Author Topic: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria  (Read 24696 times)

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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #400 on: October 13, 2019, 10:56:51 pm »

Its why I stopped buying W Bush etc line about fighting them over there while he and others endorsed bringing over all comers without any regard to who they are and what they believe.

@skeeter

You didn't realize that Boy Jorge was bending over and grabbing his ankles for (then) Prince Abdullah? Seriously? There were photos of them kissing each other on the mouth all over the place.

Hell,Saddam Hussein was an ally of America,and was responsible for killing more fundie Muslims that everybody else combined,and then one day the Sauds decided he was a threat to them and needed to be whacked,so they whispered "sic 'em!" in Boy Jorge's shell like ear,and suddenly,overnight,Hussein became an enemy and a danger.
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Kurdish forces formerly under US protection forge deal with Russian and Iranian-backed Syrian regime
by Zachary Halaschak
 | October 13, 2019 05:36 PM



The Kurdish forces the United States fought the Islamic State alongside are now turning to the Syrian government for help after Defense Secretary Mark Esper announced an evacuation of most U.S. troops in the country.

The Syrian Democratic Forces, a majority Kurdish group based in northeast Syria, has reportedly struck a deal with Syrian strongman Bashar Assad. As part of the deal, forces loyal to Assad will fill the vacuum left by the U.S. and return to Kurdish parts of the country for the first time in seven years.

The agreement was forged in order to protect the Kurds from Turkey, which has launched a military incursion against them after President Trump cleared the way for Turkey to do so by relocating troops.

Assad is supported by both Iran and Russia, and his government forces have been accused of committing numerous atrocities, including chemical weapons attacks against civilians.

The Pentagon chief announced Sunday that the U.S. was evacuating about 1,000 troops from northern Syria

“In the last 24 hours, we learned that [the Turks] likely intend to expand their attack further south than originally planned, and to the west,” Esper said Sunday on CBS's Face The Nation. “We also have learned in the last 24 hours that the ... SDF are looking to cut a deal, if you will, with the Syrians and the Russians to counterattack against the Turks in the north.

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/kurdish-forces-formerly-under-us-protection-forge-deal-with-russian-and-iranian-backed-syrian-regime
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #402 on: October 13, 2019, 11:00:44 pm »
Quote
I agree we should not "be like them," but IIRC, we and Japan took prisoners during WW2,
 

@Cyber Liberty

We took damn few Japanese prisoners during WW-2. US Marines and US Army soldiers tried at first,but quit trying after each surrender turned out to be an ambush instead. Yeah,they would take one as a prisoner if he were unconscious from a concussion or something,but if he looked healthy and came out with his arms up,they were going to shoot him and ask questions later.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #403 on: October 13, 2019, 11:02:26 pm »
George W Bush was/is an idiot.

@jpsb

And a male whore pimped out to the Sauds by his mother. She was the brains in the family,and the one that gave the marching orders.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #404 on: October 13, 2019, 11:08:04 pm »
@sneakypete

@jpsb


Quote
Because he gave permission to Turkey's ErdoÄŸan to invade Syria so the Turks would wipe out the Kurds.

Really? Where did you hear that fairy tale,"The View"? Is there a list of other foreign countries that won't invade their neighbors until we give them permission?

Do they take tickets and participate in a raffle?

Enquiring minds,and all dat.

Quote
Bigest betrayal of an ally since we let the Vet-con slaughter our S. Vietnam allies. And he is facing and intense
black lash from both just about everyone except the Always Trumpers.

What an odd way to say "The anti-American left."

Quote
At the very moment he needs all thesupport he can get he pulls off a foreign policy disaster. And for what, Turkey? Screw Turkey. This might very
well cost him his presidency.

Ah kin feel yore pain!
 
