Poll

Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?

Yes
12 (35.3%)
No
8 (23.5%)
I'll wait for the completion of the French Investigation
14 (41.2%)

Total Members Voted: 34

Voting closed: April 26, 2019, 04:55:53 pm

Author Topic: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?  (Read 5924 times)

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Offline thackney

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #25 on: April 22, 2019, 02:14:33 pm »
Didn’t say that. But moisture will act like a magnifying glass.

Quote
Sunlight through cracks and with the high humidity and even moisture drops from leaks in the roof could easier catch the dust on fire, hence an accelerant in and of itself.

You said high humidity and moisture acts as an accelerant.  Really doesn't make any sense at all.
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Offline RetBobbyMI

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #26 on: April 22, 2019, 02:19:40 pm »
You said high humidity and moisture acts as an accelerant.  Really doesn't make any sense at all.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #27 on: April 22, 2019, 06:59:56 pm »
You said high humidity and moisture acts as an accelerant.  Really doesn't make any sense at all.
Spontaneous combustion can occur in large piles of organic matter, due to heat produced by bacterial activity that can't escape the pile. Hay is often suspected to ignite in this fashion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_combustion

But it only occurs in situations where there is a large enough pile to prevent the heat from escaping. I doubt that there was that much dust present there.

According to accounts, they were setting up to do the renovation work, not actually doing it.
The fire was first noted shortly after the work day had concluded.
Was electric lighting rigged for the purpose of illuminating the work area?
If so, how? (We use stand alone, diesel generators with light towers in the oil patch for lighting temporary locations with a very low fire hazard from the lighting. Was something similar in use or perhaps some other arrangement, and was it shut down at the end of the work day?).
Just more questions than answers at this point.

One more: In order to prevent violence, would the investigating agencies, on their own or under command from higher ups not release evidence of arson conducted or suspected to be conducted by Muslims?
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Offline thackney

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #28 on: April 22, 2019, 07:29:59 pm »
Spontaneous combustion can occur in large piles of organic matter, due to heat produced by bacterial activity that can't escape the pile. Hay is often suspected to ignite in this fashion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_combustion

But it only occurs in situations where there is a large enough pile to prevent the heat from escaping. I doubt that there was that much dust present there.

Correct, this is not the case.

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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #29 on: April 22, 2019, 07:50:07 pm »
Correct, this is not the case.


So we can rule out spontaneous combustion or faulty wiring not associated with the renovations, because there was no wiring in the forrest.

Which means any wiring which may have been present would be directly related to renovation activity, and should have been powered down at the end of the workday. Especially when accounts indicate the actual renovations had not started yet.
I find the idea that any working there would be careless with any potential ignition source improbable. This is not 'just another job', but a high profile renovation.
Arson remains a strong possibility.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline thackney

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #30 on: April 22, 2019, 08:06:41 pm »
So we can rule out spontaneous combustion or faulty wiring not associated with the renovations, because there was no wiring in the forrest.

Which means any wiring which may have been present would be directly related to renovation activity, and should have been powered down at the end of the workday. Especially when accounts indicate the actual renovations had not started yet.
I find the idea that any working there would be careless with any potential ignition source improbable. This is not 'just another job', but a high profile renovation.
Arson remains a strong possibility.

At the following link, the embedded video has some great footage of the attic starting at 2:15

https://krcrtv.com/news/nation-world/this-historian-showcased-wooden-framework-supporting-notre-dame-cathedral-back-in-2014
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #31 on: April 22, 2019, 08:21:15 pm »
At the following link, the embedded video has some great footage of the attic starting at 2:15

https://krcrtv.com/news/nation-world/this-historian-showcased-wooden-framework-supporting-notre-dame-cathedral-back-in-2014
I noted several fire extinguishers, but no artificial lighting. It may be hard for people to fathom, but the Cathedral was constructed at a time when electric lighting was not available, and the light in the space is apparently predominantly natural light, enhanced by only the lighting from the camera.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2019, 04:45:31 am »
Waiting for the investigation. Hope the French are honest about they find.

