Our Nation Is Paying for Trump’s Refusal to Be Presidential

[truth_seeker]

From para #2 of this decidedly TDS #nevertrumper article,

"The story of Castilian Spaniards replacing the “s” sound with a “th” sound (“therveza” instead of cerveza) to accommodate King Ferdinand’s lisp is myth, alas (or “alath”). But the moral of the story stands..".

That is the premise of the article.

And page after page, members write as if the article has some great truth, instead of words for which the author gets paid, whether true or not, whether wise or not.

[musiclady]

Truth:

Our problems with partisanship and polarization predate Trump’s election, but his presidency has been gasoline on a fire. Trump could have avoided impeachment countless times. Most obviously, he could have not done what he obviously did vis-à-vis Ukraine. Or he could have admitted his error, apologized, and taken the steam out of the impeachment train’s boilers.


Instead, because of his low character, he opted to stand by his claims that his actions were “perfect.” As a result, Republicans must now further deform their character to accommodate his and scramble to protect themselves from hearing the truth at his impeachment trial, on the accurate but embarrassing pretext that the Democrats didn’t expose the truth the right way.

https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/01/trump-impeachment-presidents-failure-to-be-presidential-hurts-nation/?utm_source=recirc-desktop&utm_medium=homepage&utm_campaign=river&utm_content=flex&utm_term=second

Truth.

[musiclady]

Refusing to support that which is counter to one's principles is not apathy.

In fact, it is the antithesis of apathy.

But the charge will continue to be made, despite its absence of truthfulness.

[roamer_1]

In fact, it is the antithesis of apathy.

But the charge will continue to be made, despite its absence of truthfulness.

Exactly right. 

[musiclady]

No one knows the difference. Who knows what 'Presidential Behavior' is?
Look at past Democrat Presidents over the last fifty years and name one who was 'Presidential'.

And since they have been unpresidential, our guy clearly should be unpresidential as well....

In spite of the fact that in the past we have always criticized the dems for their bad behavior......

[Right_in_Virginia]

And since they have been unpresidential, our guy clearly should be unpresidential as well....

In spite of the fact that we criticized the dems for their bad behavior......

Have you any idea, any idea whatsoever, of the scope of the battle we are in ... right at this very moment?

To be concerned with demeanor is at its best and its worst:  Vacuous. 

[Cyber Liberty]

Geesh, I was wondering what's developed on TBR whilst I was busy accomplishing honey-doos before I have to go on a beer run for the Castle bar...A slim of Shock Top today.

I found the answer....

 

[Absalom]

No one knows the difference. Who knows what 'Presidential Behavior' is?
Look at past Democrat Presidents over the last fifty years and name one who was 'Presidential'.

-----------------------------
Agree, both D and R were collection of buffoons, giving Reagan a pass.
The likes of Jefferson, Madison and Monroe no longer exist!

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Certainly you have to pick a topic. But the very heart of true journalism is to set your feelings aside and report the facts.

Which facts you choose to report is often just as important as the truth of the facts.  If you repeatedly focus on the flaws of one side, while deliberately refusing to address the equally factual flaws committed by comparators, the picture created is just as deceptive is if you'd lied about the actual facts.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Truth:

Trump could have avoided impeachment countless times. Most obviously, he could have not done what he obviously did vis-à-vis Ukraine. Or he could have admitted his error, apologized, and taken the steam out of the impeachment train’s boilers.

Truth!?!?  That's flat-out delusional.  Nothing could possibly have taken the steam out of the Democrats' desire to impeach, which they stated long before the phone call with Ukraine.  That was simply the excuse to impeach.  Had Trump "apologised" for the phone call, the Democrats would have shouted with glee and used his admission of guilt as complete justification for impeachment.

They have been trying to get him out of office since before he was inaugurated.  The suggestion that they are just fair minded people who would have been placated by an apology can only be believed by someone who is completely ignorant of what has been going on these last three years.

[roamer_1]

Which facts you choose to report is often just as important as the truth of the facts.  If you repeatedly focus on the flaws of one side, while deliberately refusing to address the equally factual flaws committed by comparators, the picture created is just as deceptive is if you'd lied about the actual facts.

Agreed. Being even-handed requires discernment, and should indeed be part of reporting the facts.