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Offline TomSea

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #405 on: October 13, 2019, 11:10:14 pm »
So, the Russians might set up a no-fly zone? Why couldn't we... I know the Russians are there because of Assad but still:
Quote
Babak Taghvaee
@BabakTaghvaee
·
43m
#BREAKING: #Russia has not yet established No-Fly Zone over NE #Syria due to the fact that withdrawal of #US SOF is Now delayed for another 12 hours! Tomorrow when #Syria Arab Army will start its offensive against #Turkish Army & its terrorists, No-Fly zone might be established!




https://twitter.com/BabakTaghvaee/status/1183504515850473474

Turk written editorial in the NY Times today (Ted Cruz wrote a one time opinion piece too, for WaPo or the NYT, so did Rubio, I guess as these are probably the countries largest newspapers, they publish these kinds of things):

Quote
Opinion | Why Turkey Took the Fight to Syria
By Mevlut Cavusoglu
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/11/opinion/turkey-syria-military-operation.html

Quote
Joyce Karam
@Joyce_Karam
Surreal week covering #Syria. Reflecting on conflict, some Qs:

• What did half million Syrian die for?
• Who draws the borders in Mideast?
• What does US stand for in region?
• What are the rules of invasions and ethnic transfers?
• Where are we headed?

No easy answers...


https://twitter.com/Joyce_Karam/status/1183502291850223616

Square miles, Syria is around the size of Florida, unbelievable about this war.

Some reports say the CHRISTIANS are in fact, happy that they are submitting to the Damascus government, maybe the CHRISTIANS benefit from all of this.  This is of course, unconfirmed, you know, retweets don't mean endorsement.

Quote
Pullback Leaves Green Berets Feeling ‘Ashamed,’ and Kurdish Allies Describing ‘Betrayal’
By Eric Schmitt, Thomas Gibbons-Neff, Ben Hubbard and Helene Cooper


Kurdish troops in the Syrian town of Manbij, near the border with Turkey, at a front-line position last year.CreditCreditIvor Prickett for The New York Times

    Oct. 13, 2019Updated 6:22 p.m. ET

WASHINGTON — American commandos were working alongside Kurdish forces at an outpost in eastern Syria last year when they were attacked by columns of Syrian government tanks and hundreds of troops, including Russian mercenaries. In the next hours, the Americans threw the Pentagon’s arsenal at them, including B-52 strategic bombers. The attack was stopped.

That operation, in the middle of the American-led campaign against the Islamic State in Syria, showed the extent to which the United States military was willing to protect the Syrian Kurds, its main ally on the ground.

But now, with the White House revoking protection for these Kurdish fighters, some of the Special Forces officers who battled alongside the Kurds say they feel deep remorse at orders to abandon their allies.


More at:  https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/13/world/middleeast/kurds-syria-turkey-trump.html

Quote
Joyce Karam
@Joyce_Karam
Who does US withdrawal benefit in #Syria ?

1- Russia (boosts Putin,  outreach to Kurds inc SDF)
2- ISIS (biggest threat)
3- Assad (takeover US areas)
4- Iran (land bridge and influence)
5- Turkey (operate freely in NE)


https://twitter.com/Joyce_Karam/status/1183392822537474048

We drop the ball big time, at least, maybe we won't be in the "endless war", sad, and we will remain in Iraq, I'm not really all that happy with being in Saudi Arabia though, SA is probably reforming some.

OKAY, here it is:
Quote

Iraqi Christian Foundation

@iraqschristians
Syrian Christians in Northeast #Syria confirm they oppose the Kurdish-YPG militia & have been held hostage by YPG. Syrian Christians pray the YPG terrorists will finally be forced out & that the Syrian Army will take control of the area. Keep #SyrianChristians in your prayers.
🙏


https://twitter.com/iraqschristians/status/1183416398502121473

Unfortunately, the biggest cause of the problems over there probably is Assad but for Christians, he probably is best for them from all of my research, not that he necessarily adores them but minority groups, the Druze too, probably are helpful against the Sunni masses.  Assad probably has aided forces that have hurt Americans, definitely so, so we will see.

#syria for more.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #406 on: October 13, 2019, 11:11:35 pm »
One might watch this woman, Jenan Moussa, video, she's actually been going into areas afflicted, I take it this is all authentic, I almost fear for her safety:


https://twitter.com/jenanmoussa/status/1183469412592050176

What a brave, tough, lovely lady!   :0001: :0001: :0001: :0001: :0001:

Why can't we have reporters like that? 
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #407 on: October 13, 2019, 11:19:32 pm »
That's a very good point and there is no guarantee the Kurdish government would prosecute war crimes against Kurdish guards who shot their ISIS POWs.  For all we know they did shoot some or even most of them while they report a couple hundred fled.  I don't know how many prisoners they had.

