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Offline mystery-ak

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FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« on: December 14, 2017, 06:20:52 pm »
FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
by Melissa Quinn | Dec 14, 2017, 1:14 PM

The Federal Communications Commission voted Thursday to repeal net neutrality rules, over the objection of Democrats in Congress, Internet activists and online companies.

FCC Chairman Ajit Pai, Commissioner Michael O’Rielly, and Commissioner Brendan Carr, all Republicans, supported the proposed rollback of the Obama-era rules. Democratic Commissioners Mignon Clyburn and Jessica Rosenworcel opposed the change.

As Pai was reading his statement in support of the rules change, he abruptly recessed the meeting due to a security threat, and the room was evacuated. A bomb-sniffing dog was brought in, and the meeting reconvened several minutes later.

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http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/fcc-votes-to-kill-net-neutrality-rules/article/2643515
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Offline dfwgator

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2017, 06:24:01 pm »
Winning!

Offline aligncare

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2017, 07:02:02 pm »

The benefits of electing Trump continue to accrue. ^-^  :patriot:

Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2017, 07:05:51 pm »
This isn't a benefit and it isn't winning.
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Offline txradioguy

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2017, 07:07:04 pm »
This isn't a benefit and it isn't winning.

Because having the government make the internet "fair" is good because???
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Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2017, 07:12:04 pm »
Because having the government make the internet "fair" is good because???

For the same reasons having the government make roads open to everyone is a benefit to everyone.

The telecom companies do nothing for the consumer, their only interest is making money.   Not in a free market way but in a monopolistic way.

So if they don't like content they will now make it harder for people to see it.   Political, economic, religious views they don't like can be made to disappear.

Do you watch amazon or netflix?   Well now they'll be able to charge you more to connect to those services.  But their video streaming services won't be?

The list is endless but what we'll end up with is higher costs and lower levels of service. Not to mention the impact on access to non-PC information.
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Offline Free Vulcan

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2017, 07:13:33 pm »
My internet was fine from 1994-2015, so what benefit did NN offer? The supporters haven't made that argument very well.
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Offline txradioguy

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2017, 07:16:04 pm »
For the same reasons having the government make roads open to everyone is a benefit to everyone.

The telecom companies do nothing for the consumer, their only interest is making money.   Not in a free market way but in a monopolistic way.

So if they don't like content they will now make it harder for people to see it.   Political, economic, religious views they don't like can be made to disappear.

Do you watch amazon or netflix?   Well now they'll be able to charge you more to connect to those services.  But their video streaming services won't be?

The list is endless but what we'll end up with is higher costs and lower levels of service. Not to mention the impact on access to non-PC information.

So free enterprise is bad...gotcha.

What do you think will happen with the Federal Government acting as gatekeeper to the internet.

Nothing good.  Let your imagination run wild on that one...form slowing down speeds to red states to shutting off your service for criticizing a Lib President.

Ask the Chinese how they like having the Government big brothering their internet and cell phone service.

That's where we will be with the falsely named net "neutrality".
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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Offline dfwgator

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2017, 07:16:24 pm »
This isn't a benefit and it isn't winning.

You can bet if Net Neutrality was imposed during the Obama Administration, it was anything but.

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2017, 07:16:48 pm »
My internet was fine from 1994-2015, so what benefit did NN offer? The supporters haven't made that argument very well.

And they won't...just a bunch of scary might happen BS that is very anti-capitalism.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2017, 07:20:05 pm »
My internet was fine from 1994-2015, so what benefit did NN offer? The supporters haven't made that argument very well.

Because the internet was in its infancy from 94 thru about 2010 with the telco's not being able to figure out how to use it to make money beyond selling access.   The big companies are moving beyond that now.

The telco's are starting to figure it out which is why this is an issue now.  They want to control your access to information on the web.  They certainly aren't going to be fair about it.  Its been explained many times but its a complicated subject that few non-technical people can really understand.

The freedom of the internet will disappear and whats left will cost more.   Remember these are the same companies which have been providing the govt with all of your email, phone and web usage for the last decade.
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Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2017, 07:22:56 pm »
And they won't...just a bunch of scary might happen BS that is very anti-capitalism.

Anti capitilism?   you are so full of bovine feces

The big telcos aren't capitalists they want a monopoly.  They will screw their customers anyway they can and they know you don't have any real choice.  because all of the telco's run the same way.   Why does customer support suck?  because they like it that way, its called churn and as long as they only lose a few customers they are fine. 