[PeteS in CA]

Truth!?!?  That's flat-out delusional.  Nothing could possibly have taken the steam out of the Democrats' desire to impeach, which they stated long before the phone call with Ukraine.  That was simply the excuse to impeach.  Had Trump "apologised" for the phone call, the Democrats would have shouted with glee and used his admission of guilt as complete justification for impeachment.

They have been trying to get him out of office since before he was inaugurated.  The suggestion that they are just fair minded people who would have been placated by an apology can only be believed by someone who is completely ignorant of what has been going on these last three years.

Dems and Progs were discussing impeachment on November 9, 2016, if not weeks earlier. And contriving to use the 25th Amendment to get Trump out of office. So no, the current shampeachment is not due to things done by Trump. House Dems simply chose, last fall, a pretext that had not yet been shown to be false.

[truth_seeker]

What very precisely is this 'price" we are claimed to be paying?

How much of it are we paying?

[musiclady]

@EasyAce

I just want to say thank you for the intelligence and information you've added to this thread.

It is good to read opinions and thoughts from the founding of this (once) great Republic that go beyond the current partisan sound bites on both sides.

[libertybele]

Dems and Progs were discussing impeachment on November 9, 2016, if not weeks earlier. And contriving to use the 25th Amendment to get Trump out of office. So no, the current shampeachment is not due to things done by Trump. House Dems simply chose, last fall, a pretext that had not yet been shown to be false.

Exactly.  Unpresidential?  Last time I checked he showed extreme leadership and acted very presidential when he silenced Soilemani and saved American lives.

Secondly ... Trump has committed no crime.  Nothing, nadda, zilch, zero evidence has been proven or provided by the DEMS.  President Donald Trump gave them the transcripts.  No quid pro quo.  Again, nothing, nadda, zilch, zero evidence the Trump has committed a crime.  Oh ... and after millions of dollars and over a year of bogus investigations and false accusations, there IS no proof or evidence that President Donald Trump colluded with Russia.

Russian collusion and this circus impeachment is nothing more than to try to prevent him from getting re-elected. 

I would hope that most on this board are smart enough to see the attempted coup against our President.  President Donald J. Trump is standing between us and socialism.

[aligncare]

Dems and Progs were discussing impeachment on November 9, 2016, if not weeks earlier. And contriving to use the 25th Amendment to get Trump out of office. So no, the current shampeachment is not due to things done by Trump. House Dems simply chose, last fall, a pretext that had not yet been shown to be false.

The perceived mess our politics are in is due entirely to Democrats’ unwillingness to accept the results of the 2016 election, and to their anti-American “resistance” to the administration’s legitimacy, which too often turned violent, and not to anything Trump has done.

In any event, Democrat’s move on impeachment now only needed some pretext, any pretext, however flimsy. Because democrats knew the media would have their backs whatever shit they came up with.

[skeeter]

The perceived mess our politics are in is due entirely to Democrats’ unwillingness to accept the results of the 2016 election, and to their anti-American “resistance” to the administration’s legitimacy, which too often turned violent, and not to anything Trump has done.

In any event, Democrat’s move on impeachment now only needed some pretext, any pretext, however flimsy. Because democrats knew the media would have their backs whatever shit they came up with.

Amen. I’m not sure how anyone could look at the current partisan mess and assert this is what the founders intended. Doesn’t pass the giggle test.

[EdinVA]

The perceived mess our politics are in is due entirely to Democrats’ unwillingness to accept the results of the 2016 election, and to their anti-American “resistance” to the administration’s legitimacy, which too often turned violent, and not to anything Trump has done.

In any event, Democrat’s move on impeachment now only needed some pretext, any pretext, however flimsy. Because democrats knew the media would have their backs whatever shit they came up with.

@aligncare
I think it is safe to go a step further.
We adopted more of the socialist/globalist agenda during the obama term thanwe have probably over the last 50 years and the socialists/globalist are angry that President Trump is upsetting their plan.
Trump has destroyed, at least for the moment, the new world order and UN dominance of the world.

[skeeter]

@aligncare
I think it is safe to go a step further.
We adopted more of the socialist/globalist agenda during the obama term thanwe have probably over the last 50 years and the socialists/globalist are angry that President Trump is upsetting their plan.
Trump has destroyed, at least for the moment, the new world order and UN dominance of the world.

Don’t discount the fact that he’s  also messed up their sweet racket in the process.

