Author Topic: Turkish Invasion of Northern Syria  (Read 13520 times)

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Offline kevindavis

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Re: Why isn’t the media covering Turkish President Erdogan’s ties to ISIS
« Reply #25 on: October 08, 2019, 12:08:34 PM »
Time to kick Turkey out of NATO.
"If we die, we want people to accept it. We're in a risky business, and we hope that if anything happens to us it will not delay the program. The conquest of space is worth the risk of life."

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Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #26 on: October 08, 2019, 12:10:50 PM »
Quote
World News
October 8, 2019
White House says Turkey's Erdogan to visit November 13

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan will visit the United States on Nov. 13 at the invitation of U.S. President Donald Trump, a White House spokesman said on Tuesday.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syria-security-turkey-usa-erdogan/white-house-says-turkeys-erdogan-to-visit-november-13-idUSKBN1WN1RU

Quick read, anyway, I will say it again, we don't want the Kurds, SDF to feel abandoned that they cut deals with Assad and Putin.  Maybe that's Neo-Connish but as the above Charles Lister says, over 5 years, a lot of progress has been made to just sort of throw it away in that manner.


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Offline txradioguy

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Re: Why isn’t the media covering Turkish President Erdogan’s ties to ISIS
« Reply #28 on: October 08, 2019, 12:56:59 PM »
Time to kick Turkey out of NATO.

They used to be a fairly reliable ally.  Then Erdogan came in and began to turn a thriving secular country into a Shria Law Islamic state that doesn't want to work with the other NATO allies and is helping ISIS.

I agree time for them to go.
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Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #29 on: October 08, 2019, 02:32:42 PM »
General Votel, who worked with the Kurds over there, is co-author. I believe, he has retired since, only this year.

Quote
The Danger of Abandoning Our Partners
Joseph Votel, Elizabeth Dent

The abrupt policy decision to seemingly abandon our Kurdish partners could not come at a worse time. The decision was made without consulting U.S. allies or senior U.S. military leadership and threatens to affect future partnerships at precisely the time we need them most, given the war-weariness of the American public coupled with ever more sophisticated enemies determined to come after us.

In northeastern Syria, we had one of the most successful partnerships. The Islamic State was using Syria as a sanctuary to support its operations in Iraq and globally, including by hosting and training foreign fighters. We had to go after ISIS quickly and effectively. The answer came in the form of a small band of Kurdish forces pinned up against the Turkish border and fighting for their lives against ISIS militants in the Syrian town of Kobane in 2014.

We had tried many other options first. The U.S. initially worked to partner with moderate Syrian rebel groups, investing $500 million in a train-and-equip program to build their capabilities to fight against ISIS in Syria. That endeavor failed, save for a small force in southeastern Syria near the American al-Tanf base, which began as a U.S. outpost to fight ISIS and remains today as a deterrent against Iran. So we turned to Turkey to identify alternative groups, but the Pentagon found that the force Turkey had trained was simply inadequate and would require tens of thousands of U.S. troops to bolster it in battle. With no public appetite for a full-scale U.S. ground invasion, we were forced to look elsewhere.

Read more at: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/10/danger-abandoning-our-partners/599632/

Pretty good "keeper" article here.

Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2019, 04:33:57 PM »
Joyce Karam wrote:

Quote
Joyce Karam
@Joyce_Karam
UPDATE: US - #Syria - Turkey

• US Blocks Turkey from Airspace
• White House WALKS BACK Trump Withdrawal comment
• US moving troops away from Turkey path but staying in Syria

• Mitch McConnell & Pelosi both criticize Trump approach

https://twitter.com/Joyce_Karam/status/1181318847787352064

Okay, I had not heard of that first one about blocking Turkey from airspace. So, see, there's a lot to learn....so, for me, one of the best things to do, is try and find a reliable source at the least. Still? What she  reported overall, doesn't look too good.

Karam is a professor additionally in DC, I think she is actually a Christian from somewhere over there.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2019, 04:48:46 PM by TomSea »

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2019, 04:45:16 PM »
Another article, no endorsement:

Quote

Yes, Donald Trump Dumped the Kurds (And We Should Not Be Shocked)

[The National Interest]  Ted Galen Carpenter •October 7, 2019

resident Trump has apparently decided to make a major shift in Washington’s policy regarding the Syrian Kurds. Instead of opposing Turkey’s use of force to clear out Kurdish- controlled territory in northern Syria, Washington now seems willing to step aside. That move would be a rather cynical betrayal of the Kurds, but not a surprising one.

