Author Topic: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party  (Read 4891 times)

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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2014, 09:12:00 pm »
That's the first time that I've heard that.

Can you give me some links and background?

I tried Googling a decrease in potential voters in 2012 and got nothing.

according to http://bipartisanpolicy.org/library/report/2012-voter-turnout

Quote
Despite an increase of over eight million citizens in the eligible population, turnout declined from 131 million voters in 2008 to an estimated 126 million voters in 2012 when all ballots are tallied. Some 93 million eligible citizens did not vote.

They are saying there were 8 million more eligible voters in 2012 over 2008

Offline EC

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2014, 09:21:10 pm »
They are saying there were 8 million more eligible voters in 2012 over 2008

And 6 million people less turned out. Can understand it - 2008 was history. 2012 was "same old story."
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2014, 09:30:57 pm »
according to http://bipartisanpolicy.org/library/report/2012-voter-turnout

They are saying there were 8 million more eligible voters in 2012 over 2008

"Voter turnout" and a decrease in "potential voters" as stated in evadR2's post are not anywhere near the same topic.
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Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2014, 09:36:27 pm »
I posted this sometime back on GBR. Let me find it.
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2014, 09:39:32 pm »
according to http://bipartisanpolicy.org/library/report/2012-voter-turnout

They are saying there were 8 million more eligible voters in 2012 over 2008

Eight million more eligible voters means 8 million more potential voters. 

That's not a decrease in potential voters. That's an increase in potential voters.
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Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #30 on: May 03, 2014, 09:42:43 pm »
I found post #108 and it doesn't have the link...I'll find it

Polls do not account for fraud.

The shrinkage of the voter age population from 2008 to 2012 is a mystery to me.

2008..Voting Age Pop=229,945,000..Turnout=131,407,000.
2012..Voting age pop=211,731,000..Turnout=121,745,000.

Why after decades of consistent increased voting age population did it decrease from 229,945,000 in 2008 to 211,731,000 in 2012????

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Offline evadR

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November 6, 2012, a day in infamy...the death of a republic as we know it.

Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #32 on: May 03, 2014, 09:49:07 pm »
I found post #108 and it doesn't have the link...I'll find it

Polls do not account for fraud.

The shrinkage of the voter age population from 2008 to 2012 is a mystery to me.

2008..Voting Age Pop=229,945,000..Turnout=131,407,000.
2012..Voting age pop=211,731,000..Turnout=121,745,000.

Why after decades of consistent increased voting age population did it decrease from 229,945,000 in 2008 to 211,731,000 in 2012????

The accelerating rate of deaths in baby boomers coupled with a five decade long drop in births is catching up to us.

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Online Bigun

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #33 on: May 03, 2014, 10:05:14 pm »
That's the first time that I've heard that.

Can you give me some links and background?

I tried Googling a decrease in potential voters in 2012 and got nothing.

I posted information here about all that some time back. Let me see if I can find it.

I do remember what I thought the cause was and will say it again here. Southern Baptists who would not vote for Obama and couldn't bring themselves to vote for Romney because of his religion.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #34 on: May 03, 2014, 10:11:34 pm »
I posted information here about all that some time back. Let me see if I can find it.

I do remember what I thought the cause was and will say it again here. Southern Baptists who would not vote for Obama and couldn't bring themselves to vote for Romney because of his religion.

I don't know if the term "Voting Age Population" makes a difference but it's the first time it has happened, according to the link I posted.
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #35 on: May 03, 2014, 10:20:20 pm »
And 6 million people less turned out. Can understand it - 2008 was history. 2012 was "same old story."

McCain and Romney got about the same number of votes. 60.6 million for Romney and McCain got 59.9 million votes.  Obama lost 6 million but they didn't vote GOP.  They just didn't vote.

Online Bigun

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #36 on: May 03, 2014, 10:22:28 pm »
That's the first time that I've heard that.

Can you give me some links and background?

I tried Googling a decrease in potential voters in 2012 and got nothing.

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,88131.msg350455.html#msg350455

http://www.gopbriefingroom.com/index.php/topic,88504.msg354092.html#msg354092

Follow the thread from there.
"I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo.

"So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us."
- J. R. R. Tolkien

Offline EC

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #37 on: May 03, 2014, 10:26:17 pm »
McCain and Romney got about the same number of votes. 60.6 million for Romney and McCain got 59.9 million votes.  Obama lost 6 million but they didn't vote GOP.  They just didn't vote.

Good point. Now - how to turn those disaffected Obama voters into votes for our side?
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #38 on: May 04, 2014, 04:13:25 am »
I found post #108 and it doesn't have the link...I'll find it

Polls do not account for fraud.

The shrinkage of the voter age population from 2008 to 2012 is a mystery to me.

2008..Voting Age Pop=229,945,000..Turnout=131,407,000.
2012..Voting age pop=211,731,000..Turnout=121,745,000.

