Author Topic: We need to DO SOMETHING!!  (Read 3844 times)

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Offline EdJames

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We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« on: August 06, 2019, 04:20:04 pm »
We need to DO SOMETHING!!

Just a quick reminder, as we hear the pleas from virtually all "sides," that something MUST be DONE, we have seen many recent examples of this age old pattern.

The model is a form of the Hegelian Dialectic (Thesis-Antithesis-Synthesis) structured as: Problem-Reaction-Solution.

Think about the "Healthcare Crisis" that was ginned up toward the end of the GWB's second term.  All of a sudden the media was screaming constantly about this "Healthcare Crisis" sweeping the nation...  they successfully propagandized people to believe that our largely private-based healthcare insurance system, successfully serving millions for decades, was all of a sudden collapsing and that countless people were dying in the streets.  Spurred on by politicians, people began to React and clamor for something to be done!  Roll in the Solution: Affordable Care Act.  (Funny that "solution" basically destroyed the underpinnings of the existing health insurance system.)

Think about the "Financial Crisis" as well.  Regardless of which of the numerous theories that you believe to be the root cause of the crisis, almost none will argue that the actions of the federal reserve and federal government did much to worsen the crisis.  Recall GWB: "I've abandoned free-market principles to save the free-market system."  People demanded that something be done!  Roll in the Solution: Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform and Consumer Protection Act.  (Funny that "solution" basically destroyed the underpinnings of numerous aspects of the nation's financial system, ushered in the draconian Consumer Financial Protection Board, and drove countless small banks out of business across the nation.)

Go through the same model following the terror attacks of September 11, 2001.  Did two days lapse before the Congress passed ready to go legislation that created bottomless liability funds and indemnified all possible entities from having to face lawsuits with their requisite discovery?  Everyone was demanding that something be done!!  Solution: USA Patriot  Act (Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism) Act of 2001 and subsequent decades of low-grade perpetual "war" that seemed to have done little to remedy the terror problem, but certainly have drained the national treasury of trillions (that our progeny will never be able to repay).  Note well: the application of the Problem-Reaction-Solution works well regardless of how the Problem starts.

You can go back into history to see instances of similar application: Reichstag Fire, Nero burning Rome, and so forth.

Problem-Reaction-Solution is what we are seeing today.  We've had a slow motion roll-out of the Problem (numerous mass shootings over many, many years).  Has the past weekend's events in Dayton, OH and El Paso, TX created the denouement of the Problem phase?

We certainly have plenty of Reaction in that we are hearing an unprecedented level of pleas for Bipartisan Solutions!!


The following short video begins by reminding us of Edward M. House's message in Phillip Dru: Administrator and the genesis of countless examples of how Problem-Reaction-Solution has been applied.  It covers numerous examples (some well, some not so well) of this basic model in application.  Toward the end, you will hear former Communist Jerry Kirk explain: The idea is to create a situation where the people are so frightened of the violence all around them that they . . . will throw their hands up in the air and demand, "Federal Government— do something!"


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My message: be wary fellow Patriots as to how the Problem is being defined, how the media and politicians (some ill-intended, some ill-informed) are stoking up the demand for a Reaction, and above all, what kind of Solutions are being sold.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2019, 04:23:35 pm »
Did you write this @EdJames?  Big  888high58888 if you did!

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2019, 04:25:43 pm »
Did you write this @EdJames?  Big  888high58888 if you did!

Yes, just wanted to sketch out some quick notes....  pardon any typos....

Offline Sanguine

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2019, 04:28:27 pm »
I love the Hegelian Dialectic angle and I think it is very appropriate.

Another thing to throw in the mix - since we are all members of a group or "tribe" now, whether LGBTQRSP or ethnicity or gender or poor or rich or whatever, which is the most denigrated, useless group of all right now?  (Hint - they're angry and confused and not knowledgeable enough to know why they are angry and confused.)

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2019, 04:31:16 pm »
I love the Hegelian Dialectic angle and I think it is very appropriate.

Another thing to throw in the mix - since we are all members of a group or "tribe" now, whether LGBTQRSP or ethnicity or gender or poor or rich or whatever, which is the most denigrated, useless group of all right now?  (Hint - they're angry and confused and not knowledgeable enough to know why they are angry and confused.)

If you listen to the YouTube video, the narrator actually touches on that via examples from the 1960s and 1970s, and as I listened to him my thoughts turned to exactly what you mention above.

Offline roamer_1

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2019, 04:34:56 pm »
That's exactly right.
 :beer:

Offline andy58-in-nh

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #6 on: August 06, 2019, 04:46:03 pm »
"The most terrifying force of death, comes from the hands of Men who wanted to be left Alone. They try, so very hard, to mind their own business and provide for themselves and those they love. They resist every impulse to fight back, knowing the forced and permanent change of life that will come from it. They know, that the moment they fight back, their lives as they have lived them, are over. -Alexander Solzhenitsyn

Online Bigun

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #7 on: August 06, 2019, 05:14:56 pm »
@EdJames

B R A V O ! ! !

You cobble together REALLY well my friend!  Nailed it!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline GrouchoTex

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2019, 05:22:24 pm »
In a world where everything becomes a crisis, then all things are a crisis, and it loses its meaning.

Online Bigun

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« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 05:48:37 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline corbe

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #10 on: August 06, 2019, 05:51:47 pm »
   Brilliant Puzzle solving @EdJames
   Thanks for sharing   :yowsa:
No government in the 12,000 years of modern mankind history has led its people into anything but the history books with a simple lesson, don't let this happen to you.

