Rand Paul rips Lindsey Graham: 'Wrong about almost every foreign policy decision'

[mystery-ak]

Rand Paul rips Lindsey Graham: 'Wrong about almost every foreign policy decision'
By Marty Johnson - 10/15/19 02:12 PM EDT

Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) went after fellow GOP Sen. Lindsey Graham Tuesday morning on MSNBC, saying that the South Carolina senator has "been wrong about almost every foreign policy decision of the past two decades."

"He was wrong about the Iraq War," Paul told Stephanie Ruhle.

"He was wrong about the war in Libya," Paul continued. "He's wrong about this."

Both conflicts, Paul said, only brought more "chaos and terrorism" to the respective regions.

more
https://thehill.com/policy/international/middle-east-north-africa/465873-rand-paul-rips-lindsey-graham-wrong-about-every

[txradioguy]

So what about just 2-3 years ago when Rand was pro Kurds and even wanted to dangle the carrot in front of them to give them their own country?

Wasn't that long ago that ol Rand was in favor of spending U.S. tax dollars to arm the Kurds.

Now he's pulled a Liberal move and he's on the other end of the argument.

Imgine that.

Was Rand Paul wrong wrong then or is he wrong now? Will he change his mind again as soon as it's politically expedient for him?

[Right_in_Virginia]

So what about just 2-3 years ago when Rand was pro Kurds and even wanted to dangle the carrot in front of them to give them their own country?

Which Kurds?

[txradioguy]

Which Kurds?

This moronic hair splitting over "which Kurds" to try and white knight for Trumps knee jerk retreat is tiresome. 

But since you asked...he didn't distinguish "which Kurds" in 2015.  Because he knows...like most people do the Kurds aren't normally broken up by what country they live in.  In fact this whole question of "which Kurds" is a new talking point that's popped up in only the last couple weeks by the usual suspects.

Kentucky senator Rand Paul, perhaps the most prominent non-interventionist in Congress, said in 2015 that the United States should defeat ISIS by arming the Kurds and promising the Kurds their own country: “I think they would fight like hell if we promised them a country.”

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/rand-paul-on-the-kurds-then-and-now/

[Right_in_Virginia]

This moronic hair splitting over "which Kurds" to try and white knight for Trumps knee jerk retreat is tiresome. …. like most people do the Kurds aren't normally broken up by what country they live in.

You're getting a little bent out of shape here, Tx.  First:  there's no "normal" with the Kurds and Second:  Location identifies the Kurdish group's affiliations and politics (ie:  the PKK IN SYRIA)   (Kurdistan IN IRAQ)

[txradioguy]

You're getting a little bent out of shape here, Tx.  First:  there's no "normal" with the Kurds and Second:  Location identifies the Kurdish group's affiliations and politics (ie:  the PKK IN SYRIA)   (Kurdistan IN IRAQ)

And you're a little short on knowledge about the Kurds and it shows.  There IS normal when it comes to the Kurds and our dealings with them.

Oh you mean the same PKK that's also in Iraq?.

The Kurds are a nationless people.

This is what happens whenyou don't do any of your own research and rely on bad information and/or Trump ech chamber news sources...you look foolish.

Do your own homework and get back to me.

[kevindavis007]

And you're a little short on knowledge about the Kurds and it shows.  There IS normal when it comes to the Kurds and our dealings with them.

Oh you mean the same PKK that's also in Iraq?.

The Kurds are a nationless people.

This is what happens whenyou don't do any of your own research and rely on bad information and/or Trump ech chamber news sources...you look foolish.

Do your own homework and get back to me.

Bingo. Also, Kurdistan is for real, not like Palestine.

[txradioguy]

Bingo. Also, Kurdistan is for real, not like Palestine.

Its info that keeps having to be repeated because of the echo chamber effect some are suffering from on this.

[jpsb]

This moronic hair splitting over "which Kurds" to try and white knight for Trumps knee jerk retreat is tiresome. 

But since you asked...he didn't distinguish "which Kurds" in 2015.  Because he knows...like most people do the Kurds aren't normally broken up by what country they live in.  In fact this whole question of "which Kurds" is a new talking point that's popped up in only the last couple weeks by the usual suspects.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/rand-paul-on-the-kurds-then-and-now/

 

[Right_in_Virginia]

And you're a little short on knowledge about the Kurds and it shows.  There IS normal when it comes to the Kurds and our dealings with them.

