Author Topic: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter  (Read 595 times)

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Offline libertybele

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Ouch. IF true, this will sink his ship even more so that no wall.

Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter

Average tax refunds were down last week 8.4 percent for the first week of the tax season over the same time last year, according to the Internal Revenue Service. Dipping refunds are inflaming a growing army of taxpayers stunned by the consequences of the Trump administration’s tax law — and the effects of the partial government shutdown.

The average refund check paid out so far has been $1,865, down from $2,035 at the same point in 2018, according to IRS data. Low-income taxpayers often file early to pocket the money as soon as possible. Many taxpayers count on the refunds to make important payments, or spend the money on things like home repairs, a vacation or a car.

The IRS had estimated it would issue about 2.3 percent fewer refunds this year as a result of the changes in the federal tax law, according to Bloomberg. MSNBC reports that 30 million Americans will owe the IRS money this year — 3 million more than before Trump’s tax law.

“There are going to be a lot of unhappy people over the next month,” Edward Karl of the American Institute of CPAs told Politico. “Taxpayers want a large refund.” Some 71 percent of taxpayers received refunds last year worth about $3,000 on average, according to Karl.

Scads of taxpayers are complaining on Twitter that they have always received a refund — but now owe the IRS instead. .....

https://www.yahoo.com/huffpost/average-tax-refunds-down-8-054836423.html
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Offline bigheadfred

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2019, 06:26:14 PM »
My federal is the same as last year. I filed early. A small refund. The check is in the mail. My state refund is slightly less than last year. I count that due to making more in overtime pay. 

Offline Sanguine

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2019, 06:31:21 PM »
But, wouldn't that be expected in high-tax states? 
Cui bono?

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Offline skeeter

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2019, 06:34:42 PM »
But, wouldn't that be expected in high-tax states?

The government reduced the amount of property tax paid that can be deducted from our federal returns. In a county like mine that charges an obscene amount this results in a big hit.

The idiots in this state deserve it. I'm just collateral damage.

Offline libertybele

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2019, 06:35:22 PM »
But, wouldn't that be expected in high-tax states?

I would think so.  It's early in the tax season. We'll see what the reaction is from the majority of people around mid-March.  Trump and the GOP proclaimed that the middle class in general would be paying less taxes because of the tax cuts.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 06:36:52 PM by libertybele »
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Offline Mesaclone

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2019, 06:36:35 PM »
But, wouldn't that be expected in high-tax states?

That is precisely right Taxpayers from high income tax states like New York and California are going to pay more as they can’t deduct state tax from Federal...something they should never have been allowed to do in the first place.  So too bad if their high tax state taxes are finally impacting them as they should have all along. Its fiscal justice for conservative folks who ensure their states keep taxes low.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2019, 06:37:46 PM »
The government reduced the amount of property tax paid that can be deducted from our federal returns. In a county like mine that charges an obscene amount this results in a big hit.

The idiots in this state deserve it. I'm just collateral damage.

I live in Massachusetts it was a huge hit for me.

"Deserving it" won't help the GOP or Trump in the next election.
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Offline The Ghost

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2019, 06:38:26 PM »
So..let me get this straight... these morons are mad because they arn't getting a big refund in jan-Feb, rather than having more cash in their check each payday is a bad thing?   Have they ever heard of a savings account? 

We are doomed as a country.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 06:39:25 PM by The Ghost »

Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2019, 06:39:57 PM »
I'm curious if they also altered the withholding tables.

I'd care a lot more about what I paid in total than what I got back.
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Offline libertybele

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2019, 06:41:36 PM »
I live in Massachusetts it was a huge hit for me.

"Deserving it" won't help the GOP or Trump in the next election.

No definitely not especially since 'tax cuts' were supposed to be one of Trump's greatest accomplishments.

People are back to work is one thing, but people who have been working and don't see any tax relief or our paying more, isn't going to bode well for the GOP come 2020. 
"I believe in the United States of America as a Government of the people, by the people, for the people; whose just powers are derived from the consent of the governed; a democracy in a republic; a sovereign nation of many sovereign states; a perfect union one and inseparable; established upon those principles of freedom, equality, justice and humanity for which American patriots sacrificed their lives and fortunes. I therefore believe it is my duty to my country to love it; to support its Constitution; to obey it laws; to respect its flag; and to defend it against all enemies." -William Page

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2019, 06:41:52 PM »
So..let me get this straight... these morons are mad because they arn't getting a big refund in jan-Feb, rather than having more cash in their check each payday is a bad thing?   Have they ever heard of a savings account? 

We are doomed as a country.

You ever see the man on the street segment, I can't remember who did it, where the guy was asking people how much taxes they paid that year and most of them said "None, I got money back!"

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2019, 06:43:47 PM »
So..let me get this straight... these morons are mad because they arn't getting a big refund in jan-Feb, rather than having more cash in their check each payday is a bad thing?   Have they ever heard of a savings account? 

We are doomed as a country.

Ok, but I don't seem to be making a ton more compared to last year each pay check.