Until now, Trump had largely continued the Obama administration’s policy of regarding Kurdish forces as useful military allies in Syria’s violent, multi-sided internecine conflict. In particular, Kurdish militias were quite effective in inflicting defeats on ISIS and other jihadi forces in northeastern Syria. The United States provided funding, training, and weaponry to Kurdish units, and seemed willing to look the other way as the Kurds pursued their political goal of establishing a de facto autonomous region in northern Syria similar to the entity their brethren in Iraq have maintained since the early 1990s.

...

Read more at: https://news.yahoo.com/yes-donald-trump-dumped-kurds-000000464.html

Another good read, despite the depressing title, Hey! Who knew this from the article:

Quote
In 1973, President Richard Nixon made a secret agreement with the Shah of Iran to begin providing covert financial and military support to Kurds in Iraq who had launched an insurgency against Saddam Hussein, seeking to establish an independent Kurdistan in northern Iraq. (Saddam had angered U.S. leaders earlier that year by signing a Treaty of Friendship and Cooperation with Moscow.) Kurdish officials conducted planning sessions in Washington with the Central Intelligence Agency, and CIA agents assisted Kurdish Peshmerga militia units to harass Saddam’s forces.

That's something, I can envisage Saddam was around back then but still, and Nixon was president at the time and acted?  That's pretty long ago but Gaddafy came to power around 1968-69. So, it shouldn't be that surprising.

Offline mystery-ak

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Turkey says it will cross into Syria 'shortly,' issues warning to Kurdish fighters
By Tal Axelrod - 10/08/19 08:05 PM EDT

The Turkish government said Tuesday that it will cross into northeastern Syria "shortly," and issued a warning to local Kurdish forces.

“The Turkish military, together with the Free Syrian Army, will cross the Turkish-Syrian border shortly. YPG militants have two options: They can defect or we will have [to] stop them from disrupting our counter-ISIS efforts,” Turkish government spokesperson Fahrettin Altun tweeted, referring to the Kurdish militia that has worked closely with the U.S. in the fight against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS).

more
https://thehill.com/policy/international/middle-east-north-africa/464949-turkey-says-it-will-cross-into-syria-shortly
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Offline jpsb

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LOL, Turkey armed and trained ISIS fighter. F Turkey

Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #34 on: October 08, 2019, 11:22:32 PM »
Quote
Middle East
Syrian Kurdish military leadership says Turkish attack is imminent
Wladimir van Wilgenburg

A Turkish army's tank drives down from a truck as Turkish armed forces drive towards the border with Syria near Akcakale in Sanliurfa province on October 8, 2019. (Photo: Bulent Kilic/AFP via Getty Images)

ERBIL (Kurdistan 24) – The Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) in a statement early on Wednesday warned that all signs indicate that the Turkish army and its allied forces would soon attack SDF points at the border.

“The border areas of northeast Syria are on the edge of a possible humanitarian catastrophe,” the General Command of the SDF said.

“All indications, field information, and military assembly on the Turkish side of the border indicate that our border areas will be attacked by Turkey in cooperation with Syrian opposition tied to Turkey.”

Read more at: https://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/222fcae2-8fce-4810-9d87-76772c75ed59

Quote
World
Noam Chomsky says US should stay in Syria to protect the Kurds
Wladimir van Wilgenburg     October 03-2018

The famous philosopher, linguist, thinker, political activist, historian, and author, Noam Chomsky. (Photo: Guardian/Graeme Roberston)

ERBIL (Kurdistan 24) – The US should stay in northern Syria to deter attacks against Syrian Kurds, well-known American linguist and political activist Noam Chomsky said in an interview with the Intercept last week.

“The other crucial question is the status of the Kurdish areas — Rojava. In my opinion, it makes sense for the United States to maintain a presence which would deter an attack on the Kurdish areas,” he said.

