Author Topic: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case  (Read 44237 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Frank Cannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26,097
  • Gender: Male
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #425 on: January 03, 2018, 10:35:56 pm »
really? If you owned a business renting rooms for parties/business/etc. and some Nazis wanted to use/rent your rooms for a rally, would you turn them down?

I'm in that business. You can't deny people access to renting a property that you would allow to others just over beliefs or skin color. About the only thing left that you can discriminate on is sex offenders and violent felons.

Offline goatprairie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,928
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #426 on: January 03, 2018, 10:39:32 pm »
I'm in that business. You can't deny people access to renting a property that you would allow to others just over beliefs or skin color. About the only thing left that you can discriminate on is sex offenders and violent felons.
I wouldn't rent or sell anything  for Nazi Party purposes. They can sue me.
I'm  not refusing to rent/sell just because the people are Nazis....I'm refusing to rent my space for Nazi Party purposes. Party rallies etc.

Offline truth_seeker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 28,386
  • Gender: Male
  • Common Sense Results Oriented Conservative Veteran
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #427 on: January 03, 2018, 10:42:15 pm »
Being gay isn't a race...and it certainly flies in the face of religion and religious teachings.

Not too long ago, mixed race unions were illegal in many states. Then they weren't

Same goes for same sex unions. Then they weren't.

"God must love the common man, he made so many of them.�  Abe Lincoln

Offline Frank Cannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26,097
  • Gender: Male
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #428 on: January 03, 2018, 10:45:30 pm »
I wouldn't rent or sell anything  for Nazi Party purposes. They can sue me.
I'm  not refusing to rent/sell just because the people are Nazis....I'm refusing to rent my space for Nazi Party purposes. Party rallies etc.

Good luck with getting sued. Even if you win you will be out thousands of dollars on the low side.

Offline txradioguy

  • Propaganda NCOIC
  • Cat Mod
  • *****
  • Posts: 23,534
  • Gender: Male
  • Rule #39
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #429 on: January 03, 2018, 10:47:35 pm »
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline goatprairie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8,928
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #430 on: January 03, 2018, 10:48:19 pm »
Good luck with getting sued. Even if you win you will be out thousands of dollars on the low side.
If I get known for turning down Nazis, I get the feeling I might make up for the financial penalties in other ways. Maybe not, I'm not in your business. But I'll take my lumps rather than rent anything for a Nazi function.

Offline Frank Cannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26,097
  • Gender: Male
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #431 on: January 03, 2018, 10:55:50 pm »
If I get known for turning down Nazis, I get the feeling I might make up for the financial penalties in other ways. Maybe not, I'm not in your business. But I'll take my lumps rather than rent anything for a Nazi function.

Making financial decisions that make you feel good and hoping for the best is a bad business model. I know plenty of guys living in a van down by the river now who tried it.

Bottom line: If you don't want to deal with human debris, don't start a career in a people related field.

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #432 on: January 03, 2018, 10:56:03 pm »
I wouldn't rent or sell anything  for Nazi Party purposes. They can sue me.
I'm  not refusing to rent/sell just because the people are Nazis....I'm refusing to rent my space for Nazi Party purposes. Party rallies etc.

If you’re in Oregon, the statute in question would not prevent discrimination based on political views, so you would be free to refuse to rent to Nazis for a party rally. 

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #433 on: January 03, 2018, 10:59:21 pm »
It’s amazing how many people are so afraid of the facts. Read the court’s opinion to find out exactly what the baker offered to the public: customized wedding cakes.
yes he did, but not EVERY type of customized wedding cake.

You and Jazz are riding a horse that won't go far in our legal system cause you cannot put on any brakes.

Still waiting to hear from you on whether BOLI acted within its authority to process this complaint.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 11:22:18 pm by IsailedawayfromFR »
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #434 on: January 03, 2018, 11:08:14 pm »
yes he did, but not EVERY type of customized wedding cake.

You are Jazz are riding a horse that won't go far in our legal system cause you cannot put on any brakes.

Still waiting to hear from you on whether BOLI acted within its authority to process this complaint.

:bigsilly:

You so desperately hate gay people.  What a shame; it’s not worth the effort.

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #435 on: January 03, 2018, 11:09:28 pm »
If such discrimination is actionable under Oregon law, then they’d be in violation for that as well.
wow.  You just confirmed to us all what a stupid, immoral and outrageous law you support.

Thanks for the heads up, counselor.
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #436 on: January 03, 2018, 11:13:46 pm »
@Jazzhead
Holding true to beliefs that have been around for 2000 years and were the law of the land here until a very short time ago is not extreme

Your bigotry is so tiresome
bravo.  It hurts them when they are outed.

These mostly lawyers arguing for legal remedies forget there are moral implications.
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #437 on: January 03, 2018, 11:19:43 pm »
If they have the money, and adequate reliable insurance that would cover all damage, sure.
Bingo.  He won the question on immorality.  You win, let's see, what did the Bible say, a trip somewhere.....
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #438 on: January 03, 2018, 11:20:20 pm »
yes he did, but not EVERY type of customized wedding cake.

You are Jazz are riding a horse that won't go far in our legal system cause you cannot put on any brakes.

Still waiting to hear from you on whether BOLI acted within its authority to process this complaint.

ORS 659A grants BOLI authority to deal with discrimination claims, including ones like this that fall under ORS 659A.403. So contrary to your uneducated assertion, BOLI does have authority to pursue these bakers for violating this law.

