Author Topic: These Republicans signed the ‘never Trump’ letters in 2016. Now some are having second thoughts.  (Read 3020 times)

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Online Once-Ler

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/these-republicans-signed-the-never-trump-letters-in-2016-now-some-are-having-second-thoughts/2019/07/12/a7e7a49a-a3ed-11e9-bd56-eac6bb02d01d_story.html

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Among those at the Reagan Institute retreat is Daniel Blumenthal, an American Enterprise Institute scholar who served at the Pentagon in the Bush administration. Last summer, Blumenthal was among the candidates whom Pompeo was considering to oversee East Asia affairs at the State Department. But his candidacy was derailed, at least in part, by the White House’s learning of his signature on the War on the Rocks letter, according to people familiar with the matter who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss the subject.

Another foreign policy analyst who signed that letter said in an interview this week that he regrets his participation. This person, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to candidly discuss the issue, accused the letter organizers of turning their opposition to Trump into a “never-ending anti-Trump crusade” that continued after he took office and has vaulted some of them to media stardom while leaving others with limited professional options.

“I didn’t sign up for that,” this analyst said. “I learned my lesson. I’ve sworn off ever signing another letter I didn’t write.”

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I didn't oppose Trump because I thought I could make a buck for it.  I opposed Trump before the election because I thought he was an ugly human being.  After the election he proved it to me.

This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline libertybele

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At the end of the day, whether or not you voted for Trump in '16 in the general, or consider your self a Never Trumper, who are you going to vote for in 2020??  I think Trump will remain unopposed and certainly if not, who ever opposes him will lose. 

Not many options as it doesn't seem that there will be a worthwhile 3rd party who will have qualified in all 50 states, which leaves the choice between Trump or a DEM.  Personally, I can't think of any DEM that is worthy of my vote.

I have seriously considered just voting down ballot, but that doesn't accomplish my primary objective of stopping the left.  On the other hand Trump's failure on the border is very troubling and I am not convinced that he never intended to secure the border or build a wall.
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Online Once-Ler

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At the end of the day, whether or not you voted for Trump in '16 in the general, or consider your self a Never Trumper, who are you going to vote for in 2020??  I think Trump will remain unopposed and certainly if not, who ever opposes him will lose. 

Not many options as it doesn't seem that there will be a worthwhile 3rd party who will have qualified in all 50 states, which leaves the choice between Trump or a DEM.  Personally, I can't think of any DEM that is worthy of my vote.

I have seriously considered just voting down ballot, but that doesn't accomplish my primary objective of stopping the left.  On the other hand Trump's failure on the border is very troubling and I am not convinced that he never intended to secure the border or build a wall.

I didn't vote in 2016, or 2018.  I don't expect to vote in 2020.  I can't think of any DEM or REP that is worthy of my vote.  Neither party has earned it.  I live in the swing state of Wisconsin.  Trump probably needs WI to win in 2020, but we have no Governor or Senate race next year.  I suspect only the bases will be voting next Nov in WI.  It will be a battle to dehumanize the other party the most effectively, not a battle of ideas, or accomplishments.  I'm sick of both parties and the negative ads have not even started. 

Every election I'm told that this election is the most important election of our lifetimes.  2020 will be the least important election of my lifetime.  There will be nothing for me to vote for.
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline Axeslinger

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/these-republicans-signed-the-never-trump-letters-in-2016-now-some-are-having-second-thoughts/2019/07/12/a7e7a49a-a3ed-11e9-bd56-eac6bb02d01d_story.html

More at link

I didn't oppose Trump because I thought I could make a buck for it.  I opposed Trump before the election because I thought he was an ugly human being.

I opposed and did not vote for trump in 2016 because:
I KNEW he was an ugly human being,
I didn’t trust him to govern conservatively
I also thought that he would do long term damage to conservatism.


I still believe him to be an ugly human being
He has governed FAR more conservatively than I ever thought he would.  Perfectly? No.  But he’s done far more to try and move the ball to the right than any president in a LONG time.
The jury is still out on long term damage to conservatism, but that is more a function of how he is being portrayed (and, in truth,  sometimes allowing himself to be portrayed) than a function of his conservative actions.

Long story short...I will be voting for him in 2020.
"The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first." - Thomas Jefferson

Offline skeeter

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I still believe him to be an ugly human being
He has governed FAR more conservatively than I ever thought he would.  Perfectly? No.  But he’s done far more to try and move the ball to the right than any president in a LONG time.
The jury is still out on long term damage to conservatism, but that is more a function of how he is being portrayed (and, in truth,  sometimes allowing himself to be portrayed) than a function of his conservative actions.

Long story short...I will be voting for him in 2020.

You have to play with the hand you're dealt.

The only other option is to quit and if you choose to do that, while you may not forfeit the right to speak your mind, you certainly shouldn't expect to be listened to.

