Author Topic: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales  (Read 10327 times)

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Online Elderberry

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #175 on: March 07, 2019, 11:19:24 AM »
U.S. Senator Tammy Baldwin Calls on Chairman Graham to Hold Judiciary Committee Hearings on Gun Violence Prevention Legislation

https://www.baldwin.senate.gov/press-releases/judiciary-committee-hearings-on-gun-violence-prevention-bill

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WASHINGTON, D.C. – U.S. Senator Tammy Baldwin joined 37 of her Senate colleagues in calling on Senator Lindsay Graham (R-SC), Chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, to hold hearings on universal background checks legislation.

Last week, the U.S. House of Representatives passed the Bipartisan Background Checks Act. Senator Baldwin and her colleagues helped introduced the Senate counterpart bill, the Background Check Expansion Act, which is currently pending in the Senate Judiciary Committee. The House also passed the Enhanced Background Checks Act, a bill aimed at closing the “Charleston loophole” in the background check system that made it possible for the gunman in Charleston’s AME Church in Graham’s home state to purchase a firearm.

“We noted with interest your statement in the press that you intended to have the Committee work on ‘red flag’ legislation and potentially also background checks, both actions we would strongly support,” the Senators wrote in a letter to Chairman Graham. “We respectfully request that you hold a hearing on this critical legislation as soon as possible.”

The letter, led by Senator Chris Murphy (D-CT), was also signed by U.S. Senators Michael Bennet (D-CO), Richard Blumenthal (D-CT), Cory Booker (D-NJ), Sherrod Brown (D-OH), Ben Cardin (D-MD), Tom Carper (D-DE), Bob Casey (D-PA), Chris Coons (D-DE), Catherine Cortez Masto (D-NV), Tammy Duckworth (D-IL), Dick Durbin (D-IL), Dianne Feinstein (D-CA), Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY), Kamala Harris (D-CA), Maggie Hassan (D-NH), Martin Heinrich (D-NM), Mazie Hirono (D-HI), Tim Kaine (D-VA), Amy Klobuchar (D-MN), Patrick Leahy (D-VT), Edward Markey (D-MA), Bob Menendez (D-NJ), Jeff Merkley (D-OR), Patty Murray (D-WA), Jack Reed (D-RI), Jacky Rosen (D-NV), Brian Schatz (D-HI), Chuck Schumer (D-NY), Jeanne Shaheen (D-NH), Tina Smith (D-MN), Tom Udall (D-NM), Mark Warner (D-VA), Elizabeth Warren (D-MA), Sheldon Whitehouse (D-RI), Ron Wyden (D-OR) and Chris Van Hollen (D-MD).

More at link
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Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #176 on: March 07, 2019, 11:29:44 AM »
This one sentence sums up why your position on firearms ownership is wrong, JH. Any defense of the 2A has to start with a clear understanding of why it was included in the Constitution in the first place.

If the Dems win the White House,  and pack the SCOTUS with liberals,  the Heller decision will be overturned in favor of an interpretation limiting the 2A to the obsolete concept of the citizen militia.    That's the reality.   The gun right, with respect to your own personal security,  needs to be codified, not left dangling to the whim of a future SCOTUS majority.   I understand why it was included in the Constitution in the first place, to address a situation that no longer exists.   In the modern context,  it is seriously defective.   
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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #177 on: March 07, 2019, 11:56:03 AM »
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:(KJV)


There was a time within my lifetime, where the nobility of a woman could best be described in the words, "Don't worry about me, save my baby!"

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@roamer_1

ONLY if she had no existing children to care for.
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Online roamer_1

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #178 on: March 07, 2019, 12:01:57 PM »
@roamer_1

ONLY if she had no existing children to care for.

No. Every woman that I know, of a certain age, would have given themselves to bring that child to life. Every one.

Offline skeeter

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #179 on: March 07, 2019, 12:08:53 PM »
If the Dems win the White House,  and pack the SCOTUS with liberals,  the Heller decision will be overturned in favor of an interpretation limiting the 2A to the obsolete concept of the citizen militia.    That's the reality.   The gun right, with respect to your own personal security,  needs to be codified, not left dangling to the whim of a future SCOTUS majority.   I understand why it was included in the Constitution in the first place, to address a situation that no longer exists.   In the modern context,  it is seriously defective.
Then your opinion is the Constitution is meaningless and we have no basis for discussion.

The 2A was very clearly codified but you're saying that particular codification is defective.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2019, 12:11:01 PM by skeeter »

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #180 on: March 07, 2019, 12:18:14 PM »
Then your opinion is the Constitution is meaningless and we have no basis for discussion.

The 2A was very clearly codified but you're saying that particular codification is defective.

Bingo.  He's been consistent for quite some time in saying the Constitution isn't really the law.  The law is what judges (often leftist activists) say it is.  No matter what the Constitution may say in clear language, it's subject to review by clever lawyers and activist judges.
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
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Offline skeeter

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #181 on: March 07, 2019, 12:20:17 PM »
Bingo.  He's been consistent for quite some time in saying the Constitution isn't really the law.  The law is what judges (often leftist activists) say it is.  No matter what the Constitution may say in clear language, it's subject to review by clever lawyers and activist judges.