Offline Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 79,867
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #439 on: January 03, 2018, 11:22:53 pm »
:bigsilly:

You so desperately hate gay people.  What a shame; it’s not worth the effort.

There you go again....
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed:

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #440 on: January 03, 2018, 11:26:49 pm »
ORS 659A grants BOLI authority to deal with discrimination claims, including ones like this that fall under ORS 659A.403. So contrary to your uneducated assertion, BOLI does have authority to pursue these bakers for violating this law.
Ok, so you proved their mission state ment on their website is a lie.

I wonder where else they have lied?
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Offline IsailedawayfromFR

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 18,746
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #441 on: January 03, 2018, 11:28:16 pm »
:bigsilly:

You so desperately hate gay people.  What a shame; it’s not worth the effort.
I hate immorality as defined by God. 

I know what it is.
Do you?
No punishment, in my opinion, is too great, for the man who can build his greatness upon his country's ruin~  George Washington

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #442 on: January 03, 2018, 11:31:15 pm »
Ok, so you proved their mission state ment on their website is a lie.

I wonder where else they have lied?

Did they say that they did NOT investigate and prosecute discrimination in public accommodations?  If they didn’t, then they didn’t lie. 

Actually, I just checked it myself, and they say that part of their mission is to protect access to public accommodations free fron discrimination, so not only did they not lie, they expressly covered this case.

Offline HoustonSam

  • "That'll be the day......"
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,982
  • Gender: Male
  • old times there are not forgotten
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #443 on: January 03, 2018, 11:31:26 pm »
The conclusions are not indefensible.  You may not like them, the bakers may not like them, but the only options are lobbying for an exception, to permit religious-based discrimination, or else cease selling custom wedding cakes in Oregon.  It’s exactly the same as a real estate agent who is prohibited from red-lining blacks, or a construction company that doesn’t want to follow the building code.

Then defend them.  Explain to us why the state of Oregon can in fact compel an artist, musician, or editorialist to make a statement with which they disagree, just because those people get paid to make statements.

The bakers' situations are not at all like a real estate agent red-lining blacks, because the bakers were willing to do business with the homosexual couples, nor is it like a construction company not following building code, because there is no allegation the bakers were in violation of health regulations in preparing food.  Just because some regulation is reasonable and necessary does not mean all regulation is reasonable and necessary.

And you still haven't explained your own objections to the law.  Do you in fact have any?
James 1:20

Offline Frank Cannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 26,097
  • Gender: Male
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #444 on: January 03, 2018, 11:32:09 pm »
I hate immorality as defined by God. 

I know what it is.
Do you?

Double parking when there is a space half a block down.

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #445 on: January 03, 2018, 11:44:01 pm »
There you go again....

There is no other reasonable explanation for the blanket refusal to accept the obvious. 

Offline edpc

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 14,879
  • Gender: Male
  • Professional Misanthrope - Briefer and Boxer
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #446 on: January 03, 2018, 11:45:13 pm »
I hate immorality as defined by God. 

I know what it is.
Do you?


Getting drunked up and boffing your daughters after fleeing a wicked city?
I disagree.  Circle gets the square.

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #447 on: January 03, 2018, 11:47:51 pm »
Then defend them.  Explain to us why the state of Oregon can in fact compel an artist, musician, or editorialist to make a statement with which they disagree, just because those people get paid to make statements.

The bakers' situations are not at all like a real estate agent red-lining blacks, because the bakers were willing to do business with the homosexual couples, nor is it like a construction company not following building code, because there is no allegation the bakers were in violation of health regulations in preparing food.  Just because some regulation is reasonable and necessary does not mean all regulation is reasonable and necessary.

And you still haven't explained your own objections to the law.  Do you in fact have any?

It’s too bad that making a customized cake involves a measure of expression, but that is not enough to avoid intermediate scrutiny, under which the Oregon law is probably valid.  The situation is reasonably well explained in the court’s opinion, so I would recommend you read the opinion. 

In fact, as the court pointed out, it’s speculative whether anyone who saw the finished cake would even treat it as an expression by the baker, as opposed to expression by the couple as implemented through a cake baked by some anonymous third party. 

Oceander

  • Guest
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #448 on: January 03, 2018, 11:48:58 pm »
I hate immorality as defined by God. 

I know what it is.
Do you?

Give you a gun, and you’re no better than ISIS. 

Offline Cyber Liberty

  • Coffee! Donuts! Kittens!
  • Administrator
  • ******
  • Posts: 79,867
  • Gender: Male
  • 🌵🌵🌵
Re: Court rules against Oregon bakers in wedding-cake case
« Reply #449 on: January 03, 2018, 11:57:49 pm »
There is no other reasonable explanation for the blanket refusal to accept the obvious.

You say they hate people who are gay, they say they hate the sin.  Those two things are not the same.  This is why I'm tired of this thread, but still read it because it's a slow-motion train wreck.  That and it keeps coming up on my New replies to me page.

People don't hate the gay people.  They do dislike greatly being accused of it.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 11:59:36 pm by Cyber Liberty »
For unvaccinated, we are looking at a winter of severe illness and death — if you’re unvaccinated — for themselves, their families, and the hospitals they’ll soon overwhelm. Sloe Joe Biteme 12/16
I will NOT comply.
 
Castillo del Cyber Autonomous Zone ~~~~~>                          :dontfeed: