Author Topic: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party  (Read 19086 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #125 on: November 19, 2018, 10:27:24 PM »
If I were in charge of everything I'd close the borders to all but the most productive people and kick out any immigrant that's a net loss to the cost of the federal government. I think that'd go a long way towards making it possible.

You really do not like the necessary implications of your own ideas.  Come on, own it.  Since blacks are a distinct social, cultural, and ethnic minority, you will have to get rid of them in order to accomplish the necessary homogeneity for Scandinavian socialism.  Will you gas the ghettoes, or just wall them in and starve them to death?

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #126 on: November 19, 2018, 10:29:34 PM »
You really do not like the necessary implications of your own ideas.  Come on, own it.  Since blacks are a distinct social, cultural, and ethnic minority, you will have to get rid of them in order to accomplish the necessary homogeneity for Scandinavian socialism.  Will you gas the ghettoes, or just wall them in and starve them to death?

I just think you're wrong that it won't work because black people.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #127 on: November 19, 2018, 10:33:35 PM »
If we did something equivalent to what Sweden did and let 40 million people that don't speak English into the country it would probably make any social program impossible and have horrifying ramifications all throughout our society.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline Smokin Joe

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 25,445
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #128 on: November 19, 2018, 10:34:50 PM »
That may be true, but that doesn't make people like Bernie evil. I think it's very important to make that distinction. Not doing so is dangerous.
The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

These folks just wanted people's shoes to fit better. Who could argue with that idea?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoe-fitting_fluoroscope
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression


There are no "Socialists", no "Progressives", only Communists, with every negative image that totalitarianism might muster, demanding fealty and conformity to their views, with a legacy of 150,000,000 dead and counting.

Offline Smokin Joe

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 25,445
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #129 on: November 19, 2018, 10:35:37 PM »
If we did something equivalent to what Sweden did and let 40 million people that don't speak English into the country it would probably make any social program impossible and have horrifying ramifications all throughout our society.
Si!

Oh, wait.....
How God must weep at humans' folly! Stand fast! God knows what he is doing!
Seventeen Techniques for Truth Suppression


There are no "Socialists", no "Progressives", only Communists, with every negative image that totalitarianism might muster, demanding fealty and conformity to their views, with a legacy of 150,000,000 dead and counting.

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #130 on: November 19, 2018, 10:36:10 PM »
The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

No arguments there. Bad results aren't always caused by bad people.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline roamer_1

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 17,874
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #131 on: November 19, 2018, 10:36:33 PM »

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 15,881
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #132 on: November 19, 2018, 11:22:18 PM »
Bernie claims that he doesn't stand for communism, but instead for something similar to what they do in the Scandinavian countries. He's never spoken of removing the private sector, which is a mandatory part of achieving communism. He wants rich people to pay a lot more taxes to offset the cost of things like universal healthcare and government funded college. I know a lot of conservatives think that's communism/socialism but that's just factually incorrect. The Scandinavian countries are capitalist.

@Dexter

The Swedes were able to get away with that for a couple of reasons,the prime ones being an educated population that WANTED to work,and all that North Shore oil money coming in to help pay for it. Mega oil bucks and a educated and hard-working SMALL population are the two prime factors.

Then they got cocky and started importing Muslim parasites as pets,so Sweden's days as a First World Nation are numbered.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This post has been approved by Mod 3 or you wouldn't be seeing it.

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 15,881
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #133 on: November 19, 2018, 11:32:19 PM »

Maybe the Russians wouldn't be so sore at us if we didn't think they're basically as bad as Hitler and the Nazis.

@Dexter

Say WHAT????? The Soviets made the Nazi's look like child care workers by comparison. Do you know NOTHING of history?

Hell,they were even allies that split Poland between them before Hitler screwed Stalin by invading the USSR.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This post has been approved by Mod 3 or you wouldn't be seeing it.

Offline LMAO

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3,356
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #134 on: November 19, 2018, 11:52:43 PM »
@Dexter

The Swedes were able to get away with that for a couple of reasons,the prime ones being an educated population that WANTED to work,and all that North Shore oil money coming in to help pay for it. Mega oil bucks and a educated and hard-working SMALL population are the two prime factors.

