Whoa! I don't know what ping means. It was my understanding with you so vehemently supporting the congress woman Native American being sworn in, wearing her Native garb..my understanding was,,you were Native American. There is a thread on here about that, and I posted ALL Ethnicities Native dress. I may have mis-read you were Native American.
I'd love to pull that thread up. Don't know how. All you had to say was, No I am not Native American without getting upset.
My debate point was about, "Europeans being the invaders', not muslims as the invaders. I posted some history on Islamists invasions, BEFORE Europeans started the crusades. It was NOT ABOUT YOUR heritage, but I read many Native Americans are pissed at Europeans. They are not telling the whole story either. Ergo, your belief it is ALL on the Europeans. I don't write as eloquently as you do. Just simple words, the facts.
BEFORE CRUSADES, started it was ISLAMISTS conquering all Christian lands...first. Just like they are doing now, by buying up our MEDIA, TV CHANNELS, SOCIAL SITES.
@LegalAmerican I noticed downthread that someone explained "ping", my apologies for assuming you knew what that is.
I supported the lady in ceremonial dress because it was legitimate American Culture, and knowing the drummers, singers, etc. are part of the ceremony. I have that perspective because my wife is Chippewa, and have learned some of Native culture. It isn't like Liz Warren's Fauxcahontas dress up. It's the real deal, and it is more American than Christmas (which didn't get here until much later).
Moving on,
The Holy Land was taken from the Canaanites by the Hebrews, invaded in the North by Assyrians in the 720s BC, in the South (Jerusalem) by the Babylonians in 516 BC, and later by the Persians, Greeks, Romans, (who eventually became Christian), the Arabs, and along in 661 AD, by Islamists--the Umayyad Caliphate, and a mish mash of other Muslim sects until the Crusades contested that Muslim rule.
Yes, the Muslims had invaded Spain, Portugal, France in the 700s AD, until they were repelled beginning at Tours (Charles Martel) in 732 AD, the beginning of kicking them out of Europe, for the most part. Where the two meet, Christianity and Islam have been in some low level conflict since, unless the Christians knuckled under to Islamic law. Technically, after the Europeans invaded the Roman Empire, they invaded the Holy Land (after they finished kicking out the Muslims who had swept in after the Byzantines.) So, yes, in that sense, Europeans, as such (the descendants of the Visigoths, goths, Gallic Tribes and Vandals, etc.) were indeed invading the Middle East as a cultural bloc for the first time.Consider the Normans had taken over England in 1066 (where some of my ancestors come in), the English and French Lords, Knights, and entourage were indeed invaders of the Middle Eastern region. The had no heritage there except a religious claim, one called up by the Pope in Rome.
I'm not anti-invader
per se--my ancestors made a habit of it--invading is part and parcel of my heritage.
But I
am dead set against being invaded.
As far as people being pissed at Europeans, some are, some aren't. South and Central America speak the language of the conquerors, Spanish or Portugese, for the most part. Are they pissed about that? It wasn't the invasion of the American West, nor losing the war that caused so much resentment, as the Peace--the treatment of the indigenous people. Children were taken from their families, placed in boarding schools and not allowed to speak their own language. What was promised was not delivered. Corruption in the Government bureaucracies overseeing Indian agencies was endemic. People starved. Land title was 'given' by the government, only to be taken away. Often, with my wife's people, the people who rode out with the people who handed them the deed, were the ones there to take the same land for 'back taxes', a treatment that runs akin to the deeds of Carpetbaggers after the Civil War. (Of ten million acres, the tribe ended up with 1280.)
With the Carpetbaggers, it was burn the farm and crops, and then demand either tax money or the land.
The senseless slaughter of Buffalo was the equivalent of burning the crops for the Plains Indians.
Found Gold? So much for "This will be your land until the sun no longer rises in the East." The Black Hills were guaranteed by treaty, then the Government reneged.
Treat people dishonorably, like the GOP treated the TEA party, and they'll resent it, and that resentment will endure until someone either makes good on the problem (their promises), or until no one can remember it.--and
none of us are any different in that regard. We don't like getting screwed over. It is part of Human Nature, not something that 'belongs' to one group or another. So, please, don't try to make this into some sort of "racial" or "cultural" issue. It isn't.
Back to the Middle East, conflict arises in the region because Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all sprang from the region. All have ties to that land, Judaism and Christianity can get along just fine, especially remembering that Christ was a Jew. But the children of Hagar the bondwoman, Ishmael, and the descendants of Ishmael who embraced the teachings of Muhammad don't play nice with others, and often not even each other.
Into the region come people from as far away as England, to seize the city all hold sacred: Jerusalem.
That's an invasion. Not that I have a problem with it. It is what it is.