Online Once-Ler

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I opposed and did not vote for trump in 2016 because:
I KNEW he was an ugly human being,
I didn’t trust him to govern conservatively
I also thought that he would do long term damage to conservatism.


I still believe him to be an ugly human being
He has governed FAR more conservatively than I ever thought he would.  Perfectly? No.  But he’s done far more to try and move the ball to the right than any president in a LONG time.
The jury is still out on long term damage to conservatism, but that is more a function of how he is being portrayed (and, in truth,  sometimes allowing himself to be portrayed) than a function of his conservative actions.

Long story short...I will be voting for him in 2020.

We agree he is trying.
I will send him a participation award when he leaves office.
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Online Once-Ler

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You have to play with the hand you're dealt.

The only other option is to quit and if you choose to do that, while you may not forfeit the right to speak your mind, you certainly shouldn't expect to be listened to.
I'm long past the point expecting much of anything from my fellow Americans.
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline skeeter

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I'm long past the point expecting much of anything from my fellow Americans.

Leaving me to wonder what you expect.

Online Once-Ler

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Leaving me to wonder what you expect.
Self awareness, and critical thinking.  A choice other than poison or razor blades and warm tub.
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline libertybele

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I'm long past the point expecting much of anything from my fellow Americans.

WE fellow Americans ARE this country.  To throw in the towel and not participate and NOT hold anyone accountable and responsible IS exactly why we find ourselves in the turmoil that we are experiencing.  I'm not so sure that this country is going to survive a DEM should one be seated in 2020.  With Trump we may (and that's an awfully big may) still have a slight chance of holding on to this Republic.

@Once-Ler I would NEVER suggest you NOT vote your conscious or NOT abstain from voting if that is what you want to do.  All I am merely pointing out is had we long ago voted out the aholes that are still in office we just might be in a better place.
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Offline skeeter

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Self awareness, and critical thinking.  A choice other than poison or razor blades and warm tub.

Yes, where did those critical thinking skills that brought us Woodrow Wilson, FDR and Jimmy Carter go.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Quote
Donald J. Trump Retweeted

Brandon Straka
@usminority

“In January of 2017, I bitterly proclaimed on social media that I would never be able to understand how anybody could vote for a man who stood before a cheering crowd & mocked a reporter’s disability. That’s when somebody sent me this...”  SEE FULL VIDEO: http://youtu.be/ssNEJD3xC8A

9:32 PM - 11 Jul 2019

https://twitter.com/usminority/status/1149536949662674944
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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Error 404 (Not Found)!!1
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Online Once-Ler

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@Once-Ler I would NEVER suggest you NOT vote your conscious or NOT abstain from voting if that is what you want to do.  All I am merely pointing out is had we long ago voted out the aholes that are still in office we just might be in a better place.

I don't fault you for believing as you do either.  The House had huge turnover in 2018 but the vast majority were re-elected and I'm not that happy with the replacements.

When Clinton gave his SOTU speech in 1995, after the GOP took control of the Congress, he said "The era of Big Government is over."  He recognized that voters were unhappy with his course and later signed an end to AFDC.  After campaigning against Campaign Finance Reform and promising a VETO Dubya signed McCain/Feingold because the voters demanded it.  They took their responsibility as President of the USA seriously.  This President has no self awareness and less empathy.  Nothing good can come from him.

Warnings that a rat President would be worse when Trump is awful didn't convince me in 2016 and just don't work for me anymore.

Some how we have to get to a point where both sides can win something and do something marginally good, rather than just oppose what the other side wants just because they want it. 

Owning the libs is not enough to earn my vote and that is all the GOP is offering me.
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Online roamer_1

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WE fellow Americans ARE this country.  To throw in the towel and not participate and NOT hold anyone accountable and responsible IS exactly why we find ourselves in the turmoil that we are experiencing.  I'm not so sure that this country is going to survive a DEM should one be seated in 2020.  With Trump we may (and that's an awfully big may) still have a slight chance of holding on to this Republic.

@Once-Ler I would NEVER suggest you NOT vote your conscious or NOT abstain from voting if that is what you want to do.  All I am merely pointing out is had we long ago voted out the aholes that are still in office we just might be in a better place.

That is exactly bass-ackwards @libertybele
They should have never been voted in in the first place.
The pragmatism of lesser evil is why we are where we are.
If you are making excuses when explaining your vote, you are part of the problem.

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Online Once-Ler

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Error 404 (Not Found)!!1

I'm not gonna watch it but I'm curious if the video has anything to do with NeverTrump?
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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I'm not gonna watch it but I'm curious if the video has anything to do with NeverTrump?

Yes.



« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 11:46:23 AM by Right_in_Virginia »
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Online Once-Ler

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Yes.
It does not.
You tricked me into watching a homosexual tell me Trump is not a serial liar who engages in flagrant immorality and flaunts it.
It's not true and my opinions about abortion, 2nd amendment, and patriotism won't allow me to ignore it.
Shame on you. :nono:
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline libertybele

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That is exactly bass-ackwards @libertybele
They should have never been voted in in the first place.
The pragmatism of lesser evil is why we are where we are.
If you are making excuses when explaining your vote, you are part of the problem.

Absolutely they should have never been voted for in the first place.  The point I was trying to make is to keep voting for them just because they are Republican in name IS the problem; so yes, voting for the lesser evil IS exactly why we are here.

Unfortunately, we ARE here.  The left is even more radical then ever and we have 2 Muslims in office and we have an illegal situation in this country as never seen before.  So ... do we work with what little conservatism may be remaining, or do we simply throw in the towel and walk away and get ready to lock and load once our Republic completely crumbles and we are overrun by terrorists? 

You are in a much better place than most., so perhaps it really doesn't matter much to you.  Lots of us are in heavily populated cities or are surrounded by heavily populated cities.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 02:05:44 PM by libertybele »
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Offline Right_in_Virginia

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It does not. 

Of course it does.  A former NeverTrumper explains in the video why he has left that plantation.

And, he does a fine job of it.
"January 20th 2017 will be remembered as the day the people became the rulers of this nation again."  --  President Donald J. Trump

Online roamer_1

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Absolutely they should have never been voted for in the first place.  The point I was trying to make is to keep voting for them just because they are Republican in name IS the problem; so yes, voting for the lesser evil IS exactly why we are here.

Unfortunately, we ARE here.  The left is even more radical then ever and we have 2 Muslims in office and we have an illegal situation in this country as never seen before.  So ... do we work with what little conservatism may be remaining, or do we simply throw in the towel and walk away and get ready to lock and load once our Republic completely crumbles and we are overrun by terrorists? 

You are in a much better place than most., so perhaps it really doesn't matter much to you.  Lots of us are in heavily populated cities or are surrounded by heavily populated cities.

It doesn't matter - Nothing changes without actually CHANGING. You'rs is the new excuse to vote for the status quo - the fear of total loss votes for incremental loss, which is loss all the same.

Throw the bastards out. With prejudice. And stop voting for what you don't want just because it is in some small part 'better' than the other guy.

The only thing that will fix a single damn thing is to install real statesmen instead of mere politicians.
I for one will put up with it no longer.  Statesmen, dammit, or we're all lost anyway.

Online Once-Ler

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Of course it does.  A former NeverTrumper explains in the video why he has left that plantation.

And, he does a fine job of it.

He isn't a former NeverTrumper.  He never said "NeverTrumper"...He said former Democrat.  Did YOU watch it?
This is what the LORD Almighty said: ‘Administer true justice; show mercy and compassion to one another.  Do not oppress the widow or the fatherless, the foreigner or the poor. Do not plot evil against each other."

Offline libertybele

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It doesn't matter - Nothing changes without actually CHANGING. You'rs is the new excuse to vote for the status quo - the fear of total loss votes for incremental loss, which is loss all the same.

Throw the bastards out. With prejudice. And stop voting for what you don't want just because it is in some small part 'better' than the other guy.

The only thing that will fix a single damn thing is to install real statesmen instead of mere politicians.
I for one will put up with it no longer.  Statesmen, dammit, or we're all lost anyway.

No not an excuse.  I sincerely believe that we are on the brink and quite honestly, there doesn't seem to be enough statesman willing to run for office in the first place.  In the miraculous event that we somehow manage to throw the 'bastards' out -- who is going to replace them?  More DEMS?  More RINO's??  There isn't anyone worthwhile even willing to stand up to challenge Trump.  So, do you honestly expect all of a sudden an overwhelming number of statesman coming forward to challenge the RINO's and good for nothings within the GOP?  Not going to happen.

The only distant solution, that may not even be feasible at this point, is if those conservatives within the GOP vacate their seats and join the Constitution Party.  The clock is ticking and I think it is even far too late for that to happen.

So that really brings us back to reality.  Either you don't vote.  You vote for Trump.  You vote for DEM.
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Offline skeeter

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No not an excuse.  I sincerely believe that we are on the brink and quite honestly, there doesn't seem to be enough statesman willing to run for office in the first place.  In the miraculous event that we somehow manage to throw the 'bastards' out -- who is going to replace them?  More DEMS?  More RINO's??  There isn't anyone worthwhile even willing to stand up to challenge Trump.  So, do you honestly expect all of a sudden an overwhelming number of statesman coming forward to challenge the RINO's and good for nothings within the GOP?  Not going to happen.

The only distant solution, that may not even be feasible at this point, is if those conservatives within the GOP vacate their seats and join the Constitution Party.  The clock is ticking and I think it is even far too late for that to happen.

So that really brings us back to reality.  Either you don't vote.  You vote for Trump.  You vote for DEM.

Were you the one who recently posted ‘I stand against the progressive left’? I think that’s a simple yet brilliant response to those who question the purity of those of us who believe that participation by making the most of the choices available to us is the most productive course.


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