It would be interesting to see what my effective tax rate is this year vs. last year.
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Offline The Ghost

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2019, 06:44:20 PM »
The Article said "Low  Income" tax payers are pissed.  Not the slubs that live in High property tax states.

Offline bigheadfred

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2019, 06:50:10 PM »
Ok, but I don't seem to be making a ton more compared to last year each pay check.

It would be interesting to see what my effective tax rate is this year vs. last year.

After some consideration I have determined my net gain, with more on my paycheck per week, was more than the year before.

Offline skeeter

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2019, 06:55:24 PM »
I live in Massachusetts it was a huge hit for me.

"Deserving it" won't help the GOP or Trump in the next election.

Like there is a snowballs chance in hell of any republican winning either of those states in our's or our children's lifetimes.

Offline skeeter

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2019, 06:56:58 PM »
The Article said "Low  Income" tax payers are pissed.  Not the slubs that live in High property tax states.

They said 'average' returns are down. The slubs' returns drive those figures down.

Online Bigun

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2019, 07:05:53 PM »
Refunds may well be down but it's likely that the total amount actually paid did as well.

Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2019, 07:06:23 PM »
Just calculated my effective tax rate for 2017 and 2018:

2017: 14.9%
2018: 13.2%

Interesting.

Effective tax rate= (total taxes / AGI) * 100
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 07:07:53 PM by Weird Tolkienish Figure »
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Online Bigun

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2019, 07:08:42 PM »
Just calculated my effective tax rate for 2017 and 2018:

2017: 14.9%
2018: 13.2%

Interesting.

Effective tax rate= total taxes / AGI.

There ya go!  That's the number that matters IMHO.

Offline bigheadfred

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2019, 07:32:18 PM »
Just calculated my effective tax rate for 2017 and 2018:

2017: 14.9%
2018: 13.2%

Interesting.

Effective tax rate= (total taxes / AGI) * 100

Wthout digging out my tax stuff and knowing what the increase on my paycheck was, the amount I am getting back + the increase on my paychecks is about $600 more (2018) than my refund the (2017) year. So I have no complaint.

Online Fishrrman

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2019, 08:45:44 PM »
What most people can't understand is it's not the "size of the refund" that matters, but the amount of your income you actually pay in taxes for the year.

I'm going to guess that some of this is a result of new withholding tables used by employers. More "take home" pay each week, but with lower withholding. So... when tax time arrives, there's less to get back.

Having said that, for 2018 my gross income increased by about $2,000 over 2017, and my tax obligation actually DECREASED by about $600 or so. Needless to say, I'm pleased with "the Trump tax cut"...

Offline montanajoe

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #21 on: February 09, 2019, 10:12:48 PM »

....
"Deserving it" won't help the GOP or Trump in the next election.
.....

The GOP always believes the wealthiest are "Deserving It" the middle class not so much.... :shrug:

And the poor forgittabout it they are lazy...
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 10:16:16 PM by montanajoe »

Offline LegalAmerican

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Re: Average Tax Refunds Down 8.4 Percent As Angry Taxpayers Vent On Twitter
« Reply #22 on: February 09, 2019, 10:35:11 PM »
What most people can't understand is it's not the "size of the refund" that matters, but the amount of your income you actually pay in taxes for the year.

I'm going to guess that some of this is a result of new withholding tables used by employers. More "take home" pay each week, but with lower withholding. So... when tax time arrives, there's less to get back.

Having said that, for 2018 my gross income increased by about $2,000 over 2017, and my tax obligation actually DECREASED by about $600 or so. Needless to say, I'm pleased with "the Trump tax cut"...

YES!   People really don't know how 1040 tax works, do they.  YOU HAVE A GOOD GRASP of it.

If a person receives MORE INCOME in their net paycheck due to LESS WITHHOLDING from paycheck, they will have , In theory, less withholding returned to them at end of year.  1040 taxes are to be paid,  as you go along, and supposed to be at least 90% of your tax estimated for the year. W-4  form is to help one figure out  how many dependents/exemptions they  should  take.  So, if employe takes out LESS withholding, by new tax laws, one is getting their "tax refund' early.  IT IS  ALL YOUR MONEY.

 END OF YEAR..1040 does a reconciliation of your income & expenses for the year.

Credits.  One can either have the government "keep" your money till end of year, or..HAVE IT GIVEN TO YOU IN YOUR PAYCHECK, all year long.

So, you can USE your money, save it, invest it, through the year or give it to GOVERNMENT to keep for you without any
interest paid.  There is an over all tax % DECREASE .  Going by memory.  0....TO 50,000....PAY ZERO TAX.

People who have EARNED INCOME CREDIT...up to about $5,500...and increased CHILD CREDIT, $2,000 per child?, will receive back the most money from FROM ACTUAL GOVERNMENT CASH CREDIT.   Child credit was doubled. I don't remember if it was 1 or 2 thousand each child before the doubling.

If you made too much money for EIC & no chidden, and paid in too much W.HOLDING....it will be refunded to you.

It is your own money; either received in pay check, through out the year, or 'saved' by government and paid in one lump sum later. 
« Last Edit: February 09, 2019, 10:41:33 PM by LegalAmerican »


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