Author Topic: Defying Pentagon, Trump Backs Turkish Operation in Syria Targeting U.S.-backed Kurds  (Read 6160 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
The 'fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here' line has always had a kind of a smell to it.

Until you remember what happened on 9/11.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
How many US lives and how much treasure is it worth to you, Chosen? What are you willing to sacrifice?

And when we're done there, BTW, there are several dozen other examples of persecution and aggression left to address in the rest of the world. We've certainly got our work cut out for us. Maybe we should tackle Kashmir next.

How much are you willing to scarifice on our home soil when the attacks start over here?
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Online catfish1957

  • Ultra-Conservative in exile.
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,845
I neither defended nor attacked the President.  I simply asked a question.

All I ever hear is the drumbeat "we cannot abandon the Kurds".  So, I asked a question, the central question that few are willing to answer:  With the Kurds we have always been and continue to be generous with our treasure, must we also be generous with our blood?

Yes or no? @catfish1957

No...   But at least put a plan in place to get them out of harms way.   
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline skeeter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 14,514
Well this old Marine does not like the idea of abandoning a faithful ally to the likes of Turkey. Trump is going to lose a lot of support over
this. Turkey is an Islamic state and becoming more and more radical. No way I can defend Trump on this, it stinks to high heaven to leave
the kurds unprotected after they fought side by side with us against ISIS. Bad move Mr President, bad bad bad move. Read a little history
on Turkey and genocide.

Reagan supported the Afghans & Iraqis with weapons and other materials during their respective wars with Russia and Iran. He wisely did not send Americans over to die for them.

I see nothing immoral about doing the same with the Kurds.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2019, 10:39:24 AM by skeeter »

Offline OfTheCross

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 739
But the Kurds are not a monolithic group @jpsb  And not all are our friends.  But we still supply them with weapons and money to carry on their never-ending fight against the Turks, et.al. 

I suppose another way of asking the central question is:  With the Kurds we are generous with our treasure, must we also be generous with our blood?

How much blood have we shed with the Kurds? The article says that they've lost over 11,000 fighters, but I didn't see ours.
If a well-regulated militia be the most natural defense of a free country, it ought certainly to be under the regulation and at the disposal of that body which is constituted the guardian of the national security.

Offline skeeter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 14,514
How much blood have we shed with the Kurds? The article says that they've lost over 11,000 fighters, but I didn't see ours.

Begs the question how badly they need American bodies over there, doesn't it.

Online catfish1957

  • Ultra-Conservative in exile.
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,845
Well this old Marine does not like the idea of abandoning a faithful ally to the likes of Turkey. Trump is going to lose a lot of support over
this. Turkey is an Islamic state and becoming more and more radical. No way I can defend Trump on this, it stinks to high heaven to leave
the kurds unprotected after they fought side by side with us against ISIS. Bad move Mr President, bad bad bad move. Read a little history
on Turkey and genocide.

The Turks along wth Scots, and Vikings as infamous as the fiercist warriors in earth's history the past 1000 years.
Unless some contingencies are prepared quickly, the Turks will make quick work of the Kurds. 
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline DB

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 6,147
Name anything Trump has stood firm on.

The border is still being invaded. He signed laws that further entrenched that situation.

Obamacare is still the law of the land.

Extreme deficit spending is as bad as it has ever been.

1st and 2nd (and other) amendment freedoms are slipping away.

Online XenaLee

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 12,121
  • Pray for peace but train for war.
I think this comes down to one question @jpsb .... Is it our responsibility, often solely, to police the Middle East?

Sooo.... I guess this means we'll also be (finally) pulling completely out of Afghanistan, as well.   Right?

Quote
but it is time for us to get out of these ridiculous Endless Wars, many of them tribal, and bring our soldiers home. WE WILL FIGHT WHERE IT IS TO OUR BENEFIT, AND ONLY FIGHT TO WIN. Turkey, Europe, Syria, Iran, Iraq, Russia and the Kurds will now have to.....

...figure the situation out
Time for unity in America! (better late than never)


Offline OfTheCross

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 739
Begs the question how badly they need American bodies over there, doesn't it.


I tried to search for the answer and got that we've lost 3 soldiers in Syria.

But I don't know that I was looking at the correct conflict.

If a well-regulated militia be the most natural defense of a free country, it ought certainly to be under the regulation and at the disposal of that body which is constituted the guardian of the national security.

Offline DB

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 6,147
Begs the question how badly they need American bodies over there, doesn't it.

So we're going for version 2 of Bush #1 abandoning the Kurds to Saddam after we asked them to rise up and "help" us...

It is a bloody stain on our country and will cost thousands if not hundreds of thousands of lives all over again.

It is of low character to start something and not keep your word if at all possible. Why would anyone take our word for life and death issues in the future. Honor comes with a cost.

Online catfish1957

  • Ultra-Conservative in exile.
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7,845
Name anything Trump has stood firm on.

The border is still being invaded. He signed laws that further entrenched that situation.

Obamacare is still the law of the land.

Extreme deficit spending is as bad as it has ever been.

1st and 2nd (and other) amendment freedoms are slipping away.

Considering Trump needs conservative support to fight off his impeachment/conviction problems, very strange he would be making his worst (by far) decision at this juncture.  For a man who screams the importance of loyality, it sure is a one way street.
I display the Confederate Battle Flag in honor of my great great great grandfathers who spilled blood at Wilson's Creek and Shiloh.  5 others served in the WBTS with honor too.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

  • TBR Contributor
  • *****
  • Posts: 42,244
Well this old Marine does not like the idea of abandoning a faithful ally to the likes of Turkey. Trump is going to lose a lot of support over this. Turkey is an Islamic state and becoming more and more radical. No way I can defend Trump on this, it stinks to high heaven to leave the kurds unprotected after they fought side by side with us against ISIS. Bad move Mr President, bad bad bad move. Read a little history on Turkey and genocide. 