Why after decades of consistent increased voting age population did it decrease from 229,945,000 in 2008 to 211,731,000 in 2012????

In 1990, there were 4,179,000 live births in the US. Those babies turned 18 in 2008.

In 1994 there were 3,979,000 live births in the US. Those babies turned 18 in 2012.

Quote
U.S. deaths surpassed 2.5 million for the first time last year, reflecting the nation's growing and aging population.

The increase of about 45,000 more deaths than in 2010 was not surprising. The annual number of deaths has been generally rising for decades as the population has swelled.

"If you have an older population, of course you have more deaths," said Qian Cai, a University of Virginia demographer who studies population trends. "That doesn't mean the population is less healthy or less vital."

Before last year, the largest number of deaths was 2.47 million in 2008. The number of deaths can jump up or down from year to year, depending on whether there was a bad flu season or other factors.

Our population continues to increase as a result of immigration, but newly-arrived immigrants are not eligible voters.

In 2008, the death rate for baby boomers was one every 49.5 seconds. Today that death rate stands at one every 26.2 seconds. It will continue to speed up until the boomer population dwindles down to nearly nothing.

There are a whole lot of factors impacting our declining population that would address the changes in those eligible voter numbers way more efficiently and intelligently than massive voter fraud.

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Offline Carling

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #39 on: May 04, 2014, 04:54:52 am »
Real conservatives vote rat.

The most pure vote a real conservative can cast is for a pro-abortion/pro-Marxist Democrat, if the GOP candidate isn't a real conservative.   :silly:
« Last Edit: May 04, 2014, 04:55:44 am by Carling »
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #40 on: May 04, 2014, 05:55:14 am »
I found post #108 and it doesn't have the link...I'll find it

Polls do not account for fraud.

The shrinkage of the voter age population from 2008 to 2012 is a mystery to me.

2008..Voting Age Pop=229,945,000..Turnout=131,407,000.
2012..Voting age pop=211,731,000..Turnout=121,745,000.

Why after decades of consistent increased voting age population did it decrease from 229,945,000 in 2008 to 211,731,000 in 2012????

Your figures are incorrect:

Voting age population 2008 = 230,872,030 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2008G.html
Voting age population 2012 = 240,926,957 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2012G.html

It took me a while to find out, and I had almost decided that all my other research must have been it, when I realized that I had not considered the possibility of your numbers being wrong.

It looks like they were.
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Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #41 on: May 04, 2014, 06:00:09 am »
Your figures are incorrect:

Voting age population 2008 = 230,872,030 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2008G.html
Voting age population 2012 = 240,926,957 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2012G.html

It took me a while to find out, and I had almost decided that all my other research must have been it, when I realized that I had not considered the possibility of your numbers being wrong.

It looks like they were.
Thanks for the investigative work. 

Offline Formerly Once-Ler

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #42 on: May 04, 2014, 06:10:09 am »
The most pure vote a real conservative can cast is for a pro-abortion/pro-Marxist Democrat, if the GOP candidate isn't a real conservative.   :silly:
One of two candidates will win in 2016.  One is more evil, and one is less evil.  Pick your candidate.  It is a tough decision for real conservatives.

Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #43 on: May 04, 2014, 11:46:04 am »
Your figures are incorrect:

Voting age population 2008 = 230,872,030 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2008G.html
Voting age population 2012 = 240,926,957 http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2012G.html

It took me a while to find out, and I had almost decided that all my other research must have been it, when I realized that I had not considered the possibility of your numbers being wrong.

It looks like they were.

Did you look at the link? You're saying the info from that link is wrong? Wonder why the big difference?
If the wiki link has wrong information, I'd like to know.


Election   Voting Age Population (VAP)
(thousands)[1]   Turnout
(thousands)[1]    % Turnout of VAP[2][1]
1789         
1792         
1796         
1800         
1804         
1808         
1812         
1816         
1820         
1824         
1828         57.6%
1832         55.4%
1836         57.8%
1840         80.2%
1844         78.9%
1848         72.7%
1852         69.6%
1856         78.9%
1860         81.2%
1864         73.8%
1868         78.1%
1872         71.3%
1876         81.8%
1880         79.4%
1884         77.5%
1888         79.3%
1892         74.7%
1896         79.3%
1900         73.2%
1904         65.2%
1908         65.4%
1912         58.8%
1916         61.6%
1920         49.2%
1924         48.9%
1928         56.9%
1932   75,768   39,817   52.6%
1936   80,174   45,647   56.9%
1940   84,728   49,815   58.8%
1944   85,654   48,026   56.1%
1948   95,573   48,834   51.1%
1952   99,929   61,552   61.6%
1956   104,515   62,027   59.3%
1960   109,672   68,836   62.8%
1964   114,090   70,098   61.4%
1968   120,285   73,027   60.7%
1972   140,777   77,625   55.1%
1976   152,308   81,603   53.6%
1980   163,945   86,497   52.8%
1984   173,995   92,655   53.3%
1988   181,956   91,587   50.3%
1992   189,493   104,600   55.2%
1996   196,789   96,390   49.0%
2000   209,787   105,594   50.3%
2004   219,553   122,349   55.7%
2008   229,945   131,407   57.1%
2012   211,731   121,745   57.5%
« Last Edit: May 04, 2014, 11:49:38 am by evadR² »
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Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #44 on: May 04, 2014, 11:57:09 am »
I guess we can just sum it up as bad information from Wikipedia but I have always considered them a fairly reasonable source.  And, since we're dealing with RATs and fraud in the 2012 election, I thought it very curious that the number of people of voting age had actually decreased from 2008.  Maybe that's why, it didn't happen.

