Author Topic: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products  (Read 2591 times)

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Offline Applewood

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FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« on: July 19, 2018, 05:12:17 pm »
FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products



Quote
Got milk? Maybe not.

Federal regulators signaled this week they intend to crack down on non-dairy products billing themselves as “milk” — reversing a trend that allowed soy and almond drinks to proliferate on supermarket shelves.

Federal rules, which have largely gone unenforced, define the mom-pleasing, bone-building milk as coming from the “milking of one or more healthy cows.”

Word of the change came from the Food and Drug Administration’s top boss, Commissioner Scott Gottlieb, at an event in Washington D.C 

...
 

More at:

https://nypost.com/2018/07/18/fda-plans-to-crack-down-on-alternative-milk-products/



Offline INVAR

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2018, 05:23:06 pm »
God forbid one aspect of life is untouched and unregulated by the federal Beast in D.C.

And yet people wonder why it is that companies are moving their operations overseas.

I certainly would never start a business again in this country.
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Offline thackney

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2018, 05:29:30 pm »
I can agree with not using the term milk for soy and almond juice.

But I do not agree that the lactation production from mammary glands on mammals other than bovine cannot be called milk.

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Offline INVAR

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2018, 06:03:17 pm »
I can agree with not using the term milk for soy and almond juice.

Is that because people are too stupid to understand that you cannot milk an almond or a soybean and they need the government to keep them safe from wrong assumptions?
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline ABX

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2018, 06:12:17 pm »
I can agree with not using the term milk for soy and almond juice.

But I do not agree that the lactation production from mammary glands on mammals other than bovine cannot be called milk.



The dictionary definition of milk also includes "any liquid resembling this, as the liquid within a coconut, the juice or sap of certain plants, or various pharmaceutical preparations.".

This is nothing more than lobbyists for one industry using the hammer of the government to try to stifle competition. No sane person will confuse Almond Milk with something that comes from a cow udder, but it is still by definition, milk.

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #5 on: July 19, 2018, 06:24:30 pm »
The dictionary definition of milk also includes "any liquid resembling this, as the liquid within a coconut, the juice or sap of certain plants, or various pharmaceutical preparations.".

This is nothing more than lobbyists for one industry using the hammer of the government to try to stifle competition. No sane person will confuse Almond Milk with something that comes from a cow udder, but it is still by definition, milk.

Technically speaking, the liquid within a coconut is "coconut water".  Coconut milk is made from pulping the "meat" of the coconut.

Offline Victoria33

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2018, 06:46:39 pm »
  God forbid one aspect of life is untouched and unregulated by the federal Beast in D.C.And yet people wonder why it is that companies are moving their operations overseas.  I certainly would never start a business again in this country.
@INVAR

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Offline Applewood

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2018, 06:54:25 pm »
Unless you are a complete moron, you know that soy, almond, rice, coconut and hemp milks are not the same as cow's or goat's milk.  So what's the problem? 

I'm going to guess lobbyists in the dairy industry slipped the FDA a suitcase full of large denomination bills to enforce this crackdown.  Even the article says the sale of dairy milk is slipping compared to the alternatives.  So it makes sense for the dairy industry to use a government agency to crack down on the competition.

Offline Meldrew

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2018, 07:33:10 pm »
FDA is charged with creating and enforcing "standards of identity".  While it's certainly possible that dairy interests leaned on the FDA for business purposes, they are not out of line with trying to enforce the standards they set. 

I'm no fan of regulations any more than anyone else here but take the lowly tomato as an example.  There's tomato juice, sauce, paste and of course, ketchup.  What's the difference?  Mostly, just the amount of water in it. But how pissed off would you be if your bottle labeled "ketchup" poured out on your fries like juice or your super-healthy tomato juice was undrinkable because it was actually tomato paste.  Standards of identity define how much water (among other things) can go into a given product so it can be properly labeled ketchup or juice or sauce and performs as expected at the point of use. 

You can argue that the standard for what's called "milk" should be changed to remove lactation exclusivity but in an environment where we'll soon be eating "meat" grown in a lab I kinda like someone looking out for stuff like this. 

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2018, 07:49:28 pm »
Technically speaking, the liquid within a coconut is "coconut water".  Coconut milk is made from pulping the "meat" of the coconut.