Then they got cocky and started importing Muslim parasites as pets,so Sweden's days as a First World Nation are numbered.

Over time, their  welfare state will face more strain as, like us, their population ages
« Last Edit: November 19, 2018, 11:53:42 PM by LMAO »
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #135 on: November 20, 2018, 12:39:57 AM »
@Dexter

Say WHAT????? The Soviets made the Nazi's look like child care workers by comparison. Do you know NOTHING of history?

Hell,they were even allies that split Poland between them before Hitler screwed Stalin by invading the USSR.

Cultures change. They're not what they once were. They're far from perfect obviously, but it's not the same anymore. We should be attempting to repair relations with Russia.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2018, 12:40:45 AM by Dexter »
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline LMAO

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3,356
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #136 on: November 20, 2018, 01:57:53 AM »
Driven people aren't going to give up because of higher taxes. It hasn't happened in the Scandinavian countries and it wouldn't happen here.

 So why has there been movement by businesses and people from higher tax states to lower tax states?
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

Online verga

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4,127
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #137 on: November 20, 2018, 08:23:03 AM »
@Dexter

Again, what happens when "the rich" decide that higher taxes have taken away their incentive to work, and they choose to stay at home instead?  Who's going to pay for all the free stuff then?
The Tax System Explained - Using a Beer Analogy
8 April 2016
Esme Shakeshaft
Suppose that once a week, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to £100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this...

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay £1.
The sixth would pay £3.
The seventh would pay £7.
The eighth would pay £12.
The ninth would pay £18.
And the tenth man (the richest) would pay £59. 
So, that's what they decided to do.
 
The ten men drank in the bar every week and seemed quite happy with the arrangement until, one day, the owner caused them a little problem. "Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your weekly beer by £20." Drinks for the ten men would now cost just £80.
 
The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free but what about the other six men? The paying customers? How could they divide the £20 windfall so that everyone would get his fair share? They realized that £20 divided by six is £3.33 but if they subtracted that from everybody's share then not only would the first four men still be drinking for free but the fifth and sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. 

So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fairer to reduce each man's bill by a higher percentage. They decided to follow the principle of the tax system they had been using and he proceeded to work out the amounts he suggested that each should now pay.

And so, the fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (a100% saving).
The sixth man now paid £2 instead of £3 (a 33% saving).
The seventh man now paid £5 instead of £7 (a 28% saving).
The eighth man now paid £9 instead of £12 (a 25% saving).
The ninth man now paid £14 instead of £18 (a 22% saving).
And the tenth man now paid £49 instead of £59 (a 16% saving). 
Each of the last six was better off than before with the first four continuing to drink for free. 

But, once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings. "I only got £1 out of the £20 saving," declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man, "but he got £10!" 
"Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man. "I only saved a £1 too. It's unfair that he got ten times more benefit than me!" 

"That's true!" shouted the seventh man. "Why should he get £10 back, when I only got £2? The wealthy get all the breaks!" 

"Wait a minute," yelled the first four men in unison, "we didn't get anything at all. This new tax system exploits the poor!" The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up. 

The next week the tenth man didn't show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had their beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important - they didn't have enough money between all of them to pay for even half of the bill! 

And that, boys and girls, journalists and government ministers, is how our tax system works. The people who already pay the highest taxes will naturally get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy and they just might not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas, where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
�More than any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness. The other, to total extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly.�-Woody Allen
If God invented marathons to keep people from doing anything more stupid, the triathlon must have taken him completely by surprise.

Offline GrouchoTex

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,581
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #138 on: November 20, 2018, 08:58:37 AM »
Bernie claims that he doesn't stand for communism, but instead for something similar to what they do in the Scandinavian countries. He's never spoken of removing the private sector, which is a mandatory part of achieving communism. He wants rich people to pay a lot more taxes to offset the cost of things like universal healthcare and government funded college. I know a lot of conservatives think that's communism/socialism but that's just factually incorrect. The Scandinavian countries are capitalist.

Sweden is going more capitalist all the time.
Why?
Because they have discovered that Scandinavian socialism just doesn't work, even in Scandinavia.
See "Sweden: Lessons for America?".