This is what happens whenyou don't do any of your own research and rely on bad information and/or Trump ech chamber news sources...you look foolish.  Do your own homework and get back to me. 

Says the man who swore on a stack of Mark Harmon color glossies that:   "The United States has no nukes in Turkey".   I really don't think *you're* in any position to judge the veracity of anyone's opinion. 

Look @txradioguy , I understand you're upset because the military strategies that you were indoctrinated in have proven to be abject failures.   But I haven't been misleading you about the Middle East --- your leadership has.  So please ---  aim your nasty, snotty snark at them and not me. 

My sympathy for how you must feel watching your way of thinking becoming obsolete is wearing thin.   So just knock off the sh*& when talking with me.

[TomSea]

Says the man who swore on a stack of Mark Harmon color glossies that:   "The United States has no nukes in Turkey".   I really don't think *you're* in any position to judge the veracity of anyone's opinion. 

Look @txradioguy , I understand you're upset because the military strategies that you were indoctrinated in have proven to be abject failures.   But I haven't been misleading you about the Middle East --- your leadership has.  So please ---  aim your nasty, snotty snark at them and not me. 

My sympathy for how you must feel watching your way of thinking becoming obsolete is wearing thin.   So just knock off the sh*& when talking with me.

Agreed,

I just found out today that Gen. Mazloum Abda, whom seems to be a main leader if not the top man in the SDF is or was PKK  and that is important.

https://mobile.twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1183988670929522689
Ragip Soylu

This is also in the last 2-3 pages of the big stickied Syrian thread in world news.

Best to always argue straight forward and your patience is admirable.

Of course, one would want to read more on the issue to confirm it if this is truly something of interest.

@Right_in_Virginia

[Formerly Once-Ler]

cat fight 

[txradioguy]

Says the man who swore on a stack of Mark Harmon color glossies that:   "The United States has no nukes in Turkey". 

Ok I'll play your game.  They aren't U.S. nukes.  They are NATO shared nukes.  It's the same way it's run in Germany.  Yes they are manufatured in the U.S. and we provide security forces to guard them...but no we don't "own them".  They are shared weapons available to any NATO ally in a prepositioned location in the event of an all out nuclear war.

The U.S. doesn't have nukes in Turkey per se...NATO does.

Again...you should really do your own homework and quit relying on echo chamber news sources.

“NATO's nuclear deterrence posture also relies, in part, on United States' nuclear weapons forward-deployed in Europe and on capabilities and infrastructure provided by Allies concerned. These Allies will ensure that all components of NATO's nuclear deterrent remain safe, secure, and effective. […] The Alliance will ensure the broadest possible participation of Allies concerned in their agreed nuclear burden-sharing arrangements.”

[Right_in_Virginia]

Ok I'll play your game. 

I'm not playing any game @txradioguy   I find your intractable, militant rants on this issue irrational and frightening. Now take them to someone else, I'm done with you.

[TomSea]

I'd do what the Military and Presidential Advisers think is best, Now, if General Mazloum was or is in PKK, could be significant.

Brett McGurk apparently helped forge the SDF alliance. And by the way, that's the knock on McGurk and he is controversial to some.


Check this out from April of this year:

Dispatch
How Trump Betrayed the General Who Defeated ISIS

By Robin Wright   April 4, 2019


General Mazloum Kobani Abdi led the campaign against isis in Syria, forging a partnership between scrappy local militias and élite U.S. forces. Then Trump withdrew the American troops.Photograph by Delil Souleiman / AFP / Getty

The Islamic State has finally fizzled. Its caliphate, daringly declared from the pulpit of the Great Mosque of al-Nuri, in Iraq, in 2014, had been the size of Britain, ruled eight million people, lured recruits from eighty countries, and threatened to redraw the map of the Middle East. It ended, in the Syrian farming hamlet of Baghouz, as little more than a junk yard about the size of Central Park, filled with burnt-out vehicles and dilapidated tents. Tens of thousands of isis loyalists, both fighters and their families, opted to surrender—and face life in crammed prisons and dreary detention camps—rather than become martyrs in isis’s promised paradise.