Chomsky noted that the Kurds have “succeeded in sustaining a functioning society with many decent elements” in Syria’s north.

https://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/13cf816e-8e40-41c8-bb76-d453a3261d8b

Quote
Syria Kurds, Assad regime hint at partnership against Turkish threat
Karwan Faidhi Dri

ERBIL, Kurdistan Region – Threatened by an imminent Turkish invasion from the north following Monday’s US withdrawal from the Syria-Turkey border, Syria’s Kurds and the regime of Bashar al-Assad in Damascus have separately hinted at possible coordination.

US President Donald Trump appeared to greenlight a long-threatened Turkish operation against the Kurdish-led Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) in northern Syria on Sunday night, despite the SDF’s role as America’s key ally in the ground war against the Islamic State group (ISIS). 

Ankara, a long-time backer of Syria’s armed opposition, appears primed and ready to invade territories east of the Euphrates River, where Kurds have built an autonomous administration of their own – independent of the Syrian regime.

Turkey considers the Kurdish People’s Protection Units (YPG) – the backbone of the SDF – as the Syrian offshoot of the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK), an armed group fighting the Turkish state for political and cultural rights for Kurds.

https://www.rudaw.net/english/middleeast/syria/081020192


Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #35 on: October 08, 2019, 11:41:09 PM »
Quote

Washington asserts “no green light for Turkey”, conspiracy talk rising in Baghdad

Washington has stressed that Trump's decision to withdraw troops does not mean a withdrawal from Syria and to give Turkey the green light to launch attacks on northern and eastern Syria, while Trump threatened to destroy Turkey's economy if it crossed the border, and conspiracy talk" is rising in Baghdad.


WORLD-Middle East 08 Oct 2019, Tue - 10:37 2019-10-08T10:37:00 NEWS DESK

The Arab press- this morning- dealt with the Syrian situation, in addition to the Iraqi demonstrations and the battles in Libya.

Al-Bayan: Washington: Trump's decision to withdraw troops does not represent a withdrawal from Syria

Arab newspapers published this morning on the Syrian issue several topics, most notably the Turkish threats to launch attacks on the north and east of Syria, in this context, the statement said "a senior US official on Monday noted that President Donald Trump's decision to withdraw US troops stationed in Syria near the Turkish border only about 50 to 100 special forces soldiers "will be transferred to other bases" inside Syria.

"This is not about a withdrawal from Syria," the official said, stressing that the redeployment does not in any way give a "green light" to a Turkish military operation against Kurdish forces in northeastern Syria.

Read more at: https://www.hawarnews.com/en//haber/washington-asserts-no-green-light-for-turkey-conspiracy-talk-rising-in-baghdad-h11869.html

 :shrug:  Sure got our signals crossed on this, well, if Turkey invades, it could happen at any time, it could be a bit of a bluff too but, I wouldn't think so. They probably will act in the next 24 hours I'd say.

One Kurd news agency said 100 ISIS fighters attacked Raqqa (the former ISIS capital in Syria).... but we'll see when the real news starts coming in.

Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #36 on: October 09, 2019, 05:56:51 AM »
Quote
Wladimir
@vvanwilgenburg
It seems the US forces on the ground are in solidarity with the SDF. Although they had to remove the tweet later (1)

https://twitter.com/vvanwilgenburg/status/1181868433933291521

Quote
NORTH PRESS AGENCY
@NPA_SY
#BREAKING:
A U.S. patrol of six armored vehicles headed to the city of Kobani, to prevent any possible military attack, there.

https://twitter.com/NPA_SY/status/1181867750400114689

Quote
Coordination & Military Ops Center - SDF
@cmoc_sdf
·
10h
BREAKING NEWS:
#Daesh takes advantage of Imminent #Turkish invasion
3x #ISIS suicide bombings on our military positions in Raqqa, clashes still ongoing

https://twitter.com/cmoc_sdf/status/1181707512577441792

Yes, looks like ISIS/Daesh hit Raqqa per the previous post.  And are exploiting the confusion that is going on.

