Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria

[Formerly Once-Ler]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/oct/14/russian-shadow-falls-over-syria-as-kurds-open-door-for-assad
“Iran and Russia are the dominant foreign powers now,” said Arshan. “They will dictate terms in this region. Things have really changed.”

[TomSea]

World
Exclusive: U.S. Cedes Syrian City to Russia in Battlefield 'Handover' as Turkey Tries to Take It
By James LaPorta AND Tom O'Connor On 10/14/19 at 2:54 PM EDT

The U.S. military has begun a hasty exit from Syria's northern city of Manbij, and is set to help Russia establish itself there amid a Turkish attempt to defeat Kurdish-led, Pentagon-backed fighters at the strategic location, Newsweek has learned.

The U.S. was scheduled as of Monday to officially withdraw from Manbij within 24-hours, leaving the mostly Kurdish Syrian Democratic Forces behind as two rival factions—the Syrian government, backed by Russia and Iran, and the Turkey-backed Syrian insurgents opposed to it—sought to seize control of the strategic location. A senior Pentagon official told Newsweek that U.S. personnel, "having been in the area for longer, has been assisting the Russian forces to navigate through previously unsafe areas quickly."

"It is essentially a handover," the official said. "However, it's a quick out, not something that will include walk-throughs, etc., everything is about making out with as much as possible of our things while destroying any sensitive equipment that cannot be moved."

Read more at: https://www.newsweek.com/exclusive-washington-cede-syrian-city-russia-handover-turkey-tries-1465112

This sounds like, we really indeed, did handover this town, city to Russia.

...

Now it is Russia who is doing that, after US literally handed the town to Moscow in a synchronised move

https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1184062676353376256

[TomSea]

TomSea wrote:
"And we are admiting Trump was not truthful in saying ISIS was not defeated 100%.
Obama should have known better, Trump should have known better."

Tom, it is YOU who should "know better".

isis are but this season's bad apples that have fallen from islam's tree.
Before them was the taliban
And al queda
And many others before them.

Even if we were to kill every single one of them, there will be "a new crop" that springs up to take their place soon afterwards.

And this isn't going to change until we "cut down the tree".
You DO know what "that tree" is, don't you, Tom...?

I am not talking "philosophy here", we are talking about a specific country that is about the size of Florida and ISIS was not 100% defeated there. Your criticism should be at the President, not me then.  One can throw in this "all Muslims are bad" view in about every thread here.

Let's see, who had 2 World Wars that killed millions? And the USSR dictatorship that killed millions?  Europeans?

[TomSea]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/oct/14/russian-shadow-falls-over-syria-as-kurds-open-door-for-assad
“Iran and Russia are the dominant foreign powers now,” said Arshan. “They will dictate terms in this region. Things have really changed.”

We draw into our shell, Iran and Russia are the powers, the Kurds mad at us and disappointed too, Turkey mad at us as well as rampaging in Syria, who knows what they might be doing in Turkey. Turkey has valid concerns as some previous posts show.  Let's not fool ourselves and let's not just vilify them. There is a lot of blame to go around.

This Kurdish General Mazloum is PKK per this twitterer. Mazloum has been in a number of stories, I think I saw him interviewed:

Ragıp Soylu
@ragipsoylu
My a few cents:

• President of the United States directly talked to a leader of PKK, Ferdi Abdi Şahin (General Mazloum). Let that sink in after Trump’s acknowledgment that PKK was a US partner force while designated.

• How will US mediate while taking a clear side with YPG?

https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/status/1183988670929522689

And again, Brett McGurk helped put this original deal together to fight ISIS and ISIS was largely beaten, not 100% but ISIS was defeated, Assad didn't do it, Russia, Hezbollah and Iran didn't really do it either.

There was Obama's red line not to cross....so, it was crossed and things weren't done, there certainly is no one party to lay blame on.

It's all a plateful, what we are doing, we expanded our base in Iraq, we can just wait and see what develops.