Bad Wiki???
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Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #45 on: May 04, 2014, 12:04:53 pm »
I guess we can just sum it up as bad information from Wikipedia but I have always considered them a fairly reasonable source.  And, since we're dealing with RATs and fraud in the 2012 election, I thought it very curious that the number of people of voting age had actually decreased from 2008.  Maybe that's why, it didn't happen.

Bad Wiki???

And then we had this...

"McCain and Romney got about the same number of votes. 60.6 million for Romney and McCain got 59.9 million votes.  Obama lost 6 million but they didn't vote GOP.  They just didn't vote."

Let's assume these numbers are correct, and Romney got his ass spanked. And we're to believe it's because our people didn't bother to vote.
I don't buy it. People were itching to vote Obama out. Only one answer makes sense to me and it's what dims do best, FRAUD.
That one I'll buy.
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Offline evadR

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #46 on: May 04, 2014, 12:16:27 pm »
Actually, I thought Obama lost 8 million but with all these different numbers floating around, who knows.

My hypothesis: Republicans did vote and "something" happened to the voting process.
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #47 on: May 04, 2014, 02:30:03 pm »
Actually, I thought Obama lost 8 million but with all these different numbers floating around, who knows.

My hypothesis: Republicans did vote and "something" happened to the voting process.

You can choose to continue believing that there was fraud of that magnitude, but I don't believe it happened.

The other unlikely thing that you can choose to believe is that what voter fraud there is, is the only carried out by one Party. I'm not so naive to buy into the white hat/black hat notion of politics.

In fact, one of the most recent stories about voting irregularities happened in the very red State of Alabama.

http://blog.al.com/wire/2014/04/some_alabama_counties_have_mor.html

I suggest that you take time to read this:

http://ace.mu.nu/archives/334783.php

The Obama machine in 2008 had the "historic election" advantage, an innovative and very aggressive ground game and McCain as an opponent in their favor. In 2012 they had the same ground game and GOP voter apathy in their favor.

No voter fraud investigation has turned up any sign or evidence of massive voter fraud to the degree that would translate into millions of votes.

IF there has been voter fraud of the magnitude that you're suggesting, and the GOP isn't up in arms about it, it's because A) they're too stupid to figure it out, or B) complicit in the fraud. In either case then we, and the nation, are thoroughly, thoroughly screwed.
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Offline Luis Gonzalez

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #48 on: May 04, 2014, 02:40:57 pm »
Actually, I thought Obama lost 8 million but with all these different numbers floating around, who knows.

My hypothesis: Republicans did vote and "something" happened to the voting process.

Here's one more, very important thing to consider.

As the baby boomer death rate picks up the GOP loses likely GOP voters, as older voters tend to vote Republican. Young voters entering the ranks of eligible voters by turning 18, tend to vote Democrat.

THAT'S why the GOP keeps moving toward a less traditionally conservative platform. If they don't swell their ranks with younger voters, chances for national election victories diminish with every baby boomer death.

Years ago libertarianism was a joke. Today is running rampant throughout the country.

THAT is the consequence of the younger voters entering the political arena, and old farts like me being fed up with both traditional parties.

That is where the GOP needs to turn their attention to.
"Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, i have others." - Groucho Marx

Offline DCPatriot

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Re: The GOP Has Finally Found a Way to Defeat the Tea Party
« Reply #49 on: May 04, 2014, 02:55:11 pm »
Luis....Luis....Luis.

Sitting here in amazement that somebody with the wit and intellect you possess, can appear so naive.  Thought only women did that to us.  LOL!

In the digital world it's not inconceivable that machines can be rigged to the point that at regular patterns, votes can be assigned to another candidate.

There's no effing way 5 MILLION people stayed home in spite, having lived through sh*t for 4 years already.  NONE.

Any Christian Democrat or Republican can plainly see that Romney is the kind of man any boy would want to grow up to be....and any old man wished he had been.   Especially when held up to Barack Hussein Obama.

Might not have a degree in political science, but I have a Master's in common sense.   :patriot:
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