They ship all of their jobs overseas and increase costs here.  Its about as anit-American as you can get.
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Offline jpsb

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2017, 07:24:29 pm »
For the same reasons having the government make roads open to everyone is a benefit to everyone.

The telecom companies do nothing for the consumer, their only interest is making money.   Not in a free market way but in a monopolistic way.

So if they don't like content they will now make it harder for people to see it.   Political, economic, religious views they don't like can be made to disappear.

Do you watch amazon or netflix?   Well now they'll be able to charge you more to connect to those services.  But their video streaming services won't be?

The list is endless but what we'll end up with is higher costs and lower levels of service. Not to mention the impact on access to non-PC information.

That is exactly how I see it too. Not winning and not a benefit.

Offline txradioguy

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2017, 07:30:37 pm »
Anti capitilism?   you are so full of bovine feces

The big telcos aren't capitalists they want a monopoly.  They will screw their customers anyway they can and they know you don't have any real choice.  because all of the telco's run the same way.   Why does customer support suck?  because they like it that way, its called churn and as long as they only lose a few customers they are fine. 

They ship all of their jobs overseas and increase costs here.  Its about as anit-American as you can get.

Remember back when ATT was the ONLY telephone company in the country?  Ma Bell ruled the land?

That's what this fake "neutrality" will take us back to...net neutrality prohibits internet service providers (such as Verizon and Comcast) from offering differentiated service to content providers (such as Google and Facebook) using their networks.

Innovation and technology advances have declined since Obama institutetd "neutrality" in 2015.

IF you want to impede technological advances in broadband and wireless services...cheerlead for this to remain the law of the land.

This same kind of Eurocratic control is why most people in Germany and other parts of Europe are still stuck with 6-12 mb/s DSL internet...the village I lived in I could only get on average 4 if I was lucky.  There is no incentive to provide inexpensive broadband FIOS or Cable internet to the masses in Europe because in places like Germany...the Government...by way of German Telcom owns it all.

And lastly:

Quote
It should be noted that elimination of neutrality rules will not leave the broadband marketplace unregulated. Rather, the marketplace for broadband will be regulated by the same rules that apply to most other parts of the economy: antitrust. The antitrust laws, while not perfect, can provide an important backstop should any anti-competitive practices take hold.

Americans should ignore the Chicken Little squawking of neutrality supporters. The real threat to the internet comes not from too little government interference in its management, but from too much.

http://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/debunking-the-lefts-myths-net-neutrality
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Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2017, 07:31:09 pm »
My internet was fine from 1994-2015, so what benefit did NN offer? The supporters haven't made that argument very well.

You found it to be fine, but then what would it have been like otherwise?

A related example.  One of M$'s many abuses of its near monopoly power was when it crushed Netscape by giving away (at a loss) it's own inferior browser, both to defend its near monopoly on the desktop from the threat of people supplanting the OS as their portal with a browser, and to expand into an area where it didn't have monopoly power.  Very bad things.  And how much better would we all be if no one ever "had" to use IE?
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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2017, 07:32:19 pm »
This is terrible. I'm going home to drown the kids in the bathtub. I don't want them to grow up in a world without this two year-old rule.
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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2017, 07:32:58 pm »
You found it to be fine, but then what would it have been like otherwise?

A related example.  One of M$'s many abuses of its near monopoly power was when it crushed Netscape by giving away (at a loss) it's own inferior browser, both to defend its near monopoly on the desktop from the threat of people supplanting the OS as their portal with a browser, and to expand into an area where it didn't have monopoly power.  Very bad things.  And how much better would we all be if no one ever "had" to use IE?

And yet Firefox...Opera...Safari...Chrome...Opera and a couple of other web browsers are freely available and have strong followings.
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

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THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

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Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2017, 07:35:12 pm »
Remember back when ATT was the ONLY telephone company in the country?  Ma Bell ruled the land?

That's what this fake "neutrality" will take us back to...net neutrality prohibits internet service providers (such as Verizon and Comcast) from offering differentiated service to content providers (such as Google and Facebook) using their networks.

Innovation and technology advances have declined since Obama institutetd "neutrality" in 2015.

IF you want to impede technological advances in broadband and wireless services...cheerlead for this to remain the law of the land.