So, we are in Iraq and Saudi Arabia, I can definitely see the point, that we don't need to be everywhere....

Had to add this, here is that General Mazloum:

Kurdistan 24 English
@K24English
Monday’s discussion marked the first time that Donald Trump has ever spoken with the Kurdish commander. It also seemed that Trump did a bit of mediating between the #SDF and Turkey. #TwitterKurds @VP
 @aykan_erdemir

https://twitter.com/K24English/status/1184010035283877889
US President Donald Trump (left) spoke on Oct. 14, 2019, with Gen. Mazloum Abdi, the head of the Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF). (Photo: Kurdistan 24)

Story here: https://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/0fbfcec5-0003-47f5-923b-b073d2a52d2b

Anyway, Ragip Soylu   brought up some good points...why weren't we more critical of Saudi Arabia and the Khashoggi murder? Or why are we pretty easy on Egypt with the said repression there? I'm not taking up the points, Soylu, the journalist above said that and he's got some right in what he is saying.

"My favorite dictator", that's not to be critical of Trump, it's a bad, bad area of the world.  It sort of makes sense to say even.

[TomSea]

Just adding that in.

If it wasn't Russia but say, France or UK that was taking up the slack in Syria and we said, France/UK, you can be in charge of things in Syria, we'll stick with Iraq and Saudi Arabia and our good friend Israel, most people wouldn't see much wrong with that.

[Right_in_Virginia]

What's your point, Tom?  Are we now supposed to be fighting Russia?

[Right_in_Virginia]

Mitch said today and he said last week, they already have a super-majority to pass these bills.  He said that about last Thursday and he's since reiterated this.

Funny thing, the Democratic system! 

McConnell, who did not mention Trump by name, said Monday that the withdrawal of troops would not help the U.S.'s long-term interest in the region. He reiterated that earlier this year a bipartisan supermajority of senators supported legislation warning against the early withdrawal of U.S. troops from Syria and Afghanistan.

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/14/mitch-mcconnell-syria-conflict-046690

@Right_in_Virginia

Oh well, Trump can probably count on Rand Paul and Mike Lee and Tulsi Gabbard in the House.

SUPER MAJORITY BABY! WOOO!

Why do you want us at war with Syria, Tom?

[Right_in_Virginia]

Here's a tweet you should be interested in, Tom.

[Right_in_Virginia]

I am not talking "philosophy here", we are talking about a specific country that is about the size of Florida and ISIS was not 100% defeated there. Your criticism should be at the President, not me then.  One can throw in this "all Muslims are bad" view in about every thread here.

Let's see, who had 2 World Wars that killed millions? And the USSR dictatorship that killed millions?  Europeans?

You do know the ISIS mopping up is recapturing those that escaped, most of whom are family members.  And you do know Syria's going to kill them this time, don't you, Tom?

[Right_in_Virginia]

Really?  The Kurds released exactly the prisoners most likely to kill Kurds and think of Turks as allies?

Can you think of a better way to get American troops back on site @Cyber Liberty  If so, what would that be?

[sneakypete]

Another poster on one of these threads mentioned that we ducked out on Viet Nam.

@InHeavenThereIsNoBeer 

Speaking as a VN veteran who was on the ground there,it was long overdue. Our political "leadership" never intended to win there to start with. LBJ sent troops to VN for domestic political reasons,and didn't truly give a squat if they won or not. He just wanted to look tough on communism for votes and campaign contributions.

The Dim leadership after LBJ were worse because many of them were active communist agents who actively worked to PREVENT us from winning. People like Senator William Fullbright,Bubba Clinton's political rabbi. He was suspected of actually sending battle plans to the enemy. The truth is,it COULD have been proven,but as the ranking Dim in the Senate there was no way in HELL any charges were ever going to be brought against him because the DNC placed party loyalty over loyalty to America or our Constitution. They still do,but are more open about it today.