Quote
CNW
@ConflictsW
A number of ISIS militants are exploiting the new security situation in North East Syria and have launched a massive attack in Raqqa and are attempting to take control of the city from within. Gun battles between the SDF and ISIS are taking place in the streets
#Syria #Turkey

https://twitter.com/ConflictsW/status/1181714476040622081

Really, some of the other bigger powers should have stepped in, if we are stepping down...
« Last Edit: October 09, 2019, 06:07:07 AM by TomSea »

Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2019, 06:59:41 AM »
Then, there is this angle, some "Trump Tower" in Istanbul and before going further, the Trump towers in Istanbul have more of a "licensing agreement", not exactly "Trump" ownership, read about it here. I had a few days ago, the Trump organization website but in the meantime, maybe that will inform one.

Newsweek:



The left, Mojo:

Quote
Reminder: Trump Has a Massive Conflict of Interest in Turkey
Why a Trump real estate deal is relevant to his decision to abandon the Kurds.
    Russ Choma   Reporter

Late Sunday night, the Trump administration announced that US troops would be pulling back from their positions northern Syria, allowing Turkey to move into a region controlled by Kurdish forces that had fought with the US against ISIS. Trump’s announcement is a big win for Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, and it has already enraged many in American national security circles—including Trump allies—who say it reverses years of US policy. Kurdish leaders are being more blunt, saying it qualifies as a betrayal.
“I have a little conflict of interest ’cause I have a major, major building in Istanbul.”

Whatever else it may be, Trump’s policy toward Turkey is also a significant conflict of interest, as Trump himself has admitted. In 2015, while running for president, Trump gave an interview to Stephen Bannon, not yet his campaign manager, in which he talked about Turkey. Right away, he admitted that his business interests in the country would make it difficult for him to deal with Turkey with a clear mind.

“I have a little conflict of interest ’cause I have a major, major building in Istanbul,” Trump told Bannon during a Breitbart radio show. “It’s a tremendously successful job. It’s called Trump Towers—two towers, instead of one, not the usual one, it’s two.”

Read more at: https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2019/10/reminder-trump-has-a-massive-conflict-of-interest-in-turkey/

I brushed off concern, but I wonder....  he should know better and stay away from this.

So, from fees, $900,000 a year he seems to bring in from this.

Online TomSea

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #38 on: October 09, 2019, 07:26:59 AM »
Reportedly, can't tell how solid a lot of this information really is:

Quote
EHA News
@eha_news

#BREAKING #Turkish Troops Are Now Crossing Into #Syria, Government Official tells Bloomberg

https://twitter.com/eha_news/status/1181847421149749248

Quote
Syrian Christians to US: ‘Don’t Abandon Us Now’
After surviving a civil war and ISIS attacks, the Christian minority fears a Turkish takeover in Kurdish border region.

Jayson Casper
October 08, 2019 12:31 PM

https://www.christianitytoday.com/news/2019/october/syrian-christians-kurds-us-withdrawal-turkey.html


Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2019, 08:41:57 AM »
Sumbodie riddle me this.

Isn't the whole PURPOSE of the United Nations to hold a united front to keep nations from invading each other,and to insure peace?

IF it is,WHY are US and other western troops there patrolling,or doing anything else? If the UN would do what it is SUPPOSED to do,they could stop the fighting by placing immediate embargoes on tourism,foreign aid,and trade with any nation that invades another by proxy or using their troops.

If the UN is going to be this ineffective,maybe we should shut down our cash flow to the UN until and unless they start doing what they were formed to do?

In this day of drones,electronic listening,electronic banking,etc,etc,etc,it is impossible for anyone to hide where the weapons,food,and fighters are coming from,and sanctions CAN be put on those nations. There is no need to add further deaths and tragedy to an already bad situation when we already have the power and the ability to shut this crap down with just a few key strokes.
It takes an special kind of "Stoopid" to make Trump look like a defenseless victim and gain public sympathy,but damned if the Dims didn't pull it off!

Offline txradioguy

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #40 on: October 09, 2019, 08:46:44 AM »
Sumbodie riddle me this.

Isn't the whole PURPOSE of the United Nations to hold a united front to keep nations from invading each other,and to insure peace?

IF it is,WHY are US and other western troops there patrolling,or doing anything else? If the UN would do what it is SUPPOSED to do,they could stop the fighting by placing immediate embargoes on tourism,foreign aid,and trade with any nation that invades another by proxy or using their troops.