This same kind of Eurocratic control is why most people in Germany and other parts of Europe are still stuck with 6-12 mb/s DSL internet...the village I lived in I could only get on average 4 if I was lucky.  There is no incentive to provide inexpensive broadband FIOS or Cable internet to the masses in Europe because in places like Germany...the Government...by way of German Telcom owns it all.

And lastly:

http://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/debunking-the-lefts-myths-net-neutrality

Who writes the regulations?    The big telco's, they have an incredibly incestuous relationship with govt regulators.   I know because I used to work in telco and helped write some of them.

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2017, 07:40:15 pm »
Who writes the regulations?    The big telco's, they have an incredibly incestuous relationship with govt regulators.   I know because I used to work in telco and helped write some of them.

And so do oil companies and agriculture...and tobacco companies...and whacko left wing environmental groups and hospitals and lawyers and auto manufacturers and drug companies and airplane manufacturers and airlines and....

Your point?
The libs/dems of today are the Quislings of former years. The cowards who would vote a fraud into office in exchange for handouts from the devil.

Here lies in honored glory an American soldier, known but to God

THE ESTABLISHMENT IS THE PROBLEM...NOT THE SOLUTION

Republicans Don't Need A Back Bench...They Need a BACKBONE!

Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2017, 07:45:06 pm »
Remember back when ATT was the ONLY telephone company in the country?  Ma Bell ruled the land?

That's what this fake "neutrality" will take us back to...net neutrality prohibits internet service providers (such as Verizon and Comcast) from offering differentiated service to content providers (such as Google and Facebook) using their networks.

Innovation and technology advances have declined since Obama institutetd "neutrality" in 2015.

IF you want to impede technological advances in broadband and wireless services...cheerlead for this to remain the law of the land.

This same kind of Eurocratic control is why most people in Germany and other parts of Europe are still stuck with 6-12 mb/s DSL internet...the village I lived in I could only get on average 4 if I was lucky.  There is no incentive to provide inexpensive broadband FIOS or Cable internet to the masses in Europe because in places like Germany...the Government...by way of German Telcom owns it all.

And lastly:

http://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/debunking-the-lefts-myths-net-neutrality

Ma Bell was exactly what I was going to bring up in a reply to one of your other posts.  When I was a kid, it was the only game in town.  Okay, that's acceptable, while I'd prefer a free market with competition, it's just not practical due to running phone lines all over the place.  In some cases, we have to accept -- and regulate -- monopolies so that they play fair and don't try to abuse their power.  We have to chain them down to protect capitalism.

Also when I was a kid, Ma Bell wouldn't allow you to hook up your own equipment.  They owned all phones and you rented them.   They abused their necessary monopoly power to exert monopoly power into an area where there was no reason not to have a free market.  Fortunately, they were overruled and competition arose.  That's how I see net neutrality (in theory, IANAL and I haven't read the actual bill, I'm sure it's not pure), protection for the free market, wherever possible, from monopolies.
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Offline InHeavenThereIsNoBeer

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #20 on: December 14, 2017, 07:48:20 pm »
And yet Firefox...Opera...Safari...Chrome...Opera and a couple of other web browsers are freely available and have strong followings.

Yes, firefox (aka mozilla aka netscape) survived, though the company didn't really.  Just because an abuse of power fails to crush the competition.  Netscape was THE browser before M$ crushed it using tactics it should have been brought to justice for.
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Offline Weird Tolkienish Figure

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #21 on: December 14, 2017, 07:55:55 pm »
This is a mistake IMO. They should have just left this be.

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2017, 07:59:18 pm »
This is a mistake IMO. They should have just left this be.

The point of Net Neutrality was that everyone was the same. I work for a university. We have Internet II which is much faster.

IOW everyone was the same except for the government.
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Offline driftdiver

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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #23 on: December 14, 2017, 08:02:11 pm »
Yes, firefox (aka mozilla aka netscape) survived, though the company didn't really.  Just because an abuse of power fails to crush the competition.  Netscape was THE browser before M$ crushed it using tactics it should have been brought to justice for.

@InHeavenThereIsNoBeer
What they are doing is turning the internet over to companies that make Microsoft look generous and giving.  The companies providing access will be competing with the companies trying to use the internet for business.  Which means it won't be a level playing field.
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Re: FCC votes to kill net neutrality rules
« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2017, 08:02:18 pm »
The point of Net Neutrality was that everyone was the same. I work for a university. We have Internet II which is much faster.

IOW everyone was the same except for the government.

Does internet II use tcp/ip?