Knowing how many prisoners we're talking about would sure be nice, but we can't get straight reporting in the best of times, let alone in a fresh and highly active war zone.  Still, it seems to me that if my position is being overrun by the enemy, I'd want to make sure all the people with fresh grudges against me are too dead to act upon them. 

Maybe it's harsh of me, since I have no soldier experience as do some of my friends here, but I'd put in overtime making sure every POW I've been guarding is dead (especially if I've been a cruel turnkey).  Those folks will stab me with a set of nail-clippers if they had the chance.

I am but a keyboard kommando, I'm a fish out of water trying to grasp what I would do in such a circumstance.  I must defer to folks like @txradioguy.
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Offline roamer_1

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #408 on: October 13, 2019, 11:25:24 pm »
I'd say we'd not hold Turkey's coat while they do it, no.  We would have to pick which Ally to side with, which is probably why George Washington thought of alliances as "entangling."

We have conflicting alliances all over the damned world, nowhere worse than in the ME and SW Asia.  Is this tenable?

The very same as between Turkey and the Kurds. Seems to me, the dreams of an earstwhile companion should not outweigh the companion whose blood mingles with ours in realtime... Not to mention bringing another army into a volatile situation.

What a mistake - Both tactically, and far more importantly, morally.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #409 on: October 13, 2019, 11:26:53 pm »
 


@Cyber Liberty

We took damn few Japanese prisoners during WW-2. US Marines and US Army soldiers tried at first,but quit trying after each surrender turned out to be an ambush instead. Yeah,they would take one as a prisoner if he were unconscious from a concussion or something,but if he looked healthy and came out with his arms up,they were going to shoot him and ask questions later.

@sneakypete

That is my understanding of the warfare of that time.  My Pappy was Navy in that Theater, and a "bus-driver," but he was close enough to understand it was Hell, and prisoners were a problem when the enemy is trained to pretend to surrender.  I'd probably shoot them too, because if I didn't get killed, my company would.

This was similar to Nam that way, and in the 60's-70's we had a lot of squeamish civilians here in the states that had no understanding of how difficult it can be to identify dangerous people in these situations.  How many buddies would I have to watch die before I acquire the "Let God sort them out" mentality?  It's beyond my ability to grasp, being so far removed from my life's experiences.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 11:32:04 pm by Cyber Liberty »
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #410 on: October 13, 2019, 11:31:36 pm »
The very same as between Turkey and the Kurds. Seems to me, the dreams of an earstwhile companion should not outweigh the companion whose blood mingles with ours in realtime... Not to mention bringing another army into a volatile situation.

What a mistake - Both tactically, and far more importantly, morally.

This combined blood being shed is why I feel my true friend on TBR is so bloody pissed at Trump right now.  Together we've shed blood ridding ourselves of the scourge of Daesh, and I would be more than a little upset at seeing my friends betrayed, as appears to be what's happening.

It goes on the negative side of the Trump Balance Sheet.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #411 on: October 13, 2019, 11:32:34 pm »

 It's beyond my ability to grasp, being so far removed from my life's experiences.

@Cyber Liberty

It was also beyond the grasp of many of the people who served there in combat roles.
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Offline roamer_1

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #412 on: October 13, 2019, 11:37:16 pm »
This combined blood being shed is why I feel my true friend on TBR is so bloody pissed at Trump right now.  Together we've shed blood ridding ourselves of the scourge of Daesh, and I would be more than a little upset at seeing my friends betrayed, as appears to be what's happening.

It goes on the negative side of the Trump Balance Sheet.

That's damn well right. Goes to show why it is so important to listen to Defense Conservatives, and elect people to office that know honor and duty personally... That they will not make grievous mistakes like thing one.

Offline TomSea

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #413 on: October 13, 2019, 11:38:24 pm »
https://twitter.com/Sara__Firth



This lady, Sara Firth was in Egypt last  I knew, so she is pretty sharp too. She is from the UK.

Over the summer, a movie was made about Marie Colvin:   

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_Colvin

Perhaps, I'll see the movie some time.  Who knows. The situation is fowled up over there. Just observing.