If the UN is going to be this ineffective,maybe we should shut down our cash flow to the UN until and unless they start doing what they were formed to do?

In this day of drones,electronic listening,electronic banking,etc,etc,etc,it is impossible for anyone to hide where the weapons,food,and fighters are coming from,and sanctions CAN be put on those nations. There is no need to add further deaths and tragedy to an already bad situation when we already have the power and the ability to shut this crap down with just a few key strokes.

Because the UN is as corrupt and thuggish as any third world dictatorship. The only reason they’ve still got any credibility and/or legitimacy left is because of the US and a handful of other nations.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2019, 08:47:37 AM by txradioguy »
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline sneakypete

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Re: U.S. Forces Won’t Stop Turkish Move Into Syria, White House Says
« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2019, 08:48:00 AM »
politics
U.S. Forces Won’t Stop Turkish Move Into Syria, White House Says
By Josh Wingrove
October 6, 2019, 8:46 PM PDT Updated on October 6, 2019, 10:17 PM PDT

 
 
Quote
Trump Endorses Turkish Military Operation in Syria, Shifting U.S. Policy

Not true. Trump did NOT "endorse" anything.


Not our zoo,not our monkeys. 

Let the UN handle it by shutting down trade to and from the warring nations.
It takes an special kind of "Stoopid" to make Trump look like a defenseless victim and gain public sympathy,but damned if the Dims didn't pull it off!

Offline jpsb

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2019, 08:49:07 AM »
Reportedly, can't tell how solid a lot of this information really is:

Sadly it looks like Trump screwed not only the Syrian Kurds but the Syrian Christians too.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2019, 08:50:44 AM »
Lindsay Graham has come out against withdrawal.  No clear answers here yet.

@TomSea

No surprise there. Lady Lindsey likes the contributions to his campaigns that comes from being obedient.
It takes an special kind of "Stoopid" to make Trump look like a defenseless victim and gain public sympathy,but damned if the Dims didn't pull it off!

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #44 on: October 09, 2019, 08:52:55 AM »
So basically we are throwing the Kurds under the bus again. Wasn't  ISIS  supposed to be gone?

@kevindavis

"WE"????? What's this "we" crap? Are you pregnant?

The US is NOT the world's daddy.
It takes an special kind of "Stoopid" to make Trump look like a defenseless victim and gain public sympathy,but damned if the Dims didn't pull it off!

Offline txradioguy

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #45 on: October 09, 2019, 08:53:07 AM »
Sadly it looks like Trump screwed not only the Syrian Kurds but the Syrian Christians too.

Yup. Turkish military forces have crossed the border into Syria.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #46 on: October 09, 2019, 08:54:56 AM »
@kevindavis

"WE"????? What's this "we" crap? Are you pregnant?

The US is NOT the world's daddy.

So it’s ok in your mind to just screw over an ally and leave them to be slaughtered by a sworn enemy?

The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #47 on: October 09, 2019, 09:01:41 AM »
The different Kurdish regions are gonna have to band together right now in mutual support.

No one else has their backs it appears.

@txradioguy

You mean they are going to have to be willing to fight and die to protect themselves?

WOW! What a novel concept!
It takes an special kind of "Stoopid" to make Trump look like a defenseless victim and gain public sympathy,but damned if the Dims didn't pull it off!

Offline mystery-ak

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Offline mystery-ak

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Re: Turkey set to invade Syria; US to remove forces from area
« Reply #49 on: October 09, 2019, 09:07:38 AM »


'I'm going to throw up': Graham slams Trump for 'putting the nation at risk'
by Caitlin Yilek
 | October 09, 2019 08:39 AM



Sen. Lindsey Graham said President Trump was risking the safety of the nation as well as putting his presidency on the line with his decision to withdraw troops from northern Syria.

Graham, who has been an ally of the president, told Axios that Trump’s Syria decision was “putting the nation at risk” and “putting his presidency at risk.”

“And I hope he will adjust his policies like he did before. That would actually be a sign of real leadership,” Graham said Tuesday. "If I hear the president say one more time, 'I made a campaign promise to get out of Syria,' I'm going to throw up.”

more
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/im-going-to-throw-up-graham-slams-trump-for-putting-the-nation-at-risk
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