So much for Natural Law.

Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #182 on: March 07, 2019, 12:22:11 PM »
Then your opinion is the Constitution is meaningless and we have no basis for discussion.

I have a far more realistic view of the stakes than you do.   But go on, keep on believing the myth that the 2A preserves your right to assemble an arsenal to shoot elected officials when our Republic provides for a perfectly reasonable mechanism for voting the bums out.

Heller was a brilliant decision grounded in the same view of the Constitution's purpose to protect our natural rights that animated Roe v. Wade.    You have the natural right to protect your person,  family and property,  not to circumvent the results of elections by violent overthrow of the government.  This isn't King George, this isn't an unwilling colony of a foreign power, this is a self-governing Constitutional Republic.   The 2A's original purpose is obsolete and functionally meaningless.

What's left is the Heller decision's use of the 2A to establish the individual RKBA.   The decision is Constitutionally sound,  but was opposed by four Justices who read no such individual right into the 2A,  let alone the Constitution's "penumbras and eminations".   The Heller decision - YOUR Constitutional rights - are as fragile as, well,  the right to abortion.   You hate and oppose with all your political might a woman's right to choose?   Then understand fully that liberals hate with equal passion the decision of "unelected judges" to secure your right to keep your family safe.           
« Last Edit: March 07, 2019, 12:27:51 PM by Jazzhead »
"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

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Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #183 on: March 07, 2019, 12:25:55 PM »
Bingo.  He's been consistent for quite some time in saying the Constitution isn't really the law.  The law is what judges (often leftist activists) say it is.  No matter what the Constitution may say in clear language, it's subject to review by clever lawyers and activist judges.

There is no better example of unclear language in the Constitution than the Second Amendment.   You should be thanking clever lawyers and activist judges for the temporary liberty you enjoy today.   If the Dems get their way in the next election and pack the Court,  you can kiss your guns goodbye. 

The only true solution is to Codify!     

"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

"Not forever.  Just for now"

    - Jay Farrar

Online Elderberry

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #184 on: March 07, 2019, 12:37:21 PM »
There is no better example of unclear language in the Constitution than the Second Amendment.   You should be thanking clever lawyers and activist judges for the temporary liberty you enjoy today.   If the Dems get their way in the next election and pack the Court,  you can kiss your guns goodbye. 

The only true solution is to Codify!   

Please show me where codification is needed.

What is CODIFICATION?

https://thelawdictionary.org/codification/

Quote
The process of collecting and arranging the laws of a country or state into a code, t. e., into a complete system of positive law, scientifically ordered, and promulgated by legislative authority.
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Online roamer_1

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #185 on: March 07, 2019, 12:41:03 PM »
I understand why it was included in the Constitution in the first place, to address a situation that no longer exists.

@Jazzhead
What condition exactly 'no longer exists'?

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #186 on: March 07, 2019, 12:49:32 PM »
There is no better example of unclear language in the Constitution than the Second Amendment.   You should be thanking clever lawyers and activist judges for the temporary liberty you enjoy today.   If the Dems get their way in the next election and pack the Court,  you can kiss your guns goodbye. 

The only true solution is to Codify!   

That a God-given right to self defense, secured by plain language in the 2nd Amendment, is "temporary" is a testament to how far off the moorings the Constitution has been dragged by clever lawyers and activist judges.

What makes you think a leftist SCOTUS won't simply scuttle any attempt to "codify" an Amendment to the Constitution?  I'm sure plenty of emanations and penumbras could be created to justify it.
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #187 on: March 07, 2019, 12:51:39 PM »
@Jazzhead
What condition exactly 'no longer exists'?

Distrust of the government.  Everything is hunky-dory now in the modern, a gogo world don'tchaknow?

That is how stupid leftists think we unsophisticates are. 
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
I will NOT comply.
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Online bigheadfred

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #188 on: March 07, 2019, 12:56:11 PM »
There is no better example of unclear language in the Constitution than the Second Amendment.   You should be thanking clever lawyers and activist judges for the temporary liberty you enjoy today.   If the Dems get their way in the next election and pack the Court,  you can kiss your guns goodbye. 

The only true solution is to Codify!   

The only true solution is to declare war.

Offline skeeter

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #189 on: March 07, 2019, 01:17:46 PM »
I have a far more realistic view of the stakes than you do.   But go on, keep on believing the myth that the 2A preserves your right to assemble an arsenal to shoot elected officials when our Republic provides for a perfectly reasonable mechanism for voting the bums out.

If by 'realistic' you mean flaccid I'll agree.

Seriously, I highly doubt your view is more realistic than mine. You obviously cannot see where all of this is inevitably headed. Or maybe you do.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2019, 01:21:11 PM by skeeter »

Offline To-Whose-Benefit?

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #190 on: March 07, 2019, 01:19:17 PM »
An idiot Bill which probably won't get through the Senate.

And This is what the mighty Democrats have birthed out of 2 years of Smoke, Thunder, Empty Promises to 'Impeach Trump' and millions down a Rat Hole HOPING to find a Headline Grabbing, Smoking HINT of Impeachable conduct.
My 'Viking Hunter' High Adventure Alternate History Series is FREE, ALL 3 volumes, at most ebook retailers including Ibooks, Barnes and Noble, Kobo, and more.

In Vol 2 the weapons come out in a winner take all war on two fronts.

Vol 3 opens with the rigged murder trial of the villain in a Viking Court under Viking law to set the stage for the hero's own murder trial.

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Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #191 on: March 07, 2019, 01:20:53 PM »
That a God-given right to self defense, secured by plain language in the 2nd Amendment, is "temporary" is a testament to how far off the moorings the Constitution has been dragged by clever lawyers and activist judges.

What makes you think a leftist SCOTUS won't simply scuttle any attempt to "codify" an Amendment to the Constitution?  I'm sure plenty of emanations and penumbras could be created to justify it.

The God-given right to self-defense is secured by the Heller Court's construction of the 2A.   The 2A's predicate clause permits an alternate construction that would limit the Constitution's protection to the militia context, whatever the heck that means nowadays.   That alternate construction may be just an election or two away.    It is to prevent that from happening that I advocate codification of the individual right.   
"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

"Not forever.  Just for now"

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Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #192 on: March 07, 2019, 01:22:42 PM »
If by 'realistic' you mean flaccid I'll agree.

Seriously, I highly doubt your view is more realistic than mine. You obviously cannot see where all of this is inevitably headed. Or maybe you do.

Ignore my advice at your peril.   Codification of the right is necessary to ensure the protection secured by Heller is not taken away.    Better that than starting a war you won't be able to win.   
"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

"Not forever.  Just for now"

    - Jay Farrar

Offline Restored

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #193 on: March 07, 2019, 01:22:45 PM »
Folks here love to label such women as murderers, 

She doesn't kill the child. She hires someone to do it.
Hahahahaha....No seriously. Who is the President?

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #194 on: March 07, 2019, 01:23:11 PM »
I have a far more realistic view of the stakes than you do.   But go on, keep on believing the myth that the 2A preserves your right to assemble an arsenal to shoot elected officials when our Republic provides for a perfectly reasonable mechanism for voting the bums out.     

What makes you so sure politicians would be shot?  It's cops who will get to find out how well their body armor can withstand a round from a 30-06.

Politicians won't be the ones tasked with disarming the public.  That makes this particular argument a non-sequitur.
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
I will NOT comply.
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Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #195 on: March 07, 2019, 01:25:06 PM »
The only true solution is to declare war.

That's a stupid thing to say.   The principle has already been established by Heller.  Now the task is to work within the framework provided by the Constitution to codify that result so it can't be taken away by a future Court.   
"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

"Not forever.  Just for now"

    - Jay Farrar

Offline Restored

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #196 on: March 07, 2019, 01:26:30 PM »
Bingo.  He's been consistent for quite some time in saying the Constitution isn't really the law. 

And he is correct. The law is whatever the judges say it is. That's why The National Lampoon could exist in  1973 but not in 2019. Same Constitutional right to free expression, different laws.
Hahahahaha....No seriously. Who is the President?

Online Jazzhead

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #197 on: March 07, 2019, 01:28:52 PM »
What makes you so sure politicians would be shot?  It's cops who will get to find out how well their body armor can withstand a round from a 30-06.

Politicians won't be the ones tasked with disarming the public.  That makes this particular argument a non-sequitur.

Do you really think you'd get away with shooting cops?    Seriously,  the idiotic braggadocio of some gunowners is amazing.   

It took 200 years,  but the Court has finally recognized the individual right.   Build on that recognition by codifying it.   Sure beats shooting cops - that's a war you won't be able to win.   
"He was born poor, died rich, and never hurt anyone along the way"

   - Duke Ellington, upon hearing of the death of Louis Armstrong

"Not forever.  Just for now"

    - Jay Farrar

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #198 on: March 07, 2019, 01:30:11 PM »
The God-given right to self-defense is secured by the Heller Court's construction of the 2A.   The 2A's predicate clause permits an alternate construction that would limit the Constitution's protection to the militia context, whatever the heck that means nowadays.   That alternate construction may be just an election or two away.    It is to prevent that from happening that I advocate codification of the individual right.   

Nope.  The Heller decisions does not secure the God-given right.  The 2nd Amendment does,  and a leftist SCOTUS will scuttle any attempts to codify with relative ease on the way to a total ban on civilian ownership of firearms.

That's it for me...I refuse to engage your circle-talk.  I'm just watching this thread to make sure it doesn't get hijacked again. 
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
I will NOT comply.
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: House passes bill to require universal background checks on gun sales
« Reply #199 on: March 07, 2019, 01:31:21 PM »
Do you really think you'd get away with shooting cops?    Seriously,  the idiotic braggadocio of some gunowners is amazing.   

It took 200 years,  but the Court has finally recognized the individual right.   Build on that recognition by codifying it.   Sure beats shooting cops - that's a war you won't be able to win.   

Oh, since you mentioned it...I'm not the one who brought up shooting people.  You did.
Don't call it the "Federal Government," that's an insult to the Founders.  It's a "National Government."
I will NOT comply.
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