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #139 on: November 20, 2018, 09:04:35 AM »
Sweden is going more capitalist all the time.
Why?
Because they have discovered that Scandinavian socialism just doesn't work, even in Scandinavia.
See "Sweden: Lessons for America?".

Sweden has never not been capitalist. The main difference between left and right in Sweden is stances on immigration. The right has gained momentum recently because of immigration issues. The Scandinavian countries will never reverse course on their humanitarian priorities when it comes to their citizens. If the impression you got is that they'll stop universal healthcare, or stop subsidizing college costs for their young people, you are mistaken.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 15,881
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #140 on: November 20, 2018, 09:05:32 AM »
Cultures change. They're not what they once were. They're far from perfect obviously, but it's not the same anymore. We should be attempting to repair relations with Russia.

@Dexter

This is one case where I am in complete agreement with you. I have been on record for years stating that the US,Russia,and England should be the "Big Three" Alliance. Now that England has invited Muslim invaders to just come right in and take over their country,they are on their own AFAIAC.

Still,America and Russia working together as allies are unbeatable. The Muslim uprising the globalists dream of would be squashed like a bug,and given the Russian tendency to be "Russians",would have too few survivors to continue when the smoke settled. Don't forget,the Russians have already lived in a Soviet police state,so they know what living in a police state is like,and there is no way in HELL they are going to roll over and live in a Muslim police state.

Between Clinton and Obomber,that seems less likely today than ever,though.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This post has been approved by Mod 3 or you wouldn't be seeing it.

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #141 on: November 20, 2018, 09:09:03 AM »
@Dexter

This is one case where I am in complete agreement with you. I have been on record for years stating that the US,Russia,and England should be the "Big Three" Alliance. Now that England has invited Muslim invaders to just come right in and take over their country,they are on their own AFAIAC.

Still,America and Russia working together as allies are unbeatable. The Muslim uprising the globalists dream of would be squashed like a bug,and given the Russian tendency to be "Russians",would have too few survivors to continue when the smoke settled. Don't forget,the Russians have already lived in a Soviet police state,so they know what living in a police state is like,and there is no way in HELL they are going to roll over and live in a Muslim police state.

Between Clinton and Obomber,that seems less likely today than ever,though.

We need to stop demonizing the Russians so much. We're not perfect either, y'know? They're a powerful and prideful people. They'd make amazing allies. I'm glad we're in agreement on this.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline LMAO

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 3,356
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #142 on: November 20, 2018, 09:11:00 AM »
Periodically, the CBO assesses our fiscal situation and will state what needs to be done to try to repair it

I have yet to read a CBO report that recommends “free” healthcare and college for all as a remedy

And rising interest rates with 21 trillion in debt will complicate any new spending
I have little interest in streamlining government or in making it more efficient, for I mean to reduce its size. I do not undertake to promote welfare, for I propose to extend freedom. My aim is not to pass laws, but to repeal them.

Barry Goldwater

http://www.usdebtclock.org

My Avatar is my adult autistic son Tommy

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 15,881
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #143 on: November 20, 2018, 09:19:48 AM »
Sweden has never not been capitalist. The main difference between left and right in Sweden is stances on immigration. The right has gained momentum recently because of immigration issues. The Scandinavian countries will never reverse course on their humanitarian priorities when it comes to their citizens. If the impression you got is that they'll stop universal healthcare, or stop subsidizing college costs for their young people, you are mistaken.

@Dexter

Really? What will happen when their industries all fail due to being forced to hire Muslim workers that don't give a damn about anything other than Islam and money,and the uber wealthy Swedes move all their money out of the country and invest it in Asia,for example,instead?

How are they going to continue to subsidize every goober with a pulse when the North Sea oil money isn't enough to cover expenses?
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This post has been approved by Mod 3 or you wouldn't be seeing it.

Offline Hoodat

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 6,857
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #144 on: November 20, 2018, 09:23:27 AM »
I have yet to read a CBO report that recommends “free” healthcare and college for all as a remedy

And rising interest rates with 21 trillion in debt will complicate any new spending

But . . . but . . . but "free stuff" isn't supposed to cost anything.
If a political party does not have its foundation in the determination to advance a cause that is right and that is moral, then it is not a political party; it is merely a conspiracy to seize power.