@austingirl

ROFLMAO! Have you ever read anything about the French government? They make our government seem to be composed of sober saints,by comparison.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2019, 04:47:31 am »
It would be interesting to know whether responsibility was claimed following any of the other 850+ churches that have been torched/desecrated in France over the past year or two.

@skeeter

Odd how that seems to be either suppressed or never even mentioned,ain't it?

IF I were the suspicious type..........
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2019, 04:49:58 am »

Quote
The religion of peace is the single greatest threat to western civilization, with nothing remotely approaching the damage they will unearth on civilization.

And there it is. Nothing more needs to be said other than "get em!"
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2019, 05:42:23 am »
*****rollingeyes***** Oh brother, almost as bad as the Dems trying to find something in Mueller’s Report.
---------------------------
Don't waste your time w/the arson mongers,
as they're looking for arguments not answers.
A leaden roof, trapping heat and humidity among
Oak beams 900 years old should be sufficient to
provoke questioning, not 'know it all' posturing.
Yet look on the bright side. At least you were
spared a lecture in Integral Calculus followed by
the comment; "See how I just proved it was arson!"
 


Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2019, 06:27:29 am »
---------------------------
Don't waste your time w/the arson mongers,
as they're looking for arguments not answers.
A leaden roof, trapping heat and humidity among
Oak beams 900 years old should be sufficient to
provoke questioning, not 'know it all' posturing.
Yet look on the bright side. At least you were
spared a lecture in Integral Calculus followed by
the comment; "See how I just proved it was arson!"

A leaden roof, trapping heat (and humidity???) in the blazing hot April sun in Paris.

If only someone with actual firefighting experience would weigh in here.
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Offline jafo2010

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2019, 01:11:25 pm »
Nearly 900 years and no spontaneous combustion.  The fact that makes it clear what went down, was that there were 12 churches burned in France in the week prior to Notre Dame.  No mystery here.  Add a couple million mussies and stir.  Death and destruction will follow.

No damn mystery whatsoever.  And if you think the French government would ever come out and say it was arson and set by mussies, you are dreaming.  Better to let the mussies to destroy their whole country than tell the truth.  France becomes Syria in 20 years, where much of the country is destroyed. 

It is projected mussies will be the majority in France by 2025.  After that, the Christians will slowly be killed off to the point there will not be enough with the power and will to do anything but have their heads cut off.  Eventually, France will become just one more peaceful islamic nation.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2019, 01:12:34 pm by jafo2010 »

Offline austingirl

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2019, 01:43:00 pm »
@austingirl

ROFLMAO! Have you ever read anything about the French government? They make our government seem to be composed of sober saints,by comparison.

@sneakypete

My hope for the French to be honest was tongue-in-cheek. If muslims are responsible, I doubt the French would admit it. The work crew knew full well the treasure they were working on and should have been exquisitely careful. After Sri Lanka and considering the number of attacks on Churches, I wouldn't be surprised if Notre Dame was deliberately set on fire.
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Offline skeeter

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #39 on: April 23, 2019, 01:48:54 pm »
@sneakypete

My hope for the French to be honest was tongue-in-cheek. If muslims are responsible, I doubt the French would admit it. The work crew knew full well the treasure they were working on and should have been exquisitely careful. After Sri Lanka and considering the number of attacks on Churches, I wouldn't be surprised if Notre Dame was deliberately set on fire.
One media source eagerly theorized the fire was started by wiring. That one quickly went the way of the welding theory when it was found wiring was not allowed in the 'forest'. They weren't so stupid as to allow such fire threats up in there.

Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #40 on: April 23, 2019, 01:52:39 pm »
---------------------------
Don't waste your time w/the arson mongers,
as they're looking for arguments not answers.
A leaden roof, trapping heat and humidity among
Oak beams 900 years old should be sufficient to
provoke questioning, not 'know it all' posturing.
Yet look on the bright side. At least you were
spared a lecture in Integral Calculus followed by
the comment; "See how I just proved it was arson!"

@Absalom


That's true. We all know the same conditions for 850 or 875 years would have never created a fire all by itself. It took 900 years. What a difference a half-century makes!