"Coconut milk" is as clear as water, last I checked.  It has been a long, long time (I was 12), so it may have changed.
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Offline RoosGirl

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2018, 08:24:26 pm »
"Coconut milk" is as clear as water, last I checked.  It has been a long, long time (I was 12), so it may have changed.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coconut_milk


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coconut_water

Offline Suppressed

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2018, 08:29:53 pm »
"Coconut milk" is as clear as water, last I checked.  It has been a long, long time (I was 12), so it may have changed.

Nope.  It's milky white. 
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Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2018, 08:55:15 pm »
Nope.  It's milky white.

Well, it's been 48 years since I cracked open an actual coconut.  It was clear, but evolution can move fast. :shrug:
« Last Edit: July 19, 2018, 08:56:20 pm by Cyber Liberty »
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline RoosGirl

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2018, 09:21:00 pm »
Well, it's been 48 years since I cracked open an actual coconut.  It was clear, but evolution can move fast. :shrug:

Yeah, that liquid inside the coconut is mostly clear, but that's not the milk.

Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #14 on: July 19, 2018, 09:24:24 pm »
Yeah, that liquid inside the coconut is mostly clear, but that's not the milk.

The "milk" appears to be some sort of mechanically produced product, not generally available on Gilligan's Island.  I have a hard time believing that cute Mary Ann was lying to me...lol.
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Offline RoosGirl

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #15 on: July 19, 2018, 09:27:06 pm »
The "milk" appears to be some sort of mechanically produced product, not generally available on Gilligan's Island.  I have a hard time believing that cute Mary Ann was lying to me...lol.

The cute ones always get away with it.

Offline INVAR

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #16 on: July 19, 2018, 09:59:51 pm »
FDA is charged with creating and enforcing "standards of identity".  While it's certainly possible that dairy interests leaned on the FDA for business purposes, they are not out of line with trying to enforce the standards they set. 

I'm no fan of regulations any more than anyone else here but take the lowly tomato as an example.  There's tomato juice, sauce, paste and of course, ketchup.  What's the difference?  Mostly, just the amount of water in it. But how pissed off would you be if your bottle labeled "ketchup" poured out on your fries like juice or your super-healthy tomato juice was undrinkable because it was actually tomato paste.  Standards of identity define how much water (among other things) can go into a given product so it can be properly labeled ketchup or juice or sauce and performs as expected at the point of use. 

You can argue that the standard for what's called "milk" should be changed to remove lactation exclusivity but in an environment where we'll soon be eating "meat" grown in a lab I kinda like someone looking out for stuff like this.


I don't want Government doing anything except securing the damn borders and safeguarding opportunity while leaving us the hell alone.

Standards of Identity are simply Lawyers and Marketing companies colluding to try and make their products exclusive by using government to grant them monopoly on terms.  There are lots of food products like coconuts that are milky, because the term describes more than just a lactation product - it also identifies consistency.

We already have government regulations regarding labelling products 'Real Dairy' on the label.  We do not need them to regulate the term 'milk'.

As Applewood noted, this is just an effort by the Taxpayer Subsidized and government-protected dairy industry to stem alternate products cutting into their profits.  That is all.

Just another form of Fascism.

I don;t need nor want government regulating
Fart for freedom, fart for liberty and fart proudly.  - Benjamin Franklin

...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline RoosGirl

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #17 on: July 19, 2018, 10:33:12 pm »

I don't want Government doing anything except securing the damn borders and safeguarding opportunity while leaving us the hell alone.

Standards of Identity are simply Lawyers and Marketing companies colluding to try and make their products exclusive by using government to grant them monopoly on terms.  There are lots of food products like coconuts that are milky, because the term describes more than just a lactation product - it also identifies consistency.


How am I supposed to know that these don't produce real milk?



Offline Cyber Liberty

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #18 on: July 19, 2018, 11:13:26 pm »
The cute ones always get away with it.

If Ginger told me something I'd look it up to make sure.  She is a snake in the grass.  But if Mary Ann told me something I'd make book on it.
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
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Offline Meldrew

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #19 on: July 19, 2018, 11:44:27 pm »

I don't want Government doing anything except securing the damn borders and safeguarding opportunity while leaving us the hell alone.


If you're a dairy farmer and someone starts marketing chalk in water and calls it milk because it's white, wouldn't the enforcement of the "lactating" standard of identity be safeguarding your opportunity? 