The Soviets infiltrated the Dim Party back in the 30's,and their influence just got stronger with every decade that passed. King Franklin and his commie wife/cousin are prime examples,with his devotion to his "Uncle Joe" practically being shouted from the roof of the WH.

Since all we were going to do there was get more American military members killed or crippled for life while keeping the union jobs in the defense industry working overtime,we needed to leave.

NEVER fight a war when the original plan is to,at BEST,fight to a draw. If you don't plan on winning the damn thing,don't get involved in it!

Were promises made to the Syrian Kurds?

 

Don't know,don't care. What I do know is that promises WERE made to American voters and they never meant to keep them.

[TomSea]

Why do you want us at war with Syria, Tom?

I am for keeping peace in Syria. Looks like that didn't happen.

Why do you want to see ISIS rise again? Why do you want to abandon the allies who defeated ISIS?  Why are you plugging for Obama II ?  At least, on this issue.

If that's how you carry on conversation, I can do the same.

Yeah, and I don't believe in abandoning people to genocide either. 

If the MSM is honest, that's part of Obama's legacy.

Let's see, is one for giving Iran more power? That kind of flies in the face of all of our Iran-chatter as well. We helped them seize more power.

[TomSea]

Is this widespread? Or could CNN just be trying to card stack this case?

Washington (CNN)A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.

Several US military and defense officials, including personnel deployed to Syria, expressed dismay at how the Trump administration has handled the situation.

One US official said it is well known that some senior US military officials are livid at how the Kurds have been treated given their role in helping the US fight ISIS.

Read more at:     US troops express anger at Trump's Syria policy: 'We betrayed' the Kurds - CNN

[skeeter]

Is this widespread? Or could CNN just be trying to card stack this case?

Project Veritas' latest project should answer that question. Jeff Zucker is on a personal crusade.

[Cyber Liberty]

Can you think of a better way to get American troops back on site @Cyber Liberty  If so, what would that be?

I don't know about "better," but I can't think of a worse way to do it.

[TomSea]

This is what happens when America does most of the heavy lifting, okay, France, UK sent troops in. UN Blue Helmets could have maybe been in there too.

Speaking of, the Blue Helmets do go to places and in my opinion, the UN does do some good with "peacekeepers". I'll say, this is a difficult situation and actually, one of a number of hot spots in the world.

Maybe next time, Nations can get it together to try to make sure, this does not happen ahead of time.

Galling, the Kurds have gotten this bad deal so often.

[TomSea]

I am inclined to believe the Turks.

Side with the side that oppresses Christians, committed genocide against them in the past.

I'm shocked, absolutely shocked!

 

But our soldiers trust these guys, hmmn...     

It is even an open secret that Jihadists are working with Turkey, yeah, let's believe them... or is it Barak Hussein Trump?

[TomSea]

By the way, the Pentagon has assessed Turkey or Turk-backed Jihadists did it.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/10/14/turkish-backed-forces-freeing-islamic-state-prisoners-syria/
.
So, one believes the Turks over the US Pentagon, okay, it takes all kinds.

How surprising, this is just trolling the thread.

[TomSea]

US troops in anguish as the White House and Pentagon give their Kurdish allies the middle finger
Jeff Schogol     October 13, 2019

For U.S. service members who have fought alongside the Kurds, President Donald Trump's decision to approve repositioning U.S. forces in Syria ahead of Turkey's invasion is a naked betrayal of valued allies.

"I am ashamed for the first time in my career," one unnamed special operator told Fox News Jennifer Griffin.

In a Twitter thread that went viral, Griffin wrote the soldier told her the Kurds were continuing to support the United States by guarding tens of thousands of ISIS prisoners even though Turkey had nullified an arrangement under which U.S. and Turkish troops were conducting joint patrols in northeastern Syria to allow the Kurdish People's Protection Units, or YPG, to withdraw.

Read more at: https://taskandpurpose.com/troops-anguish-kurdish-allies

We already saw this posted but another story.