They fought with us against ISIS because they hate ISIS.  Our interests dovetailed ... this move cost the Kurds nothing; it was no grand gesture of support for the Americans --- and it gained them money, equipment and training.

The Kurds have yet to consolidate their own internal fractions and continue to operate under fragmented and weak leadership.  If the Kurds are serious about carving out a state of their own, they need to hold an internal Council of Trent to figure out how to stop fighting each other and unify.  Until and unless they do this, the Kurds are blowing smoke up the world's skirt ... trying to use us to fight not only ISIS but their own internal skirmishes.

The Middle East is nothing more than a massive spider web of tribe within tribe within tribe .... and they're all fighting each other.  They have been doing so for centuries and will continue to do so until time itself ends.

You think this is a bad move.  I could respect this @jpsb  if you tell me why this is worth losing one man or one woman wearing the American military uniform.  What do we gain?
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline skeeter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 14,514
So we're going for version 2 of Bush #1 abandoning the Kurds to Saddam after we asked them to rise up and "help" us...

It is a bloody stain on our country and will cost thousands if not hundreds of thousands of lives all over again.

It is of low character to start something and not keep your word if at all possible. Why would anyone take our word for life and death issues in the future. Honor comes with a cost.

And what is our 'word'? That we insert and keep ourselves in the middle of an ancient feud that will never end?

You're making a great argument for not involving ourselves in internecine conflicts in the first place.

I fully agree. After all they've cost us we should know better by now.

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
Allowing the Turks to massacre the Kurds, who have been our most loyal allies through the War on Terror?  Yeah, that't the ticket.

Donald Trump, please step down and allow Pence to govern.

@catfish1957 this is more of the Rand Paul radical Libertarian isolationist influence we're beginning to see take hold.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
How much blood have we shed with the Kurds? The article says that they've lost over 11,000 fighters, but I didn't see ours.

They've been our fiercest allies on the war on terror and at the tail end of the Obama Administration straight through to now it appears...we're going to reward their loyalty as an ally and a fighting force by leaving them to be slaughtered by the Turks.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2019, 11:11:11 AM by txradioguy »
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline DB

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 6,147
And what is our 'word'? That we insert and keep ourselves in the middle of an ancient feud that will never end?

You're making a great argument for not involving ourselves in internecine conflicts in the first place.

I fully agree. After all they've cost us we should know better by now.

There's plenty to debate whether we should have given our word in the first place - but we did. Either we honor it or we don't.

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
Turkey's Syria incursion may allow ISIS to attempt mass prison break amid US withdrawal, Kurdish fighters warn

https://www.foxnews.com/world/turkey-syria-isis-mass-prison-break-us-withdrawal
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline OfTheCross

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 739
Sooo.... I guess this means we'll also be (finally) pulling completely out of Afghanistan, as well.   Right?

Wouldn't it be nice?

I would like a responsible draw-down, though.
If a well-regulated militia be the most natural defense of a free country, it ought certainly to be under the regulation and at the disposal of that body which is constituted the guardian of the national security.

Online XenaLee

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 12,121
  • Pray for peace but train for war.
@catfish1957 this is more of the Rand Paul radical Libertarian isolationist influence we're beginning to see take hold.

And speaking of radical isolationist influence.... 

Quote
"We would prefer to die of starvation than to live under the oppression and occupation of others. If this decision is made by referendum and the reaction is to isolate us, let our people die,” Kurdistan President Masoud Barzani told Foreign Policy magazine in June.

https://www.rudaw.net/english/opinion/03092017

Time for unity in America! (better late than never)


Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
Wouldn't it be nice?

I would like a responsible draw-down, though.

Ok General...with all your military expertise...tell us what that looks like.

Go ahead...I'll wait.  :2popcorn:
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • ****
  • Posts: 18,984
  • Rule #39
And speaking of radical isolationist influence....

They don't want to live under the yoke of oppression as they did with Saddam. It would be worse with the Turks.

How is that statement any different than someone saying "give me Liberty or give me death!"?
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline OfTheCross

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 739
Ok General...with all your military expertise...tell us what that looks like.

Go ahead...I'll wait.  :2popcorn:

A smart man defers to a smarter man. How would you do it?

The Pentagon may have better answers than you or I, though.
If a well-regulated militia be the most natural defense of a free country, it ought certainly to be under the regulation and at the disposal of that body which is constituted the guardian of the national security.

Online XenaLee

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 12,121
  • Pray for peace but train for war.
They've been our fiercest alleis on the war on terror and at the tail end of the Obama Administration straight through to now it appears...we're going to reward their loyalty as an ally and a fighting force by leaving them to be slaughtered by the Turks.

I think it has been done before (HWBush).   They're probably getting used to it.

But logistically, how much good can a mere 1,000 soldiers do in an ongoing conflict like this?   And...if they're not doing that much good anyway, why are they even there?  It's an age-old can of worms that, if we really want to help, could be assisted the old fashioned way.  With US $$$ & arms. 
Time for unity in America! (better late than never)


Online XenaLee

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 12,121
  • Pray for peace but train for war.
They don't want to live under the yoke of oppression as they did with Saddam. It would be worse with the Turks.

How is that statement any different than someone saying "give me Liberty or give me death!"?

I'm not arguing.   Just saying.... they're tough SOBs that will fight to the death.  And.... they are quite accustomed to doing just that.
Time for unity in America! (better late than never)



Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf