Hong Kong/Mainland China Crisis thread

[TomSea]

Honest to gosh a proper comment, did not some students from that Poly-University in HK rappel to escape the incoming security forces?

Irina Tsukerman
@irinatsukerman
This should be a movie!

https://twitter.com/irinatsukerman/status/1196652963361644547

Yes, sort of like what you would see in a movie.

[TomSea]

Looks like Senator Cruz sent out a few tweets in the past 24 addressing the situation in Hong Kong AND Iran, see actual account for accompanying articles:

Senator Ted Cruz
@SenTedCruz
To the people of Iran peacefully protesting: America stands with you against the oppressive regime. We will hold accountable those behind the violent crackdowns. #IranProtests -->

https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/1196851518546305025

Senator Ted Cruz
@SenTedCruz
·
3h
As violence continues to escalate in Hong Kong, the cause for freedom has never been greater. The world is watching as police shamefully attack students. I will continue to support & stand w the students & brave activists fighting to preserve freedom in #HongKong.

Video Message.

https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/1196827978442924033

Steve Herman
@W7VOA
·
3h
In video, @tedcruz
 reaffirms "his unwavering support for all students and activists in Hong Kong fighting to preserve freedom and democracy." https://youtube.com/watch?v=q8EKmx_Fw80&feature=youtu.be #HongKongProtests

https://twitter.com/W7VOA/status/1196816209414705153

Senator Ted Cruz
@SenTedCruz
·
3h
The violence & oppression of the HK police attacking innocent students & activists at HK campuses has been shameful. To all the dissidents taking a stand against this brutality & for freedom: I will continue to support your fight for freedom.

https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/1196818967572176896

[TomSea]

Triads, criminal gangs of China...maybe like the Mafia? Also, I think there is another term used which escapes me at the moment.

Home | Commentaries
Hong Kong’s Triads: A Reporter Looks Back
2019-11-13

Some two decades ago I met a former magazine editor who had written something that displeased one of Hong Kong’s notorious triad gangs.

At the time that I met him, this distinguished editor had left his editing job and gone to work at a university in Hong Kong. I came to consider him a friend.

But the triads have long memories.

Read more at: https://www.rfa.org/english/commentaries/hongkong-triads-11132019161722.html

[TomSea]

China demands Trump veto bills on Hong Kong
By Associated Press
Nov. 21, 2019
1:17 AM
BEIJING —

China on Thursday demanded President Trump veto legislation aimed at supporting human rights in Hong Kong and renewed a threat to take “strong countermeasures” if the bills become law.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Geng Shuang said the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act undermined both China’s interests and those of the U.S. in the semi-autonomous Chinese city.

“We urge the U.S. to grasp the situation, stop its wrongdoing before it’s too late, prevent this act from becoming law (and) immediately stop interfering in Hong Kong affairs and China’s internal affairs,” Geng said at a daily news briefing.

More at: https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2019-11-21/china-demands-trump-veto-hong-kong-bill

The Senate voting I believe unanimously to condemn Hong Kong is great but what is it actually going to do? 

 

In other news, I see the students used a sewer to escape the Poly-University but that venue has been closed.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-hongkong-protests/hong-kong-students-sewer-escape-thwarted-idUSKBN1XT086?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews

Some of the descriptions from the articles have the protesters saying there were snakes down there.

Also:

Ex-U.K. consulate staffer says Chinese police tortured him over Hong Kong protests
November 20, 2019 / 10:53 AM / AP

...

Cheng wrote that while being held he was shuttled between detention and interrogation centers while hooded and handcuffed. In addition to being shackled to the frame, he wrote he was ordered to assume stress positions for "countless hours," and was beaten with what felt like "sharpened batons" and poked in the knee if he faltered. He was also punished for dozing off during the sessions by being forced to sing the Chinese national anthem, he wrote.

"I was blindfolded and hooded during the whole torture and interrogations, I sweated a lot, and felt exhausted, dizzy and suffocated," Cheng wrote.

One interrogator speaking Hong Kong's native Cantonese dialect cursed him, saying, "How dare you work for the British to supervise Chinese," while another speaking in a northern Mandarin accent told him they were from China's secret intelligence service and that he had "no human rights in this place," Cheng wrote.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/simon-cheng-hong-kong-employee-british-consulate-china-police-torture-grilling-over-protests-2019-11-20/

[Gefn]

Thanks for the updates, @TomSea

[Chosen Daughter]

Why doesn't the President step up and say something in support of Hong Kong?  I mean for goodness sakes the protesters are waiving around the most recognizable sign of freedom in the world at their protests...the American Flag!

Sad that they don't realize America has changed.

[Chosen Daughter]

China Offers Thousands of Dollars to Anyone Who Will Report Christians, 'Illegal' Churches to Government

https://www.gospelherald.com/articles/71944/20190409/china-offers-thousands-dollars-anyone-who-will-report-christians-illegal.htm

[truth_seeker]

It is suddenly time, to go into all out war with China.