I'm very sorry for all who have died in that war, died, injured and so on. Well, I'm not sorry for ISIS and Jihadists who have but you get the picture.  A lot of innocents have died.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #414 on: October 13, 2019, 11:53:02 pm »
https://twitter.com/Sara__Firth



This lady, Sara Firth was in Egypt last  I knew, so she is pretty sharp too. She is from the UK.

Over the summer, a movie was made about Marie Colvin:   

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_Colvin

Perhaps, I'll see the movie some time.  Who knows. The situation is fowled up over there. Just observing.

I'm very sorry for all who have died in that war, died, injured and so on. Well, I'm not sorry for ISIS and Jihadists who have but you get the picture.  A lot of innocents have died.

With more to come, @TomSea.   8888crybaby
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Offline TomSea

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #415 on: October 13, 2019, 11:54:57 pm »
If one reads a number of the websites I have posted, a lot of Russians have been killed over there, a fair number at least.

We lose enough in Afghanistan .

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #416 on: October 13, 2019, 11:58:25 pm »
@Cyber Liberty

It was also beyond the grasp of many of the people who served there in combat roles.

I had a very good friend who fought in the Pacific in WWII.

He said they killed everybody at the end. EVERYBODY.

Did he like it? No.

You could see the horror in his eyes when he spoke of it.

That is the way it was.

He spent 6 months in a reeducation center in Australia to retrain him how to be a "normal" person instead of a psychotic killer.

It took him years before the urge to kill any oriental on sight left him.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 12:02:03 am by bigheadfred »
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Offline FeelNoPain

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #417 on: October 14, 2019, 12:09:53 am »
That's damn well right. Goes to show why it is so important to listen to Defense Conservatives, and elect people to office that know honor and duty personally... That they will not make grievous mistakes like thing one.

Agreed.
But when a man makes proclamations of having "great and unmatched wisdom" and "knowing more than the generals" this is what we get.
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I'm sure I'll be told this is a good thing. Which isn't.
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Offline TomSea

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Re: Esper: Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria
« Reply #419 on: October 14, 2019, 02:09:06 am »
It's like Trump has no concept of the world or is too ethnocentric.

Yeah, Kim, Xi, maybe these guys make a good impression on him.

It's not easy to judge but he's on my warning list, America has taken on a good direction but ISIS can return and I certainly feel bad for the Kurds and others who counted on us so much.

A black day, there are other circumstances, so we will see.

Offline Hoodat

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Re: Esper: Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria
« Reply #420 on: October 14, 2019, 02:22:07 am »
Quote
Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria

Ya think?  Didn't they also do something in Armenia a while back?
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Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: Esper: Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria
« Reply #421 on: October 14, 2019, 02:24:49 am »
Senate Democrat on Turkey sanctions: 'For God's sake, what are they waiting for?'
https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/465567-democratic-senator-on-turkey-sanctions-for-gods-sake-what-are-they

Punishing average Turkish citizens is going to have exactly what effect on the actions of their government?
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Esper: Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria
« Reply #422 on: October 14, 2019, 02:29:22 am »
Trump betrayed the Kurds in Syria. 

What did the President promise that was not delivered to "the Kurds" @jpsb ??

Asking for a friend.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria
« Reply #423 on: October 14, 2019, 02:31:07 am »
Agreed.
But when a man makes proclamations of having "great and unmatched wisdom" and "knowing more than the generals" this is what we get.


@WOW! I am just floored at the immense amount of knowledge  and personal experience with war that you must have to understand Trump's shortcomings so well!

 Who are you real life,Obomber?  Biden? Liewatha?

C'mon,fess up!
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Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Re: Esper: Turkey 'appears to be' committing war crimes in northern Syria
« Reply #424 on: October 14, 2019, 02:31:52 am »
Senate Democrat on Turkey sanctions: 'For God's sake, what are they waiting for?'
https://thehill.com/homenews/sunday-talk-shows/465567-democratic-senator-on-turkey-sanctions-for-gods-sake-what-are-they

Syria's now fighting Turkey.  Maybe we could stand outside the fray for a moment and see what happens with this turn of events.

Or can't we stand not to be in the center for even a moment?