Offline Sanguine

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2019, 06:31:28 pm »
@EdJames  @Sanguine

Wonder how many people here have ever heard the name Edward Bernays and know who he is?

http://www.criticalthink.info/webindex/bernays.htm

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Edward-Bernays

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

https://www.thoughtco.com/edward-bernays-4685459

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-woodrow-wilsons-propaganda-machine-changed-american-journalism-180963082/

That's a big part of the picture for sure, @Bigun.  That's why Google and other social media is something new and that we have not seen before.

I think I'll have some bacon and eggs for breakfast now.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2019, 07:32:44 pm »
"Do Something!" == "Do Anything!"  == Bad law.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
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Online Bigun

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2019, 07:42:15 pm »
That's a big part of the picture for sure, @Bigun.  That's why Google and other social media is something new and that we have not seen before.

I think I'll have some bacon and eggs for breakfast now.

Yeah and here's another big part of the picture @Sanguine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dewey

http://www.wilderdom.com/experiential/JohnDeweyPhilosophyEducation.html

https://www.iep.utm.edu/dewey/

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"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline Sanguine

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2019, 07:49:50 pm »
@EdJames, where did you find that Hegelian clip?  Absolutely chilling.  And, weirdly, accurately prescient.

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #15 on: August 06, 2019, 08:11:50 pm »
@EdJames  @Sanguine

Wonder how many people here have ever heard the name Edward Bernays and know who he is?

http://www.criticalthink.info/webindex/bernays.htm

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Edward-Bernays

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays

https://www.thoughtco.com/edward-bernays-4685459

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-woodrow-wilsons-propaganda-machine-changed-american-journalism-180963082/

@Bigun

Bernays and House (mentioned above), two peas in a pod...

Quote
Bernays was involved for an extended period as a member of the large entourage of George Creel, head of the U.S. Committee on Public Information (CPI), America’s wartime propaganda agency. Lippmann was there briefly as an aide to Colonel House, Woodrow Wilson’s chief advisor.

https://ijoc.org/index.php/ijoc/article/viewFile/1955/907

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #16 on: August 06, 2019, 08:13:44 pm »
   Brilliant Puzzle solving @EdJames
   Thanks for sharing   :yowsa:

You are welcome @corbe ....  when you are a crusty old bastard, you've seen the same crap over and over, more often than you want to....

 :beer:

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #17 on: August 06, 2019, 08:20:31 pm »
Yeah and here's another big part of the picture @Sanguine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dewey

http://www.wilderdom.com/experiential/JohnDeweyPhilosophyEducation.html

https://www.iep.utm.edu/dewey/

Error 404 (Not Found)!!1

Don't forget about Dewey's predecessor, Horace Mann, and his implementation of the "Prussian model" in Massachusetts....

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #18 on: August 06, 2019, 08:21:34 pm »
@EdJames, where did you find that Hegelian clip?  Absolutely chilling.  And, weirdly, accurately prescient.

@Sanguine

There are a number of them on YouTube....  some better than others....

Online Bigun

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #19 on: August 06, 2019, 08:22:15 pm »
@Bigun

Bernays and House (mentioned above), two peas in a pod...

https://ijoc.org/index.php/ijoc/article/viewFile/1955/907

@EdJames the Smithsonian Mag link I posted above is a PITA to read but also very informative about those two.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Online Bigun

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #20 on: August 06, 2019, 08:24:16 pm »
You are welcome @corbe ....  when you are a crusty old bastard, you've seen the same crap over and over, more often than you want to....

 :beer:

Man, is that ever true!
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Online Bigun

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #21 on: August 06, 2019, 08:27:14 pm »
Don't forget about Dewey's predecessor, Horace Mann, and his implementation of the "Prussian model" in Massachusetts....

Of course not!

Quote
No one did more than he to establish in the minds of the American people the conception that education should be universal, non-sectarian, free, and that its aims should be social efficiency, civic virtue, and character, rather than mere learning or the advancement of sectarian ends

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horace_Mann
« Last Edit: August 06, 2019, 08:31:10 pm by Bigun »
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline austingirl

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #22 on: August 07, 2019, 01:59:31 pm »
@EdJames

Excellent post! 888high58888
Principles matter. Words matter.

Offline EdJames

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #23 on: August 07, 2019, 07:27:43 pm »

Offline TomSea

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Re: We need to DO SOMETHING!!
« Reply #24 on: August 07, 2019, 08:16:27 pm »
Is that Melvin Munn narrating? Actually, what Glen Beck says and a number of others is not new. It's repeating what Munn and some others were saying in the '60s and '70s about Fabian Socialists. Maybe someone was saying it before then.  It's dawned on me, what they said seems a real danger today.

https://tsarizm.com/opinion/2019/07/06/the-hi-tech-traditionalist-this-is-why-the-american-progressive-left-loves-violence-but-abhors-the-military/

Above is pertinent too, if our country is going down, it is going down in the worst of ways.

Quote
America has not had the draft for many decades now and very few Americans, as percentage of the population, serve in the armed forces. Most American families do not know someone who is currently serving. Yet until very recently, until Trump’s election, the military was a unifying symbol, a source of pride, celebrated at sport events and more across the country.

What is the reason for that? One of the reasons is that the military, perhaps alone in today’s America, still unabashedly employs and uses every day the symbols of the American nation: the flag and the eagle. The military is a distillation of sorts of American nationalism. It is, or at least was, the one place were nationalism is allowed and even celebrated. American armed forces fight; that is their stated goal. Fight for whom, you may ask? Or for what? They fight to protect Americans and defend America’s interests, including financial interests, which often means intervening in far-away lands to make sure that the bad guys do not win.

I hope we can avoid it. Maybe we can.

Take India for China, they've been neighbors and I'd think usually not good ones for thousands of years.

China is heading towards hegemony, that has been there to an extent for most of this time with the Han but India are diversified yet, still strong, in that sense, they are multicultural. Maybe there is hope for us.