We also know Muslims would NEVER even dream of attacking a church or other non-Muslim religion in any shape or manner,right?

Nice try,though.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #41 on: April 23, 2019, 02:01:01 pm »
@sneakypete

My hope for the French to be honest was tongue-in-cheek. If muslims are responsible, I doubt the French would admit it. 

@austingirl

For that to happen the French government would have to admit they were wrong to allow so many Muslims basically unfettered entrance into France.

There is no way in HELL any government is going to admit to such a thing. This goes double with the French,who consider themselves to be Earth's superior intellectuals. Not that it is going to matter much longer because they will soon be a minority in France,and the ones remaining will be dropping to their knees in the streets several times a day to pray to Allah.

So will we if we don't wake  up to the threat pretty soon. The recent Muslim congresscritters were just a toe in the water. Look for several more to be elected in the next cycle. Most likely they will  be women also,because we see women as less of a threat.
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Offline Jazzhead

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2019, 04:26:11 pm »
@Absalom


That's true. We all know the same conditions for 850 or 875 years would have never created a fire all by itself. It took 900 years. What a difference a half-century makes!

We also know Muslims would NEVER even dream of attacking a church or other non-Muslim religion in any shape or manner,right?

Nice try,though.

Muslim terrorists attack churches with people in them.    Notre Dame burned after visiting hours.    Most likely just an accident related to the renovations.   
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Offline Absalom

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #43 on: April 23, 2019, 05:33:48 pm »
@Absalom


That's true. We all know the same conditions for 850 or 875 years would have never created a fire all by itself. It took 900 years. What a difference a half-century makes!

We also know Muslims would NEVER even dream of attacking a church or other non-Muslim religion in any shape or manner,right?

Nice try,though.
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Offline dfwgator

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #44 on: April 23, 2019, 06:39:23 pm »
Patience produces wisdom.
 Add to that, heat levels
there reached 112F* due to Paris humidity under the
lead roof. 

AHA!  It was Global Warming!!!

Offline austingirl

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #45 on: April 23, 2019, 07:25:14 pm »
Police have confirmed that a fire in the French church of Notre-Dame de Grâce on Easter Sunday appears to have been intentionally set, making it the latest in a string of desecrations of Christian churches in the country.
The fire was started in a large, wooden confessional around 4:30pm and proceeded to consume a dais in the presbytery of the eighteenth-century church located in the southern French town of Eyguières, near Provence.

https://www.breitbart.com/faith/2019/04/23/another-french-church-burns-on-easter-sunday-probable-arson/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+breitbart+%28Breitbart+News%29


Another French Church fire at a different Notre-Dame on Easter- probable arson.
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Offline thackney

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #46 on: April 23, 2019, 07:25:23 pm »
Patience produces wisdom.
While waiting, the Prefecture in Paris reported today
that an initial investigation indicates that there was
short-circuiting in attic wiring. Add to that, heat levels
there reached 112F* due to Paris humidity under the
lead roof.
So stay tuned. Now back to the arson mongers.

Humidity does not change temperature.  The "feels like" temperature is a real effect, but only for a living body that has to sweat to stay cool.  Humidity has no impact at all in actual temperature of non-living items.  It does not make wood and lead hotter in actual temperature.
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Offline sneakypete

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #47 on: April 23, 2019, 11:51:58 pm »
Humidity does not change temperature.  The "feels like" temperature is a real effect, but only for a living body that has to sweat to stay cool.  Humidity has no impact at all in actual temperature of non-living items.  It does not make wood and lead hotter in actual temperature.

@thackney

AND 112F isn't hot enough for combustion to take place.
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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: Do you think Muslims Started Notre Dame Fire?
« Reply #48 on: April 24, 2019, 07:10:39 am »
@thackney

AND 112F isn't hot enough for combustion to take place.
Not even close. Fahrenheit 451 had that title because that was the temperature that paper in books catches fire.

Paper.

Try igniting damp paper, for instance, vs dry paper. (it's harder, because the moisture needs to be cooked out first.)

If 112 degrees was all that dangerous, cars in parking lots across the South would self immolate every summer.
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression

Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

C S Lewis