Restart the draft, and build an army of several millions, for decades of death and injury.

Or stay the phuque out of others' business, let them fight their own wars, etc.

But if anybody here wants to ship out as a volunteer, there must be ways to sneak into Hong Kong, Taiwan,  or China, to take up aarms on behalf of Christians, Falun Gong, muslims etc.

[TomSea]

Some Hong Kong protesters are reportedly going to "simmer down" as elections are forthcoming. Others, apparently, will not.

https://www.bing.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/11/23/hong-kong-protests-simmer-ahead-of-local-elections-i-dont-feel-optimistic-about-the-outcome.html

[TomSea]

Those elections apparently are today.

Coverage:  https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/politics/article/3039132/results-blog

Of course, I have no idea how to interpret it except "pro-democracy" must be more representational of the protesters.

[libertybele]

Pro-democracy candidates surge, pro-Beijing candidates suffer amid record turnout in Hong Kong elections

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2019/11/24/hong-kong-elections-pro-democracy-protesters-seek-seat-table/4290546002/

[TomSea]

Exclusive: China sets up Hong Kong crisis center in mainland, considers replacing chief liaison
Keith Zhai, James Pomfret, David Kirton

HONG KONG/SHENZHEN, China (Reuters) - Tightening control over efforts to manage the upheaval in Hong Kong, the Chinese leadership has set up a crisis command center on the mainland side of the border and is considering replacing its official liaison to the restive semi-autonomous city, people familiar with the matter said.

As violent protests roil Hong Kong, top Chinese leaders in recent months have been managing their response from a villa on the outskirts of Shenzhen, bypassing the formal bureaucracy through which Beijing has supervised the financial hub for two decades.

Ordinarily, communications between Beijing and Hong Kong are conducted through a Chinese government body: the Liaison Office of the Central People’s Government in Hong Kong. The Liaison Office is housed in a Hong Kong skyscraper stacked with surveillance cameras, ringed by steel barricades and topped by a reinforced glass globe.

Read more at: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-hongkong-protests-shenzhen-exclusive/exclusive-china-sets-up-hong-kong-crisis-center-in-mainland-considers-replacing-chief-liaison-idUSKBN1Y000P

It really shouldn't be that big of a deal to grant Hong Kong permanent "autonomy", it's a cash cow. I'd like to see them get total independence, that might not be realistic but perhaps their right to self-governorship, all of that, can be preserved.

In other news, yes, I think the protesters are out today yet.

[Gefn]

Trump signs bill backing Hong Kong protesters into law, in spite of Beijing’s objections



PUBLISHED WED, NOV 27 20196:08 PM EST

This is breaking news. Please check back for updates.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/27/trump-signs-bill-backing-hong-kong-protesters-into-law-in-spite-of-beijings-objections.html

Ping @TomSea

[TomSea]

Global Times
@globaltimesnews
#BREAKING: Chinese Foreign Ministry summons the US Ambassador to China concerning the latest #HongKong act signed by the US President.

https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1199924158827679744

[Gefn]

Wow. This isn’t looking good.

[Gefn]

Hong Kong police fire tear gas as thousands take to the streets in fresh protests

HONG KONG (Reuters) - Police fired tear gas to disperse thousands of anti-government protesters in Hong Kong on Sunday, ending a rare lull in violence, as residents took to the streets chanting “revolution of our time” and “liberate Hong Kong”.

The protest in the busy shopping district of Tsim Sha Tsui followed a march by hundreds of people to the U.S. consulate to show “gratitude” for U.S. support for the demonstrations that have agitated the Chinese-ruled city for six months.

Shops and businesses in the area closed early as police sprayed volleys of tear gas at protesters, including some elderly residents and others with their pets, as they marched past the city’s Kowloon waterfront, home to luxury hotels and shopping malls.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-hongkong-protests/hong-kong-police-fire-tear-gas-as-thousands-take-to-the-streets-in-fresh-protests-idUSKBN1Y50SK

[TomSea]

China to suspend U.S. Navy visits to Hong Kong over new law
Published: Dec 2, 2019 5:17 a.m. ET

HONG KONG (AP) — China said Monday it will suspend U.S. Navy visits to Hong Kong and sanction several American pro-democracy organizations in retaliation for the signing into law of legislation supporting human rights in the semi-autonomous territory.

While the nature of the sanctions remained unclear, the move appeared to back up Chinese threats that the U.S. would bear the costs of the decision.

The steps are “in response to the U.S.’s unreasonable behavior,” foreign ministry spokeswoman Hua Chunying said, adding that the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act “seriously interfered” in China’s internal affairs.

Read more at: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/china-to-suspend-us-navy-visits-to-hong-kong-over-new-law-2019-12-02

Obviously, this is how it goes, we passed that congressional condemnation of events in Hong Kong, so China responds in this manner.

[TomSea]

Ted Cruz twitter:

Senator Ted Cruz
@SenTedCruz
We can file it in my office next to the measure by the Iranian parliament barring me from Iran.

https://twitter.com/SenTedCruz/status/1201607321631236096

Global Times
@globaltimesnews
.@SpeakerPelosi
, @marcorubio
, @tedcruz
, and @SecPompeo
... these #US politicians could be put on restricted entry list as China is mulling countermeasures to #HK act: analysts http://bit.ly/2OuViei

https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/1200039725194764290

If one has followed China, they kind of stuck it to Canada too, over disagreements. So, blowback is to be expected.

[sneakypete]

I can't even begin to imagine the fear in the hearts of the ruling families in China when they think about revolution. That is a LOT of people to try to get back under control once they start rioting.

The fact that they haven't cracked down and started just shooting people dead in Hong Kong is,IMNSHO,proof they are terrified of what could happen if this isn't handed right.

20-30 years ago,they just didn't give a damn. Now they are terrified.

[sneakypete]

I wonder when the ChiComs is going to send in the troops.

@kevindavis

About 3 minutes before the whole damn country rises up in revolt.

"How ya gonna keep them down on the farm after they've seen the internet?"

[sneakypete]

But the other party watching Hong Kong is even more important: The Chinese public. Almost nobody in China buys into the rhetoric of communism anymore. The Chinese Communist Party’s rule is accepted because it has been delivering a massive increase in prosperity and constructing the sorts of facilities that make people proud of their nation’s ascent. But now, that prosperity is faltering, making the ongoing discontent with authoritarianism and endemic, massive corruption harder to dismiss.

@TomSea

And there it is. Pretty soon the only communists left in the world will be living in coastal US areas,and in Europe.

It's looking like we will have a severe crackdown,

I think that is what will happen,but I do NOT think this is what the Politburo wants. In fact,I think it is their greatest fear.

 Any suggestions for thread names, ...

How about,"China,we barely knew ya!"

[dfwgator]

@kevindavis

About 3 minutes before the whole damn country rises up in revolt.

"How ya gonna keep them down on the farm after they've seen the internet?"

China has hundreds of millions living in the center of the country who have no idea what is going on.   In 1989, they sent in PLA soldiers into Beijing from areas who had no clue what had been going on there for the past month,  they only knew what the government told them.

[sneakypete]

China has hundreds of millions living in the center of the country who have no idea what is going on.   In 1989, they sent in PLA soldiers into Beijing from areas who had no clue what had been going on there for the past month,  they only knew what the government told them.

@dfwgator

That was in 1989. Things have changed a lot since then. Yeah,they still have the same leaders/dictators,but the difference is the leadership is now the ones living in fear. They tried to shut down internet access to any but "approved" users,but that cat is out of the bag now,and there is no putting it back.

[TomSea]

Do No Harm in Hong Kong
Kurt Tong

In the months after large-scale protests first broke out in Hong Kong last June, U.S. policy circles remained relatively quiet. Yet as demonstrations turned violent and rumors of a Beijing-directed crackdown spread, concern in Washington grew. Last week, President Donald Trump signed the Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act, which arrived at his desk with veto-proof backing from both houses of Congress. The legislation gives the U.S. government a stronger mandate to adjust its legal stance toward Hong Kong, as well as offering renewed sanctions authorities and a clearer expression of where the United States stands on the city’s future.

Yet the biggest questions for U.S. policy still lie ahead. At issue today in Hong Kong is not simply when and how the protests end. More consequential is whether Hong Kong’s uniquely autonomous status within China, as defined by the “one country, two systems” paradigm, can survive the current crisis. The most important focus for U.S. policymakers should be to do what they can to reinforce that paradigm, while avoiding steps that would undermine it.

The status quo in Hong Kong, with its high degree of autonomy, extensive personal freedoms, and strong rule of law, generates enormous benefits not just for the people of Hong Kong but also for the United States and China. Above all else, Washington must remember what it can, and cannot, do to ensure that this status quo continues. Done right, U.S. policy can help keep the Hong Kong dream alive. But there is a real risk that the United States could inadvertently make matters worse.

Read more at: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/china/2019-12-06/do-no-harm-hong-kong?utm_source=twitter_posts&utm_campaign=tw_daily_soc&utm_medium=social

[TomSea]

Leader McConnell
@senatemajldr
It was my pleasure to meet today with @NathanLawKC
, a Hong Kong activist and member of a new generation of aspirational leaders continuing Hong Kong’s fight for freedom and autonomy. The United States is proud to stand with them.

https://twitter.com/senatemajldr/status/1204542600381960192

Nice to see, nowadays, we almost vilify every politician. Before the internet or when I was a kid, I know we had some of this, still, it seemed a bit more tolerant.