-Dwight Eisenhower-

Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #145 on: November 20, 2018, 09:25:05 AM »
@Dexter

Really? What will happen when their industries all fail due to being forced to hire Muslim workers that don't give a damn about anything other than Islam and money,and the uber wealthy Swedes move all their money out of the country and invest it in Asia,for example,instead?

How are they going to continue to subsidize every goober with a pulse when the North Sea oil money isn't enough to cover expenses?

They're becoming harder on immigration rapidly because of what happened with the Muslim immigrants. They will correct that mistake. Their countries are not going to fall apart. Their economies are doing fine.
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates

Offline sneakypete

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 15,881
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #146 on: November 20, 2018, 09:26:32 AM »
We need to stop demonizing the Russians so much. We're not perfect either, y'know? They're a powerful and prideful people. They'd make amazing allies. I'm glad we're in agreement on this.

@Dexter

I have been to Russia a couple of times on vacation as a lone traveler,living in Russian hotels or apartments,and hiring local drivers,etc,etc,etc. It has been MY experience back in the 80's that most Russians really like Americans,but they seem to think we are all gullible fools because without exception EVER Russian I befriended warned me to "NEVER trust a Russian! They will lie to you!" I thought that was hilarious.

This was back right after the USSR imploded,and almost all the Russians I met were glad it failed and very happy to meet and socialize with an American. Then "Clinton happened",along with the theft of most of the World Bank funds given to help Russia survive the first winter after the collapse of their government,and it was followed by another 4 years of Clinton corruption and outright theft. I have been told that Americans are not as welcome there now as we were back then.

Putin,and the Russian people have damn good reasons to be suspicious of us,thanks to the freaking Clinton's,who ironically enough rose to power as Soviet agents.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This post has been approved by Mod 3 or you wouldn't be seeing it.

Offline GrouchoTex

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,581
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #147 on: November 20, 2018, 09:31:09 AM »
Sweden has never not been capitalist. The main difference between left and right in Sweden is stances on immigration. The right has gained momentum recently because of immigration issues. The Scandinavian countries will never reverse course on their humanitarian priorities when it comes to their citizens. If the impression you got is that they'll stop universal healthcare, or stop subsidizing college costs for their young people, you are mistaken.

Now you are telling me I have gotten impressions that I never expressed?
There you go again, changing the tune.

I've made the statement, and stand by it 100% the the previous model of socialism they've employed since the 70's had to be changed, or else it would have collapsed.
They have just under 10 million people, so they can probably work out a system on healthcare and education issues that works for them.
They are smaller than a lot of our states.
States?
Oh yeah, that reminds me, we have a 10th amendment!
If the states want to subsidize college education and free healthcare, go ahead, but leave the Federal Government out of it.
One single version for over 300 million people would wreck the economy.



Offline endicom

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 10,115
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #148 on: November 20, 2018, 09:33:02 AM »
@Dexter

Really? What will happen when their industries all fail due to being forced to hire Muslim workers that don't give a damn about anything other than Islam and money...


That problem preceded the Islamic influx and forced the government to be less generous to non-workers. The Islamic problem is its own thing.


Offline Dexter

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 5,418
Re: Ocasio-Cortez prepares for war… on her own party
« Reply #149 on: November 20, 2018, 09:50:51 AM »
Now you are telling me I have gotten impressions that I never expressed?
There you go again, changing the tune.

I've made the statement, and stand by it 100% the the previous model of socialism they've employed since the 70's had to be changed, or else it would have collapsed.
They have just under 10 million people, so they can probably work out a system on healthcare and education issues that works for them.
They are smaller than a lot of our states.
States?
Oh yeah, that reminds me, we have a 10th amendment!
If the states want to subsidize college education and free healthcare, go ahead, but leave the Federal Government out of it.
One single version for over 300 million people would wreck the economy.

I agree with letting the states decide, but our government won't let that happen either. The left and right step all over each other and everything gets screwed up for everybody. For the record the U.S has a lot more land and cash flow than Sweden. Our higher population doesn't make it impossible here.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2018, 09:52:30 AM by Dexter »
"I know one thing, that I know nothing."
-Socrates


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf