I was fired from my internship for writing a proposal for a more flexible dress code

[Half Vast Conspiracy]

I was fired from my internship for writing a proposal for a more flexible dress code
by Alison Green on June 28, 2016

A reader writes:

I was able to get a summer internship at a company that does work in the industry I want to work in after I graduate. Even though the division I was hired to work in doesn’t deal with clients or customers, there still was a very strict dress code. I felt the dress code was overly strict but I wasn’t going to say anything, until I noticed one of the workers always wore flat shoes that were made from a fabric other than leather, or running shoes, even though both of these things were contrary to the dress code.

I spoke with my manager about being allowed some leeway under the dress code and was told this was not possible, despite the other person being allowed to do it. I soon found out that many of the other interns felt the same way, and the ones who asked their managers about it were told the same thing as me. We decided to write a proposal stating why we should be allowed someone leeway under the dress code. We accompanied the proposal with a petition, signed by all of the interns (except for one who declined to sign it) and gave it to our managers to consider. Our proposal requested that we also be allowed to wear running shoes and non leather flats, as well as sandals (not flip-flops though) and other non-dress shoes that would fit under a more business casual dress code. It was mostly about the footwear, but we also incorporated a request that we not have to wear suits and/or blazers in favor of a more casual, but still professional dress code.

The next day, all of us who signed the petition were called into a meeting where we thought our proposal would be discussed. Instead, we were informed that due to our “unprofessional” behavior, we were being let go from our internships. We were told to hand in our ID badges and to gather our things and leave the property ASAP.


Read more:  http://www.askamanager.org/2016/06/i-was-fired-from-my-internship-for-writing-a-proposal-for-a-more-flexible-dress-code.html

[Half Vast Conspiracy]

Please take a look at the comments under the article.

My take?  When you are an intern (paid or otherwise), you are in a learning position.  You can't learn when you think you are teaching.

[EC]

Same. Dress code is dress code, and puppies don't get to alter it. 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

Special snowflake got fired for whining. Why do millennials feel so entitled? I'll never understand that.

[Half Vast Conspiracy]

Special snowflake got fired for whining. Why do millennials feel so entitled? I'll never understand that.

Whining in writing, no less.

[Cyber Liberty]

Whining in writing, no less.

The intern writing this should have been sacked for the grammar.

[Bunny Watson]

"I weep for you, the Walrus said. I deeply sympathize..." 

[sinkspur]

Fired for questioning a dress code?  Sure, the company can do it, but I'd love to know who these aholes are.

Dress codes are silly except for a very few professions.  They make NO SENSE for non-client facing jobs.

I worked for IBM for 20 years and nobody was happier to get out of those monkey suits.

[Bunny Watson]

Fired for questioning a dress code?  Sure, the company can do it, but I'd love to know who these aholes are.

Dress codes are silly except for a very few professions.  They make NO SENSE for non-client facing jobs.

I worked for IBM for 20 years and nobody was happier to get out of those monkey suits.

Probably it's more like she was fired for pretending that she could go all SJW on her manager with a petition from the other interns in the office. A manager is asking for big trouble if he caves to a petition from a bunch of interns as if he were a college dean.

[geronl]

Interns who think they are CEO's should find a new place to dwell.

[geronl]

Fired for questioning a dress code?  Sure, the company can do it, but I'd love to know who these aholes are.

Dress codes are silly except for a very few professions.  They make NO SENSE for non-client facing jobs.

dress codes are fine if not overly strict. There is nothing wrong with wanting employees to look like grown ups.

[Free Vulcan]

On one hand, she tried to go SJW and it backfired. She had no leverage but tried to demand fairness. Her self-righteous presumptiousness got her fired.

OTOH, her first clue should have been the inconsistent enforcement of the code, that things weren't fair and she might be dealing with some good old boy a-hole culture. Best to keep your mouth shut about something so small and ultimately work at another company. Sometimes the battle isn't worth the 'victory' if you actually win it.

[driftdiver]

Fired for questioning a dress code?  Sure, the company can do it, but I'd love to know who these aholes are.

Dress codes are silly except for a very few professions.  They make NO SENSE for non-client facing jobs.

I worked for IBM for 20 years and nobody was happier to get out of those monkey suits.

How people dress has a significant impact on how they think.  If you don't like the dress code find a different job.

[Cyber Liberty]

dress codes are fine if not overly strict. There is nothing wrong with wanting employees to look like grown ups.

They refused to act like grownups, which is why they got the sack.  I'd have fired them too.  An intern is not an employee, the rules are different.

[Cyber Liberty]

Fired for questioning a dress code?  Sure, the company can do it, but I'd love to know who these aholes are.

Dress codes are silly except for a very few professions.  They make NO SENSE for non-client facing jobs.

I worked for IBM for 20 years and nobody was happier to get out of those monkey suits.

Ordinarily I would agree with that, but these were interns who thought they could band together and bully their boss.  Let's hope they learnt the right lesson, shall we?  The OP suggested we read the comments, and I reiterate that.  They are great, and well reasoned, many from managers who have real-life experience managing people.

[bolobaby]

The company was right to fire these interns, imo.

As an IT executive, the LAST thing I want is some interns coming into my workplace and rabble-rousing, even if it's about dress code. If I succumb to their demands, what does that say to my FTEs? "My interns are more important than you?" Or worse, "I gave into my interns' demands, so now - to show you have better standing - I must give in to any of your demands if you band together and sign a petition."

What about not giving into their demands? Well, then they will sit in your office all summer long and are little poison pills, griping about your "inflexibility" after they presented such a "compelling argument." The whisper campaign they would start would erode your ability to lead. It's simply not worth the effort to try and turn it into something positives *for interns*.

(You have to understand: interns are often just a burden. You have to show them how to do everything. Sure, you get to offload some crappy work on them, but you usually just get crappy results. It's not worth the effort to politic with them.)

So, kudos to the manager who ousted this lot. I hoped the interns learned something important in the process.

[Bunny Watson]

On one hand, she tried to go SJW and it backfired. She had no leverage but tried to demand fairness.

OTOH, her first clue should have been the inconsistent enforcement of the code, that things weren't fair and she might be dealing with some good old boy a-hole culture. Best to keep your mouth shut about something so small and ultimately work at another company. Sometimes the battle isn't worth the 'victory' if you actually win it.

The inconsistency was pointed out when they were fired. The one person who wore different shoes not to code lost a leg in the war. Doh.

[Cyber Liberty]

The company was right to fire these interns, imo.

As an IT executive, the LAST thing I want is some interns coming into my workplace and rabble-rousing, even if it's about dress code. If I succumb to their demands, what does that say to my FTEs? "My interns are more important than you?" Or worse, "I gave into my interns' demands, so now - to show you have better standing - I must give in to any of your demands if you band together and sign a petition."

What about not giving into their demands? Well, then they will sit in your office all summer long and are little poison pills, griping about your "inflexibility" after they presented such a "compelling argument." The whisper campaign they would start would erode your ability to lead. It's simply not worth the effort to try and turn it into something positives *for interns*.

(You have to understand: interns are often just a burden. You have to show them how to do everything. Sure, you get to offload some crappy work on them, but you usually just get crappy results. It's not worth the effort to politic with them.)

So, kudos to the manager who ousted this lot. I hoped the interns learned something important in the process.

  :thumbsup2:

[sinkspur]

How people dress has a significant impact on how they think.  If you don't like the dress code find a different job.

Yes it does.  I made more money and was much more productive when I went to work for a company that didn't care how you dressed.  IBM would never let me have a standing desk, which I prefer.  The new company?  If you buy it, you can have it.

The reason so many of these entrepreneurial companies do so well is they focus on the right things and let what doesn't matter go.

[Cyber Liberty]

On one hand, she tried to go SJW and it backfired. She had no leverage but tried to demand fairness. Her self-righteous presumptiousness got her fired.

OTOH, her first clue should have been the inconsistent enforcement of the code, that things weren't fair and she might be dealing with some good old boy a-hole culture. Best to keep your mouth shut about something so small and ultimately work at another company. Sometimes the battle isn't worth the 'victory' if you actually win it.

There was exactly ONE inconsistency in the code.  Nope, the manager was spot on with his response.

[Chieftain]

Please take a look at the comments under the article.

My take?  When you are an intern (paid or otherwise), you are in a learning position.  You can't learn when you think you are teaching.

BINGO!  An intern is there to learn how to work & follow instructions.  An internship is supposed to be your debut in the industry you have chosen to study.  Leading what amounts to a minor mutiny among the interns deserves exactly the reaction received.  Proportional to the offense and perfectly justified.  Buncha brainless lemmings following the leader right off the cliff.

Unfortunately this kind of thinking is not uncommon among millennials who are not accustomed to taking instruction or feedback for anything.  This is the result of letting children raise themselves without ever being taught any consequences for their actions. 

This Special Snowflake should be cast in amber and stood up as an excellent bad example of how to kick off your professional career.

 

[Cyber Liberty]

Yes it does.  I made more money and was much more productive when I went to work for a company that didn't care how you dressed.  IBM would never let me have a standing desk, which I prefer.  The new company?  If you buy it, you can have it.

The reason so many of these entrepreneurial companies do so well is they focus on the right things and let what doesn't matter go.

This isn't a story about the relative advantages/disadvantages of a dress code (and probably wasn't the full reason this person got sacked).  It's about the attitude that you can bully your manager into making adjustments to rules by using college kid tactics.

That said, I personally agree with what you wrote here.  My experience is the same as yours. 

[Half Vast Conspiracy]

...that things weren't fair and she might be dealing with some good old boy a-hole culture...

@Free Vulcan

You probably ought to read the article.

[bolobaby]

Yes it does.  I made more money and was much more productive when I went to work for a company that didn't care how you dressed.  IBM would never let me have a standing desk, which I prefer.  The new company?  If you buy it, you can have it.

The reason so many of these entrepreneurial companies do so well is they focus on the right things and let what doesn't matter go.

So, bear in mind a couple of important facts:

1. You are right. Casual dress is actually better for productivity. I like casual dress codes, too, BUT... see my response above about rabble-rousing.

2. (And this is the most important) These interns are idiots. The manager they complained to may have had little control over the dress code for the company. That's typically set by the CEO, HR, and the Operations Team. So these morons were probably barking up the wrong tree. (I'm making an assumption here, but if they were barking up the RIGHT tree, then see my earlier response about rabble-rousing.)

[SirLinksALot]

SOURCE: PJ MEDIA

URL: https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/06/29/spoiled-college-grad-demands-new-dress-code-at-job-gets-the-boot/

By Tom Knighton


College kids have a pretty easy time getting their way on campus. Just make enough of a stink and the universities cave.

Unfortunately, these students eventually reach a little place called the real world, where things aren't so forgiving. One recently wrote in to an advice columnist because the antics he'd gotten away with elsewhere suddenly didn't work.

You see, Junior was at his internship, and he wanted the company to have a more lax dress code. Plus, they noticed one of the regular staff wearing shoes that weren't in line with the standard dress code, and that just wasn't right. So, this individual got together with his fellow interns and wrote up a proposal for an alternate dress code (hmm ... ) accompanied with a petition (whoops!) and sent it on.

Hilarity ensued:

   

The next day, all of us who signed the petition were called into a meeting where we thought our proposal would be discussed. Instead, we were informed that due to our “unprofessional” behavior, we were being let go from our internships. We were told to hand in our ID badges and to gather our things and leave the property ASAP.

    We were shocked. The proposal was written professionally like examples I have learned about in school, and our arguments were thought out and well-reasoned. We weren’t even given a chance to discuss it. The worst part is that just before the meeting ended, one of the managers told us that the worker who was allowed to disobey the dress code was a former soldier who lost her leg and was therefore given permission to wear whatever kind of shoes she could walk in. You can’t even tell, and if we had known about this we would have factored it into our argument.

The reality is that colleges -- the educational institutions that are theoretically supposed to prepare these kids for the real world -- did these students a disservice by treating every petition or pet cause as valid, allowing the inmates to run the asylum. When the students hit the real world, WHAM!

That's what happened here. Junior decided the interns should dictate -- and make no mistake, a petition is indicative of a desire to dictate -- how the company's dress code should work. After all, they'd learned to pressure authority this way in college, right?

What Junior and his cohorts found was that they weren't in-demand assets to the corporate structure. They were a-dime-a-dozen, snot-nosed kids who had little to offer yet. The company was doing them a favor by offering them an internship, and they spit all over it.

Welcome to the real world, kid. Get used to it.