[aligncare]

@aligncare
I think it is safe to go a step further.
We adopted more of the socialist/globalist agenda during the obama term thanwe have probably over the last 50 years and the socialists/globalist are angry that President Trump is upsetting their plan.
Trump has destroyed, at least for the moment, the new world order and UN dominance of the world.

Yep. And for his upending of globalists’ utopian dreams of a one-world government, I am eternally grateful to President Donald J. Trump. Trump has shown he is a political pioneer, in that his actions will inspire future political patriots to bring America back from the brink of socialist decay.

[Maj. Bill Martin]

Dems and Progs were discussing impeachment on November 9, 2016, if not weeks earlier. And contriving to use the 25th Amendment to get Trump out of office. So no, the current shampeachment is not due to things done by Trump. House Dems simply chose, last fall, a pretext that had not yet been shown to be false.

I'll freely concede that there are times that Trump's statements are embarrassing as hell, and lacking in dignity.  I really hoped that he'd clean that up after the election, but it didn't happen.

But that being said, being indecorous, rude, or abrasive is not sufficient grounds to try to remove a duly elected President.  If voters want a loudmouth from Queens because they're ticked off, and tired of nobody listening to them, they're entitled to elect him.  And it's not for the tea and crumpets crowd to veto that election by manufacturing grounds to remove him from office.

[libertybele]

I'll freely concede that there are times that Trump's statements are embarrassing as hell, and lacking in dignity.  I really hoped that he'd clean that up after the election, but it didn't happen.

But that being said, being indecorous, rude, or abrasive is not sufficient grounds to try to remove a duly elected President.  If voters want a loudmouth from Queens because they're ticked off, and tired of nobody listening to them, they're entitled to elect him.  And it's not for the tea and crumpets crowd to veto that election by manufacturing grounds to remove him from office.

 

[EasyAce]

@EasyAce

I just want to say thank you for the intelligence and information you've added to this thread.

It is good to read opinions and thoughts from the founding of this (once) great Republic that go beyond the current partisan sound bites on both sides.

@musiclady

  in return!

More from Mr. Madison during the Virginia debates on ratifying the Constitution, as recorded in its record:

Mr. MADISON thought [impeachment] indispensable that some provision should be made for defending the Community agst. the incapacity, negligence or perfidy of the chief Magistrate. The limitation of the period of his service, was not a sufficient security. He might lose his capacity after his appointment. He might pervert his administration into a scheme of peculation or oppression. He might betray his trust to foreign powers. The case of the Executive Magistracy was very distinguishable, from that of the Legislature or of any other public body, holding offices of limited duration. It could not be presumed that all or even a majority of the members of an Assembly would either lose their capacity for discharging, or be bribed to betray, their trust. Besides the restraints of their personal integrity & honor, the difficulty of acting in concert for purposes of corruption was a security to the public. And if one or a few members only should be seduced, the soundness of the remaining members, would maintain the integrity and fidelity of the body. In the case of the Executive Magistracy which was to be administered by a single man, loss of capacity or corruption was more within the compass of probable events, and either of them might be fatal to the Republic.

[aligncare]

I'll freely concede that there are times that Trump's statements are embarrassing as hell, and lacking in dignity.  I really hoped that he'd clean that up after the election, but it didn't happen.

But that being said, being indecorous, rude, or abrasive is not sufficient grounds to try to remove a duly elected President.  If voters want a loudmouth from Queens because they're ticked off, and tired of nobody listening to them, they're entitled to elect him.  And it's not for the tea and crumpets crowd to veto that election by manufacturing grounds to remove him from office.

The name Winston Churchill kept coming to mind as I read your post.

[aligncare]

Good opportunity to post some of my favorite Churchill quotes:

“He has all the virtues I dislike and none of the vices I admire." - Winston Churchill

"A modest little person, with much to be modest about." - Winston Churchill (Regarding Attlee)

"An empty taxi arrived at 10 Downing Street, and when the door was opened, Attlee got out."  - Winston Churchill

"Attlee is a very modest man. And with reason." - Winston Churchill

"I may be drunk madame, but in the morning I will be sober, and you will be just as ugly." - Winston Churchill (when asked if he was drunk)

"The essence of American journalism is vulgarity divested of truth." --Winston Churchill

A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. - Sir Winston Churchill

"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries." - Winston Churchill