fool that I am all can do is continue to pick among the least of evils, try to be a thorn in the side of the frauds who run the GOP, and hope that every now and then I come across a candidate who at least endeavors to actually do what he/she campaigned on.

[txradioguy]

Religion based.

Not necessarily...but it does protect the 1st Amendment where religion is concerned.

[skeeter]

@roamer_1 what a lot of people...even Conservatives don't realize is that Conservatism isn't a political ideology...it's an actual belief system.

Absolutely true. Which is why all I require of my politician is fealty to the Constitution.

[libertybele]

Sounds like you have good reasons to stop participating in elections. Good thing, too 'cause republicans do not need your vote. Or mine.

Go ahead and refuse to vote because no one meets your high standards. If every republican, or better yet conservative, stopped voting the ruling class will be tickled pink - they wouldn't have to pretend anymore. They'd have run of the table, or they would've had run of the table sooner than today.

Fool that I am all can do is continue to pick among the least of evils, try to be a thorn in the side of the frauds who run the GOP, and hope that every now and then I come across a candidate who at least endeavors to actually do what he/she campaigned on.

I'm refusing to vote because from my view point the last election was stolen; planned on by both sides of the fence. So, why cast a vote when the ballot box is clearly nothing more than a magic box that belongs strictly to the leftists? 

Unless that situation is remedied, this country will remain in tremendous turmoil and I don't know if it can be saved. 

The thought of a 3rd party run has been completely annihilated, and I've voiced another solution, but that didn't fly and I suppose is not feasible. Meanwhile ... we have Trump proclaiming he will help push for MAGA candidates in '22. How does he expect candidates to win if not a dang thing has changed with the election process???

Right now TX is trying to change things, but ultimately they will have to adhere to federal voting laws.  HR1 will decimate any chance of another Republican getting seated.

[skeeter]

I'm refusing to vote because from my view point the last election was stolen; planned on by both sides of the fence. So, why cast a vote when the ballot box is clearly nothing more than a magic box that belongs strictly to the leftists? 

Unless that situation is remedied, this country will remain in tremendous turmoil and I don't know if it can be saved. 

The thought of a 3rd party run has been completely annihilated, and I've voiced another solution, but that didn't fly and I suppose is not feasible. Meanwhile ... we have Trump proclaiming he will help push for MAGA candidates in '22. How does he expect candidates to win if not a dang thing has changed with the election process???

Right now TX is trying to change things, but ultimately they will have to adhere to federal voting laws.  HR1 will decimate any chance of another Republican getting seated.

I guess I've concluded that voting for a possible fraud - and in doing so at least communicate to the ruling class issues important to me, at minimum forcing them to kowtow to the base for a brief period - is marginally better than refusing to vote at all.

It is pathetic, I'll agree. Only slightly less so than refusing my vote entirely, to the delight of those who are making the system work for them personally, at my expense, and would rather pretend I do not exist at all. And as I said, once in a great, great while you find a pearl.

However, as you say the point could very well be moot now.

[Cyber Liberty]

Well, that rather screws over anybody staying in the ring to fight.  Thanks a lot.

[roamer_1]

You said "you kept putting him back there".

Last time I checked, that foul traitor was never allowed to be president.  There was one of his illegal alien pals in the way.

That ain't the point.  Did you vote for him as president or not?

[libertybele]

Well, that rather screws over anybody staying in the ring to fight.  Thanks a lot.

No. I am not saying to give up the fight. Never. I absolutely commend you for what you are doing. There HAS to be a way forward and there HAS to be a way to ensure fair elections.

 IMHO a lot of Hail Mary's and many many Our Fathers are needed along with the blessing of a miracle.

[The_Reader_David]

What wasn't to like about Donald Trump?   

Braggadocio, coziness with dictators, too much enthusiasm for tariffs (which are a blunt instrument in trade negotiations), inability to delegate responsibility (as evidenced by repeated conflicts with his own appointees), spreading the delusional notion that the Vice President as President of the Senate could single-handedly reject the vote of the Electoral College, setting up a cult of personality,....

That isn't to say there wasn't a lot of good:  Operation Warp Speed, constitutionalist judges, confronting both Iran and China more effectively than any recent President, the Abraham Accords, the return of due process to the adjudication of campus sexual misconduct claims,...

The main virtue of Trump was that he was not resolutely leading the country in the wrong direction.  He gave us what I expected when he was elected: four years of random governance, some good, some bad. 

[roamer_1]

Sounds like you have good reasons to stop participating in elections. Good thing, too 'cause republicans do not need your vote. Or mine.

Go ahead and refuse to vote because no one meets your high standards. If every republican, or better yet conservative, stopped voting the ruling class will be tickled pink - they wouldn't have to pretend anymore. They'd have run of the table, or they would've had run of the table sooner than today.

Here's the point: It is not an high standard. It is the standard standard. My standard is ONLY the standard that was agreed to under Reagan with mad respect to Goldwater. And without that standard. the Republicans could run the table and it would still look like democrats, as we are all starting to understand. And in that 'they' have been running the tables for YEARS, y'all unawares... And selling y'all on lesser and lesser standards until you are jumping for joy to get breadcrumbs. Go look at what was actually written into law the last four years and you will understand me better. Because what was written into law, and signed by a Republican President and signed by a Republican Senate tells the tale of where we REALLY are. It ain't Democrats vs Republicans. And it hasn't been for a very long time.

Fool that I am all can do is continue to pick among the least of evils, try to be a thorn in the side of the frauds who run the GOP, and hope that every now and then I come across a candidate who at least endeavors to actually do what he/she campaigned on.

And that 'least of evils' will be entirely without effect, as proven. And Conservatism goes wanting more and more, every time. Assuage yourself with meaningless EOs and a handful of hope... But they're selling you down the river, and writing it into law while you dream.

Jussayin.

I will not lend my endorsement to that.