[TomSea]

You do know the ISIS mopping up is recapturing those that escaped, most of whom are family members.  And you do know Syria's going to kill them this time, don't you, Tom?

No, I haven't seen that in the news anywhere.  At least, not as stated, yes, I know many family members escaped too.

You may well mean "The Syrian Army mopping up" or something, that statement,"ISIS mopping up is recapturing..." does not make sense, you might have said the wrong party or left out words.  Nothing wrong with that.

It it is meant, a mop up of ISIS, there are stories too, that undoubtedly, Jihadists are on Turkey's side.

The enemy of my enemy is my friend, it's hard to say ISIS is the enemy of Turkey, as if they are going to be mopped up by Syria or even Russia, but the matter is complex, I give the benefit of the doubt to the president over that.

Wladimir
@vvanwilgenburg
·
53m
Friend from Kobani send me this: "Trump is lying. If the US is not going to protect the Kurds, they should leave. They have sold us to Turkey, do they want us and our children to be killed by the jihadis? The militia who are attacking #Kobani are not FSA, they are ISIS."

https://twitter.com/vvanwilgenburg/status/1184154413272727552

This may be false but what is true, is a Jihadist is a Jihadist.

Lara Seligman
@laraseligman
Just in: SDC’s US representative tells me Turkish backed forces are attacking Kobani and kidnapping civilians - despite Erdogan’s commitment to Trump yesterday that he would NOT attack the town

https://twitter.com/laraseligman/status/1184151178835308544

https://twitter.com/vvanwilgenburg

[libertybele]

Says the isolationist idiot

 

[TomSea]

Qatar today, along with Hamas of all people, came out supporting the Turkish invasion today.

al Jazeera comes from Qatar, al Jazeera is said to be biased towards the Muslim Brotherhood which Hamas and probably Qatar are.  So, al Jazeera comes out with this article on "Who is the SDF?", I still think it's worth reading though, one could say, it is kind of a smear job on the SDF, it's for everyone to gather as many facts as possible. I'd like to see a response to this:

Who are the Syrian Democratic Forces?

The US-backed SDF is mostly made up of YPG fighters which Turkey considers a 'terror group' linked to the PKK.

Turkey launched its long-threatened military operation into northern Syria last week marking Ankara's third major cross-border offensive since 2016.

Ankara says the "Operation Peace Spring" aims to remove Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) from northern Syrian region bordering Turkey and create a so-called "safe zone" where millions of Syrian refugees can be resettled. Turkey hosts about 3.6 million Syrian refugees who have fled the nearly eight-year-old civil war.

Ankara considers the Kurdish People's Protection Group (YPG), which forms the backbone of the SDF, a "terrorist" group linked to Kurdish separatist group Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), inside Turkey. PKK is designated as a "terrorist group" by the United States and the European Union.

Read more at: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2019/10/syrian-democratic-forces-191015080247945.html

al Araby, al Araby, The New Arab also comes out of Qatar, by the same people I think but was created to not have these same kinds of biases.

[sneakypete]

In a Twitter thread that went viral, Griffin wrote the soldier told her the Kurds were continuing to support the United States by guarding tens of thousands of ISIS prisoners ....

So the Kurds were actually protecting the US????

WOW! Who knew?

[Right_in_Virginia]

I am for keeping peace in Syria. Looks like that didn't happen.

Why do you want to see ISIS rise again? Why do you want to abandon the allies who defeated ISIS?  Why are you plugging for Obama II ?  At least, on this issue.

What are you talking about @TomSea ?????  Obama blew apart Syria.  President Trump is putting it back together.

Why do you oppose this?

[txradioguy]

Is this widespread? Or could CNN just be trying to card stack this case?

No this is the broken clock/blind squirrel analogy coming into play.

CNN has stumbled onto a legitimate issue.  Yes there are soldiers across the miltiary as well inside the WH and the Pentagon that are furious at Trump's retreat.

Trump's knee jerk decision played into CNN's TDS with this one.