The dangers are far from over. isis has sleeper agents. “There are thousands,” General Mazloum Kobani Abdi, the reclusive politician turned commander who led the campaign against isis in Syria, told me, when I travelled through the former caliphate last month. Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the Islamic State’s “caliph” and the world’s most wanted man, has evaded capture. isis also still has affiliates active from Nigeria to Afghanistan, from Egypt to the Philippines. “Frankly, our job has just started,” Mazloum warned. “We are finishing the great battle, then we will fight a different kind of war.”

The drive to flush isis out of Syrian territory was described as “the most successful unconventional military campaign in history” by the Middle East Institute last month. More than a dozen American diplomats and military officials involved in Syria told me the same thing. The campaign was distinct from the counterpart operation in neighboring Iraq, where the United States coördinated with a friendly government, retrained its conventional Army, provided sophisticated weaponry, established a headquarters for a coalition of seventy-four countries, and had legal status granted by parliament.

The campaign in Syria liberated roughly the same amount of territory. But it relied on an unlikely partnership between élite U.S. Special Forces teams and a scrappy local militia led by Mazloum, a middle-aged Kurdish rebel whose face has been weathered by years of conflict and five stints in Syrian prisons. They all operated in defiance of the Syrian government and its Russian, Iranian, and Hezbollah allies deployed nearby. Their mission was shrouded in secrecy. American troops wore no identifying insignias, ranks, or names on their uniforms. The Syrian fighters knew only the first names of the Americans, including the commander. Yet they established an unusual level of trust. The U.S.-led international coalition provided air cover, but it depended on the Syrian Democratic Forces, or S.D.F., to protect their troops on the ground.

Read more at: https://www.newyorker.com/news/dispatch/how-trump-betrayed-the-general-who-defeated-isis

OH, and by the way, General Mazloum denies apparently that the SDF have an agreement with Assad... so everything is in flux, get back in the games guys!

Again, note:

Ragıp Soylu
@ragipsoylu
My a few cents:

• President of the United States directly talked to a leader of PKK, Ferdi Abdi Şahin (General Mazloum). Let that sink in after Trump’s acknowledgment that PKK was a US partner force while designated.

• How will US mediate while taking a clear side with YPG?
1:11 AM · Oct 15, 2019

https://mobile.twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1183988670929522689

So, repeating:

[Absalom]

Bingo. Also, Kurdistan is for real, not like Palestine.

----------------------------------------
* Kurdistan is a creation of Hollywood imagination!!!
* Palestine existed in 10,000 BC and was occupied by the
   Phoenicians, Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines;
   among several.

[roamer_1]

* Palestine existed in 10,000 BC and was occupied by the
   Phoenicians, Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines;
   among several.

No, 'Palestine' did not exist until after it was a Roman Protectorate. It was thus dubbed in retaliation for Jewish uprisings, renaming the land 'Palestine' after the previous (to the Jews) Philistines. Prior to that it was Judea, Samaria, and Phillistia in various portions, and before that it was Canaan.

*   Edited to add: Partly Edom/Idumea, parts of Moab, Midian variously.
** Edited to add: And of course, Israel, however briefly.

[kevindavis007]

----------------------------------------
* Kurdistan is a creation of Hollywood imagination!!!
* Palestine existed in 10,000 BC and was occupied by the
   Phoenicians, Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Byzantines;
   among several.

Now you are promoting PLO Propaganda on this site?

[jpsb]

I agree with Paul re: Iraq and Libya. But he is wrong about Syria.

[Absalom]

No, 'Palestine' did not exist until after it was a Roman Protectorate. It was thus dubbed in retaliation for Jewish uprisings, renaming the land 'Palestine' after the previous (to the Jews) Philistines. Prior to that it was Judea, Samaria, and Phillistia in various portions, and before that it was Canaan.

*   Edited to add: Partly Edom/Idumea, parts of Moab, Midian variously.
** Edited to add: And of course, Israel, however briefly.

----------------------------
I stand corrected, as I applied the wrong dateline in Britannica.

[roamer_1]

----------------------------
I stand corrected, as I took the wrong the dateline in Britannica.

No fault no foul.
 

[Absalom]

Now you are promoting PLO Propaganda on this site?

-----------------------------
Hardly, as I'm absolutely no fan of the PLO.
As for Palestine, I erred in my 10,000 year timeline
but it was a Roman Province in the 1st century under
Pontius Pilate, when Emperor Tiberius ruled.