Quote
We already have government regulations regarding labelling products 'Real Dairy' on the label.  We do not need them to regulate the term 'milk'.

So some regulation is OK?  Where's that line drawn? 

Offline KittenClaws

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2018, 11:58:19 pm »
I can agree with not using the term milk for soy and almond juice.

But I do not agree that the lactation production from mammary glands on mammals other than bovine cannot be called milk.




From Websters Dictionary:


1 a : a fluid secreted by the mammary glands of females for the nourishment of their young
b (1) : milk from an animal and especially a cow used as food by people (2) : a food product produced from seeds or fruit that resembles and is used similarly to cow's milk coconut milk soy milk
2 : a liquid resembling milk in appearance: such as
a : the latex of a plant
b : the contents of an unripe kernel of grain
3 : lactation cows in milk

I report...you decide

Offline INVAR

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #21 on: July 20, 2018, 12:13:06 am »
If you're a dairy farmer and someone starts marketing chalk in water and calls it milk because it's white, wouldn't the enforcement of the "lactating" standard of identity be safeguarding your opportunity? 

No. 

I do not trust the government to safeguard jack-shit except their own power, their gravy train of taxpayer money and lobbying revenue to feather their nests.

In an age of instant communications, revealing the fraud and snake oil garbage from charlatans is what the courts and social media are for.  Let the market decide.

Unless you do not trust the free market and think we need government to regulate the markets moreso than they already do.


So some regulation is OK?  Where's that line drawn?

No.  Government has proven it cannot be trusted with fairness or justice.  It simply picks winners and losers and punishes those they will help their contributors destroy - fascism.

Government destroyed any 'lines' - having proven themselves corrupt beyond redemption or trustworthiness.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2018, 12:14:49 am by INVAR »
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...Obsta principiis—Nip the shoots of arbitrary power in the bud, is the only maxim which can ever preserve the liberties of any people. When the people give way, their deceivers, betrayers and destroyers press upon them so fast that there is no resisting afterwards. The nature of the encroachment upon [the] American constitution is such, as to grow every day more and more encroaching. Like a cancer, it eats faster and faster every hour." - John Adams, February 6, 1775

Offline Wingnut

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #22 on: July 20, 2018, 01:25:57 am »
I like to get mine right from the source. 

I am just a Technicolor Dream Cat riding this kaleidoscope of life.

Offline Meldrew

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #23 on: July 20, 2018, 02:02:51 am »
@INVAR
Quote
Government destroyed any 'lines' - having proven themselves corrupt beyond redemption or trustworthiness.

Quote
In an age of instant communications, revealing the fraud and snake oil garbage from charlatans is what the courts and social media are for.  Let the market decide.

"The courts" are government aren't they?  If the government is corrupt beyond redemption, why involve them. 

Look, this is a pissin' in the wind thing - hardly a hill to die on.  This merely enforces previously unenforced existing food safety regs of identity standards.  It just says you can't call it "milk".  It can still be sold and the choices will still be available.  I don't see that as a bad thing particularly in light of this:

Quote
The big challenge is making meat that looks, feels and tastes like the real thing. Mosa Meat uses a small sample of cells taken from a live animal. Those cells are fed with nutrients so that they grow into strands of muscle tissue. The company claims it could make up to 80,000 quarter pounders from a single sample.

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/302564/

Is that beef?  I think not and I'd appreciate knowing that it's not quite the real thing before i get it home.   

I enjoy your posts INVAR - have a lovely evening. 

Offline KittenClaws

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Re: FDA plans to crack down on alternative "milk" products
« Reply #24 on: July 20, 2018, 02:17:56 am »
@INVAR
"The courts" are government aren't they?  If the government is corrupt beyond redemption, why involve them. 

Look, this is a pissin' in the wind thing - hardly a hill to die on.  This merely enforces previously unenforced existing food safety regs of identity standards.  It just says you can't call it "milk".  It can still be sold and the choices will still be available.  I don't see that as a bad thing particularly in light of this:

https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/302564/

Is that beef?  I think not and I'd appreciate knowing that it's not quite the real thing before i get it home.   

I enjoy your posts INVAR - have a lovely evening.

Genetic modification is a whole other issue.

The term "milk" is not exclusive to mamilian breast excretions according to definitions defined in various dictionaries.

If the "milk" or any other product has been genetically modified, that is another issue, and I believe it is one we have a right to know about..