Khashoggi murder: Saudi crown prince crazy, says US senator

[libertybele]

This is concerning.  There is a definite contradiction as to what Pompeo and Mattis told the Senate to what the head of the CIA told the Senate.  Obviously one side has to be lying and the other side has to be covering up.  If Trump and Pompeo are covering for the Saudi crown prince, why?  If Haspel is lying, why??

Khashoggi murder: Saudi crown prince crazy, says US senator

Members of the Senate's Committee on Foreign Relations did not mince words after the briefing by CIA Director Gina Haspel on Tuesday.

"There is not a smoking gun - there is a smoking saw," Mr Graham said, referring to Khashoggi's alleged dismemberment in the Saudi consulate in Istanbul in October.

The senator said he could not support Saudi Arabia's involvement in the war in Yemen or arms sales to the Saudi government as long as the crown prince remained in power.

Senator Bob Menendez, a New Jersey Democrat, echoed those views.

He said the US must "send a clear and unequivocal message that such actions are not acceptable in the world's stage".....

....The Senate is planning to vote on a proposal to end US military support to the Saudi-led coalition fighting in Yemen, after members of both parties advanced the resolution last week.

Senator Chris Murphy, who was not privy to Tuesday's briefing, criticised the Trump administration.

"Not everything needs to be secret," the Connecticut Democrat tweeted.

"If our government knows that Saudi leaders were involved in the murder of a US resident, why shouldn't the public know this?"
Image Copyright @ChrisMurphyCT @ChrisMurphyCT ...........

........At last week's hearing, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo and Defence Secretary James Mattis told senators there was no direct evidence of the crown prince's involvement in Khashoggi's death.

President Trump has said the CIA findings on the crown prince were not conclusive.

On 20 November he said: "It could very well be that the crown prince had knowledge of this tragic event - maybe he did and maybe he didn't."..............

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46435819

[edpc]

This is concerning.  There is a definite contradiction as to what Pompeo and Mattis told the Senate to what the head of the CIA told the Senate.  Obviously one side has to be lying and the other side has to be covering up.  If Trump and Pompeo are covering for the Saudi crown prince, why?  If Haspel is lying, why??

They don’t give guarantees.  Remember the WMD ‘slam dunk’....?  Haspel gave the president and senators the same material.  They say they have ‘high confidence’ in the prince’s involvement.  That’s basically saying ‘he did it,’ but also gives Trump wiggle room to say no.  He’s trying to preserve future defense bids, which are part of Saudi letters of intent, extending out for the next decade.  Also, the kingdom has threatened to retaliate with oil prices and cause global economic chaos, if any direct measures are taken against the CP.  That demonstrates what a true ally they are.

[libertybele]

They don’t give guarantees.  Remember the WMD ‘slam dunk’....?  Haspel gave the president and senators the same material.  They say they have ‘high confidence’ in the prince’s involvement.  That’s basically saying ‘he did it,’ but also gives Trump wiggle room to say no.  He’s trying to preserve future defense bids, which are part of Saudi letters of intent, extending out for the next decade.  Also, the kingdom has threatened to retaliate with oil prices and cause global economic chaos, if any direct measures are taken against the CP.  That demonstrates what a true ally they are.

I understand what you are saying, but in the same light, he cannot be allowed to get away with murder.  Last time I checked the US produces or has the ability to produce more oil than that entire region.  Let them eat their oil.  It is high time that the US becomes solely dependent on its own oil and needs to ramp up production and the process of shale.

[edpc]

I understand what you are saying, but in the same light, he cannot be allowed to get away with murder.  Last time I checked the US produces or has the ability to produce more oil than that entire region.  Let them eat their oil.  It is high time that the US becomes solely dependent on its own oil and needs to ramp up production and the process of shale.

I agree and have said as much in previous threads.  However, the production of US oil requires the prices to be a bit higher, for it to be worthwhile. So long as the US consumer understands that, we could be energy independent.  We have enough energy reserves to be self-sufficient and use them for discovering the next big leap in energy technology – whatever that may be.

[Free Vulcan]

All this manufactured outrage is because 1) They want to use this to stick it to Trump, and 2) Khashoggi was one of their liberal butt buddies.

This isn't worth the time it takes to spit, not to mention it's happened all over the world more times than you can count and never hardly a peep till now.

[edpc]

All this manufactured outrage is because 1) They want to use this to stick it to Trump, and 2) Khashoggi was one of their liberal butt buddies.

This isn't worth the time it takes to spit, not to mention it's happened all over the world more times than you can count and never hardly a peep till now.

You’re leaving out the most important element. We wouldn’t know much about this, if it wasn’t for Erogan making sure it got out. Turkey wants to pit the US, Saudi Arabia, and Iran against each other and come out as the dominant force in the region.

[Free Vulcan]

You’re leaving out the most important element. We wouldn’t know much about this, if it wasn’t for Erogan making sure it got out. Turkey wants to pit the US, Saudi Arabia, and Iran against each other and come out as the dominant force in the region.

Knowing Erdogan, I don't doubt that for a second. He has delusions of grandeur.

[Fishrrman]

Free Vulcan wrote:
"This isn't worth the time it takes to spit, not to mention it's happened all over the world more times than you can count and never hardly a peep till now."

Agreed, and I've been posting this for weeks now.

This Kashoggi was a POS member of the muslim brotherhood, no friend of The West.
Frankly, the Saudis probably did The West a favor by getting rid of him.

Who cares who ordered it?
It's "family business" to them. They ARE NOT "like us".

Just fuhgeddaboutit this, and move on.

[TomSea]

Yeah, if he was a member of the MB who by the way, were elected in a free election in Egypt, Erdogan also sympathizes with the MB.... that's probably milder than Wahhabism out of KSA which is the true father of ISIS.

Saudi Arabia got caught, they should have been sneakier like the Russians or some other countries that assassinate folks. They didn't. And unfortunately, they may have a price to pay.  They carried this out very sloppily and honestly, probably shouldn't try to knock off folks in a foreign country in their own embassy. They asked for it by pulling this off so poorly and amateurishly.

We may have been in error to tell them to give free elections but if one notes, that idea started with Afghanistan and Iraq and how they should have free elections.

Weren't some of Human Abedin's relatives MB as well?  Not to water it down but after all, it is their elections, not ours.

[TomSea]

They have a bunch of princes. Maybe they need to move another one into line for succession.  I do know there are reported power struggles over this.

The Saudis may be doing wrong in the war in Yemen which would mean, we are also doing wrong if this is so. I don't know what the truth is, this is a key point for Senator Paul and perhaps the others. Every President in memory has made big foreign policy errors, with Obama, it's Libya just for starters. We need to get away from doing this, at least, as frequently, as it happens.

For the record, we were involved in Yemen going back to Obama's administration though (2015 at least), our role seems to be limited in giving intelligence and apparently, supplying/selling the Saudis weapons. It's a mess, I'm not necessarily judging, just saying what we know.